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Vexcalibur
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11 Dec 2011, 9:18 pm

"Atheists believe they are god". Have you heard that one before?

But, let's think about it. None of the atheists I heard of nor the ones I met actually believe they have control over natural forces or anything beyond what their human hands do.

However, I have met many theists both online and in person that ... believe in prayer. Isn't prayer just a belief that you are god?

Or rather a god of gods. If you believe in prayer, you believe that you can control god. Listen to yourself. You can control god? Really? Does not that make you the real god? The one that can coerce god to get things the way you want?

It is a very arrogant belief. You can cure disease, just pray for an hour. Earthquake in Tokio? Well just pray for some minutes and god will have it fixed. Texas needs more rain? Pray for a couple of minutes and god, your servant will make it rain. God will even do the most trivial things, if you want to win your football matches, you can pray and god will make you win all of them!


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cw10
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11 Dec 2011, 9:23 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
"Atheists believe they are god". Have you heard that one before?

But, let's think about it. None of the atheists I heard of nor the ones I met actually believe they have control over natural forces or anything beyond what their human hands do.

However, I have met many theists both online and in person that ... believe in prayer. Isn't prayer just a belief that you are god?

Or rather a god of gods. If you believe in prayer, you believe that you can control god. Listen to yourself. You can control god? Really? Does not that make you the real god? The one that can coerce god to get things the way you want?

It is a very arrogant belief. You can cure disease, just pray for an hour. Earthquake in Tokio? Well just pray for some minutes and god will have it fixed. Texas needs more rain? Pray for a couple of minutes and god, your servant will make it rain. God will even do the most trivial things, if you want to win your football matches, you can pray and god will make you win all of them!


Prayer is a form of meditation. And meditation has many beneficial properties.

Supernatural? Well I'm holding out on that one.



Vexcalibur
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11 Dec 2011, 9:24 pm

I think meditation might have the benefit of relaxing you. But then again so does masturbation.


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cw10
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11 Dec 2011, 9:25 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
I think meditation might have the benefit of relaxing you. But then again so does masturbation.


Well I can't disagree with that.

However, meditation uses less energy to produce this relaxation and that's more beneficial imo.



Vexcalibur
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11 Dec 2011, 9:30 pm

Depends on the person. I have learned the hard way that I can't meditate for s**t.

I can't shut up my mind, it makes me listen my breathing and then I try to regulate my breathing which means my mind is not shutting up. About that moment I notice that my neck is uncomfortable so I change positions. Darn, it is way too much stress. I also noticed that I can control whether masturbation consumes or gives energy. With it I can pretty much decide when I sleep. I can use it to remove my sleepyness for hours or to shut down the body and go to sleep instantly.

I mean, darn!


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cw10
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11 Dec 2011, 9:41 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
Depends on the person. I have learned the hard way that I can't meditate for sh**.

I can't shut up my mind, it makes me listen my breathing and then I try to regulate my breathing which means my mind is not shutting up. About that moment I notice that my neck is uncomfortable so I change positions. Darn, it is way too much stress. I also noticed that I can control whether masturbation consumes or gives energy. With it I can pretty much decide when I sleep. I can use it to remove my sleepyness for hours or to shut down the body and go to sleep instantly.


Learning how to silence you mind is probably one of the most important things anyone can learn. All that energy used for thinking suddenly is used to heal if you're injured in some way, or for well being in any case. It's not important to regulate your breathing, let your brain stem do the work, just let it happen. And don't worry about being uncomfortable, change positions, just don't think too terribly hard about it.

The best way I've found to silence my mind is to just consciously stop thinking. You'll notice all of a sudden you'll "hear" your body as it were, you'll become accutely aware of your heartbeat, breathing, circulation. It's actually very important do be able to do because it relaxes your nervous system also. Sometimes you have to tell yourself to "SHUT UP". It works for me.

Vexcalibur wrote:
I mean, darn!


:D



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11 Dec 2011, 9:45 pm

cw10 wrote:
Learning how to silence you mind is probably one of the most important things anyone can learn.
I won't deny it could be useful, but I just don't believe it is possible for me to do it. And since my life is all right the way it is I don't think I will try anymore.

Statements like "Let go" and don't worry about that, don't seem to work in my case.

I mean gosh, I didn't even have the patience to learn how to see 3d images. I still think this might be a hoax and a case of a emperor being naked that nobody wants to admit .

Image


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cw10
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11 Dec 2011, 9:50 pm

I've never been able to see jack in those pictures either.

But I have trouble determining a normal picture sometimes also.



Burnbridge
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11 Dec 2011, 9:53 pm

Yeah, vex, meditation ain't easy. If it was, you wouldn't have people trying their whole lives to find that silence.

the way a yogi friend of mine explained it: you have to work out all your demons before you can find the silence. She described going to this week long silent meditation retreat. no speaking for 7 days. They just meditated, ate, meditated, did a little light exercise, meditated and slept.

She said that one of the things that hit her was this intense memory from childhood, so intense that she started crying uncontrollably during the meditation. 2nd grade recess, she had wet her pants and the other kids were laughing at her. She had a "dude, seriously!?!" moment. She had completely forgotten it as a 29 yr old, but was still carrying the unresolved emotional burden.

But yeah, she said you need to bring all that out and accept it before you can silence it. that's why even the attempt at mind silence is so healing.

Me? I can shut the words out ok, but not the senses. I just start thinking nonstop with my nonverbals. Smalls, tonal sounds, touching, it all goes crazy hyper. So apparently I have more touch memory to work out than word memory, which makes sense as I had a violent childhood.

-

As to the original topic, no I don't think many people atheist or religious think they're god. The tendency for a person to think they know what their god wants utterly baffles me, though. If their god is infinite wisdom, no human mind or set of laws or scriptures could ever remotely encompass It's true purpose or wishes. I'm more fond of the religious who respect the "mysteries of god" over "the word of god." Much more respectful to their deity.


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Abgal64
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11 Dec 2011, 10:06 pm

I see origami cranes.


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VIDEODROME
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11 Dec 2011, 10:21 pm

I was raised Catholic and never understood what prayer was supposed to be. Maybe for some it's a natural group meditation experience but as a kid I just didn't get what it was all about.


Or more to the topic it's something I've heard many times from George Carlin. Someone prays and receives a favorable outcome. Their prayers have been answered.

Or they pray over the sick and they still die, so it was part of God's plan.

Or.... a very good holy man gets caught in an earthquake and a boulder falls on him. Then God "works in mysterious ways".



ruveyn
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12 Dec 2011, 2:36 am

Vexcalibur wrote:

Image


Darn you! I can't uncross my eyes now.

ruveyn



Burnbridge
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12 Dec 2011, 8:04 am

Sun and cranes and a mountain. That magic eye is a really good one.

ruveyn, you're s'posed to look through it, not cross your eyes. You're going to hurt your brain with that eye crossing, or (god forbid) someone might slap you on the back... D:


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cw10
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12 Dec 2011, 9:24 pm

Burnbridge wrote:
Sun and cranes and a mountain. That magic eye is a really good one.

ruveyn, you're s'posed to look through it, not cross your eyes. You're going to hurt your brain with that eye crossing, or (god forbid) someone might slap you on the back... D:


It still looks like a bag of weed to me. My damn Aspie brain can't get past looking at all the fine details.



Burnbridge
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12 Dec 2011, 11:21 pm

That's funny. My brain demands that I find the pattern in the mess.


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12 Dec 2011, 11:39 pm

Burnbridge wrote:
That's funny. My brain demands that I find the pattern in the mess.


http://life-with-aspergers.blogspot.com ... nkers.html


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