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03 Apr 2012, 9:35 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue, you were content to assert that most geniuses are men (which by definition is measured by IQ), yet as soon as you read that the smartest person in the world is female, you suddenly contend that IQ isn't the best measure for intelligence. you are alternately using and discounting the same evidence depending on whether it supports your assertions. interesting strategy, but wholly transparent.



Hyperlexian, I don't consider IQ to be the sole measure of intelligence TBH. As do many other cognitive scientists. But most of all, AFAIC: genius is as genius does. It's not enough to have an ultra high IQ to be genius. Furthermore, what has the "smartest" person in the world(with the highest IQ) actually accomplished?

Also, I noticed you didn't respond to my prior posts which addressed you claims about sex and birth control. Any particular reason?



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03 Apr 2012, 9:38 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue, you were content to assert that most geniuses are men (which by definition is measured by IQ), yet as soon as you read that the smartest person in the world is female, you suddenly contend that IQ isn't the best measure for intelligence. you are alternately using and discounting the same evidence depending on whether it supports your assertions. interesting strategy, but wholly transparent.



Hyperlexian, I don't consider IQ to be the sole measure of intelligence TBH. As do many other cognitive scientists. But most of all, AFAIC: genius is as genius does. It's not enough to have an ultra high IQ to be genius. Furthermore, what has the "smartest" person in the world(with the highest IQ) actually accomplished?

Also, I noticed you didn't respond to my prior posts which addressed you claims about sex and birth control. Any particular reason?


If you go back and look she did.



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03 Apr 2012, 9:52 pm

Joker wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
When one considers that for most of history women were not in a position to, encouraged to, or actively discouraged from, roles that men assumed were theirs alone; of course it will be mostly males on the big list of famous contributors. How advanced as a society we would be, in science and morality, had our history been one open to female contributions in all walks of life; the entire human species


That is a very good point but I am afriad like me you will get attacked by the we are men men is strong men hunt kill deer group on WP :lol:


I don't care, attacking me personally doesn't win their argument


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03 Apr 2012, 10:03 pm

myth wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
ValentineWiggin wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Meh I don't believe in feminism...I mean I think it served its purpose more or less but is unneeded. However I disagree with the notion that ones physical gender should determine which social 'role' they fill. I am opposed to gender stereotypes, though I do acknowledge biological/psychological differences between males and females...but that is not to say this should be grounds to limit anyone's rights or presurre them to fit a specific role based on their gender.


Bolded for hilarity.


A better approach might be to explain what issue you have with my statement, rather then trying to get people to laugh at me over something I don't even get. Seriously, just tell me whats wrong with my post.........I was not aware not agreeing with gender stereotypes was 'feminism' obviously something called feminism is going to have to do more with females than any other gender and that is what I have an issue with.

I believe her point here is that "feminism" is supposedly defined as "advocates of gender equality" so you saying that you disagree with gender roles would indeed make you a feminist. Allegedly.


I am not talking about gender equality in the sense of both gender should be the same as that probably wont happen, the genders are different.........they should have equal rights, but they are not equal in the technical sense because there are biological/psychological differences. I don't see how thinking people should not stick to gender stereotypes is feminism....if someone has an explanation I'd like to see it.


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03 Apr 2012, 10:06 pm

Vigilans wrote:
Joker wrote:
Vigilans wrote:
When one considers that for most of history women were not in a position to, encouraged to, or actively discouraged from, roles that men assumed were theirs alone; of course it will be mostly males on the big list of famous contributors. How advanced as a society we would be, in science and morality, had our history been one open to female contributions in all walks of life; the entire human species


That is a very good point but I am afriad like me you will get attacked by the we are men men is strong men hunt kill deer group on WP :lol:


I don't care, attacking me personally doesn't win their argument


Yeah true I am becoming more like that after all in regards to my faith I am completely secualr about it so no need to even bring it up when others feel a need to attack it or make comments about it cause I am still gonna have faith either way.



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03 Apr 2012, 10:17 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


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03 Apr 2012, 10:21 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue, you were content to assert that most geniuses are men (which by definition is measured by IQ), yet as soon as you read that the smartest person in the world is female, you suddenly contend that IQ isn't the best measure for intelligence. you are alternately using and discounting the same evidence depending on whether it supports your assertions. interesting strategy, but wholly transparent.



