New here, "parent" of a PDD-NOS child. Little help

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FreefallGeek
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25 Nov 2010, 2:18 am

Hey folks! I'm new here, first post! :)

I've been dating my girlfriend for nearly three years now, and have basically been the acting "father-figure" of her 4 and a half year old. He was diagnosed about six months ago with PDD-NOS. He is the sweetest kid on the planet (biased, I know) and nothing in this world makes me as happy as him smiling at me, but it's often discouraging to not really be able to communicate with him. I had some specific questions I wanted to pose to the board, hopefully you can provide me with some guidance.

A little background about Nathan before I pose my questions. Firstly he is a very loving child, and doesn't display alot of the emotional detachment I've read about concerning the Spectrum. He seems to be able to read other people's emotions very well (i.e."Mommy's sad", "Mommy's sick") and he loves to hug and kiss people. He also has an incredible mind. He can memorize entire songs/commercials/etc after hearing them once or twice. He's got the entire Dish Network channel memorized, word for word. ;) He's got a great vocabulary, can count his numbers, recognizes letters, symbols (ATT, McDonalds, Subway.. Anytime he sees them he starts singing their associated jingles.. "It's not just good, it's Sonic!" or "Five dollar foot long!"). He's a terrific singer. He's also a computer whiz, able to pull up Youtube videos and games he likes at will (He'll even type the name of the Youtube videos he wants to watch.)

Some of the frustrating stuff, however, is his lack of communication skills. He understands the use of the word No (it's his default answer to everything) but doesn't seem to understand Yes. If you ask him a yes or no question, he'll just repeat it. The closest you'll get to an answer is if he adds the word "don't" to the sentence. If I say "Do you want tacos" its either "Do you want tacos" or "Dont want tacos". In addition to not being able to answer questions, it seems like all of his conversation phrases are drawn from a pool of things he's heard us say before. He can't tell you about his day, and seems like he cant construct his own sentences. Now every day when I ask him about school, he says "I had fun at school" because he heard one of us say it to him previously.

This lack of communication is especially frustrating when he can't communicate dire things. There have been many times when I took his crying to be a tantrum, only for him to get sick a few minutes later. I'd just like to be able to have my kid be able to communicate when he's feeling bad, or tell me what he did at school, things a neurotypical four year old should be capable of.

So now that I've covered (exhaustively, I know! sorry!) Nathan and his behavior, I'll pose my questions:

Is there any effective way to combat/reduce the echolalia?
Is there a reason why echolalia is common with people on the Spectrum (what purpose does it serve that so many people seem to do it)?
Is there any techniques/activities that could help him with his sentence construction or his ability to respond without the "canned phrases"?
He also flaps his hands anytime he's excited. This obviously isn't a problem, but I am curious. What specifically does "flapping" do for an autistic that makes it so common (i.e. does it feel good, etc)?
Any general hints/tips for making the communication barrier easier to surmount? I tried sign-language, which he uses jokingly, but ineffectively.

I appreciate those of you who took the time to read the rambling mess above, and look forward to hearing from you!



nostromo
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25 Nov 2010, 2:49 am

Hello Mr Freefallgeek, and welcome to wrongplanet. I am also the father of a 4yr old boy (with Autism).
As far as echoalia goes its my understanding that this is actually to be encouraged, it is in its way a form learning and by doing it they are grasping onto the words and the meaning in a way that encourages the use of language.
The flapping is called stimming as in something that is stimulating. It seems odd until you consider the actions of non autistic people having strong emotions, e.g. very excited people will jump and down or pump their fists up and down, or grief stricken people will rock back and forth.

OK, enough with my random musings, a much more knowledgeable member on here called Tracker wrote a guide to ASD it will probably answer your questions much better :lol:
http://www.asdstuff.com/grats.html



liloleme
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25 Nov 2010, 7:16 am

He sounds just like my daughter Maddy at age four other than the understanding of others feelings that is something she is just learning. She is now five and a half and the echolalia is basically gone but she still has some "scripting". Scripting is what your guy is doing when he repeats jingles, commercials, and things that he has heard you say or people in tv shows say (just in case you didnt know).
I understand that it can be frustrating when you are trying to talk to them but it is even more frustrating for them which is why they try to give you an answer....this is what the echo and the scripting is. Not all but a lot kids who do a lot of the echoing and scripting typically develop better communication later.
Make sure that he has lots of therapy. The TEACHH method works very well, it is what they used for my daughter. She had two and a half hours a day three days a week of in home therapy, a special Autism program at school, swimming lessons (which actually is very helpful in more ways than one), and a half hour each of additional speech and OT therapy at the children's hospital once a week.
If you can not access more therapy try looking up the TEACHH method and try applying that to the way speak and deal with him. If you dont have pec's cards you can get them in several places...even download them online and print them out. I had a laminator so the pictures were more durable. Most kids will respond to pictures far better than words. The thing that worked best with my daughter was when we asked her a question we would hold up the pec's cards for yes and no and she would point to one or the other, then she learned just to say the word. I also had a special pack of cards we took out in public....the most useful was the "wait" card LOL.
The Pecs cards can also help with when he hurts himself and doesnt know how to tell you where. My daughter broke her arm at school. The swelling was not that apparent at first and when she fell down she didnt cry. It wasnt until about an hour later that she began to cry and scream. The teachers did not know what was wrong (and this is an autism school and a really good one at that so dont feel bad that you cant figure it out). They called me and I didnt realize she was hurt until I tried to take her shirt off. She screamed in pain and I noticed the swelling in her elbow. I called the school and her teacher told me that she did fall on the play ground but she got back up and went back to playing. After that I got a picture of a girl so she could point to where she hurt.
As far as stimming goes it can be for many reasons. It can be a calming mechanism and/or a way to release energy or stress.
I have Asperger's and I stim so I can tell you from personal experience that this type of stimming does feel good :). My Psychiatrist explained to me that people with Autism do not have "filters" as most neurotypical people do so things bother us more like light, noise, unexpected changes to our routine, ect. This causes stress....however sometimes stimming can just be a release of excitement or energy.
Hope I helped....just keep trying "gently" to communicate, make sure you do not get upset or stressed because this will just complicate your efforts. He sounds like a fun little guy :). If you want to see my daughter you can look up her videos on Youtube they are under Autistic Princess or my youtube name Aspiemom42.



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25 Nov 2010, 10:09 am

echolalia is what i am doing right now. It is the only way i had to understand what streams of words actually go together in a meaningful way , for others to understand me.
As i grew older i was able to take the sentences apart and mix them. You will notice it yourself, a child who is able to say "i had fun at school today" and "that movie really sucked" will end up saying "school sucked today" , and get his message across , but there is also a problem with the "expression of emotions".
my son never ever told me what happened at school until the age of 7 or 8. he is going to turn 9 in december and now when i ask "how was school" i actually get a meaningful report....not long ago he would just say "nothing"or "i don't know"...
i guess what i mean is , encourage him and give him enough examples of meaningful answers to your questions. He will end up linking them. but asking how school was is vague. "school"took 8 hours. a lot of things hapenned, and it's hard to reduce into one sentence. imagine this question: "so, how was your childhood?" well, in one sentence? really? some parts were fantastic and others horrible. so you just answer "it was fine" because you're guessing that's the answer that's expected of you, but it's not accurate.
i'm not being clear i'm afraid. but i'm doing my best :P



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25 Nov 2010, 2:05 pm

This is one of the most useful things I have read about echolalia: http://momnos.blogspot.com/2006/03/dr-s ... ed-to.html


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25 Nov 2010, 5:21 pm

Hello, and welcome to wrong planet.

For starters, don't to worry about the echoing, it is a natural part of learning speech. If anything, it is a good sign because it means your child is getting closer to learning how to talk on his own. If it helps you to understand, I will try to explain in further detail.

Humans are not born knowing how to talk. After all, how many 3 month old babies do you know of who can talk? But that doesn't mean that babies don't think, because obviously they do. So, how is it that babies think? Well, mostly they think in terms of actions, and items. For example, they want to drink (action), and in order to do that, they need their mother (object) and a bottle (object 2). But they don't know to ask for their mother (object) to bring them (action) a bottle (object 2), so they just cry and see what happens. To put it simply, they don't know how to form sentences, and translate their thoughts into words effectively.

As the child grows older, he begins to learn phrases and words which he correlates with the thoughts in his head. For example, he usually hears the word 'drink' when he is being given a cup of juice or water. So he forms the connection that 'drink' goes along with the idea of water, thirst, cup, juice, etc. So the next time he is thirsty, or wants his cup, he will say 'drink'. As time goes on, through experience and observation, he learns that the phrase 'drink' does not mean cup, nor does it mean juice, but it actually refers to the action of consuming liquid. In this way, the child learns the meaning behind words, and gets to learn what 'sounds' correspond to what 'ideas'. As such, every single child with go through an echoing phase, usually between the ages of 1 year to 3 years.

The trick with your child is that he has a harder time figuring out which phrases and words mean what, mostly due to a natural difficulty with language. As such, he is having a harder time putting the words and their corresponding ideas together. As a result, your child takes longer to learn which phrase and which word means what, and as such the echoing continues at a later age then normal. There is nothing wrong with this, it is just a normal part of language accusation, which is occurring a bit later then usual. Given enough time, he will learn to figure out which words to use for which corresponding ideals, and then he will be able to communicate easier. But don't worry if it takes a bit longer then normal. Words are a tricky thing to learn, and him learning to use the tool of language late doesn't mean he will never learn.

If you want to help your child learn which words mean what, then you may want to tell him what to say, or give him examples. For instance, the next time your child motions that he wants a toy, try telling him 'You want this toy'. That will give him more exposure to learn which words mean what. Also, as suggested above, things like PECS can help to clear up the confusion caused by unclear phrase usage.

If you would like more information, then you might want to check out page 23 of this book here:
http://asdstuff.com/Strange%20Kid.pdf
I think I did a better job of explaining the difficulties, which may help you to understand the reasons behind the echoing.

Edit:
I just read through the article listed by the poster above me, and it seems to be a fairly accurate description that explains the stages of language accusation. The only thing I would say is that the 'spontaneous' language that seems to develop at the end isn't truly spontaneous. It is actually a combination of LOTS and LOTS of scripts with some 'semi-spontaneous' transitional statements thrown in to make it all go together. It is a somewhat convoluted system that is hard to explain, but it works well if you know what your doing. The important thing to remember is to just be patient. Your child doesn't like being misunderstood any more then you like misunderstanding him. Give him enough time and his communication will improve, whether or not you do anything special to help.


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FreefallGeek
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25 Nov 2010, 11:21 pm

Ah! Thanks for the information, I've been delving through the various links you all posted above and some of them are quite extensive and very educational. I appreciate the help! Happy Thanksgiving to all of you. :)



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29 Nov 2010, 7:27 am

I find it helpful to be told that a question is coming before it is asked.

Something like, "In a few minutes I will ask if you want tacos or spaghetti for supper, take a moment and have a think about that," can be particularly nice.

It's possible that you can teach him to respond to yes or no questions with a formula answer much like he's using now, but grammatically correct: "I would like tacos," or "I do not want tacos," and I can understand why that might be easier for him than the simple "yes," or "no."

Sometimes I will respond to a question in a way that makes no sense, because I know I've got to answer or be in trouble, but I don't have enough time to parse the question and arrange the answer before the questioners questioning behavior escalates.

(If you want to see me spaz out, just touch me and ask a question at the same time. I will be so overloaded my vision gets jumbled, so not only will I say something utterly irrelevant, I'll be functionally blind while I do it, and I'll twitch.)



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29 Nov 2010, 11:36 am

My son is 5.5, and I had to teach him what "yes" really meant. To do this, I would get something that I knew he really liked (ice cream) I would let him eat it, and then I would say "Do you like ice cream?" and then I would shake my head up and down and say "YES" you like ice cream!" I did this for awhile, and I think it worked because he finally started answering yes to things.

Also, my son did a lot of echolalia, and it has faded. As his speech improves, the echoing will fade. Just keep talking to him as much as you can, and I like the idea of telling him, "I am asking you a question now...." That seemed to work for my son too.

You sound like a wonderful guy to be so giving and understanding of your girlfriend and her darling son. I hope things work out well for all of you!