Hyperlexian, I don't consider IQ to be the sole measure of intelligence TBH. As do many other cognitive scientists. But most of all, AFAIC: genius is as genius does. It's not enough to have an ultra high IQ to be genius. Furthermore, what has the "smartest" person in the world(with the highest IQ) actually accomplished?

Also, I noticed you didn't respond to my prior posts which addressed you claims about sex and birth control. Any particular reason?

i don't consider IQ to be the sole measure of intelligence either. in fact, i use a whole spectrum of criteria when judging intelligence. when i use these criteria, men and women come out equal. fancy that.

i missed the earlier post as i was on my mobile.


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03 Apr 2012, 10:22 pm

Joker wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue, you were content to assert that most geniuses are men (which by definition is measured by IQ), yet as soon as you read that the smartest person in the world is female, you suddenly contend that IQ isn't the best measure for intelligence. you are alternately using and discounting the same evidence depending on whether it supports your assertions. interesting strategy, but wholly transparent.


Hyperlexian so totally rocks you go Girl gosh why was I not born a female being a guy is nice and all but we can't have babies :x

thank you!


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03 Apr 2012, 10:24 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
Joker wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue, you were content to assert that most geniuses are men (which by definition is measured by IQ), yet as soon as you read that the smartest person in the world is female, you suddenly contend that IQ isn't the best measure for intelligence. you are alternately using and discounting the same evidence depending on whether it supports your assertions. interesting strategy, but wholly transparent.


Hyperlexian so totally rocks you go Girl gosh why was I not born a female being a guy is nice and all but we can't have babies :x

thank you!


Your welcome you remind me of my mother if she was a Aspie like me.



03 Apr 2012, 10:27 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.



Lemme put it this way: If man gives informed consent to unprotected sexual intercourse with a woman, and she gets pregnant and refuses to get an abortion, then he most certainly IS legally and financially responsible for the child.

However, if a man consents to sexual intercourse with a woman and the woman lies to him by falsely claiming that she's using birth control, gets pregnant and decides herself to bear the child, than that is not informed consent. She is coercing him into becoming a father against his wishes. In such cases, I say that if she files for child support, her claim should be denied because she deceived the father into getting her pregnant without his knowledge or consent.

Thankfully, in the state of West Virginia, prenancy entrapment will result in being disqualified from receiving child support. I support this law and hopefully, other states will soon follow. :wink:



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03 Apr 2012, 10:28 pm

It is very irrelivant if the women lies cause the man is still taking a risk of getting her pregnant.



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03 Apr 2012, 10:29 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


Well then what are condoms and birth control for? sex does not = accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


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03 Apr 2012, 10:30 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


Well then what are condoms and birth control for? sex does not = accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


I man can wear a condom during sex with a female and still get her pregnant and also some times birth control will not work in rare cases it has happened befor.



03 Apr 2012, 10:31 pm

Joker wrote:
It is very irrelivant if the women lies cause the man is still taking a risk of getting her pregnant.



WRONG


If she consents to sexual intercourse, than her getting pregnant is as much her responsibility as it is his. And if she is deceitful about using birth control, than her responsibility increases to 100%.



You see folks, the downside of gender equality is that women are going to have to get used to being responsible for their actions and will no longer have the "blame men" option available to them. I for one, think this is a GOOD THING.



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03 Apr 2012, 10:33 pm

Joker wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


Well then what are condoms and birth control for? sex does not = accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


I man can wear a condom during sex with a female and still get her pregnant and also some times birth control will not work in rare cases it has happened befor.


Yeah I know, that is what the morning after pill is for........or worst case senerio an abortion, but certainly not in the late terms of pregnancy.


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03 Apr 2012, 10:34 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??

if you don't want babies, don't have sex. or get a vasectomy - that's fully within your control. there are no guarantees in this life. having sex means that you are accepting the responsibility of parenthood.


Well then what are condoms and birth control for? sex does not = accepting the responsibility of parenthood.

there is always a chance of pregnancy as no birth control is 100%. you can take 3 kinds of birth control at once and still get pregnant. so if you absolutely cannot abide with a pregnancy, abstinence is the only answer.

nobody should entrap anyone else and i am glad that there are safeguards for that. HOWEVER there isn't really "informed consent" when it comes to birth control... if you use the birth control and it accidentally fails, you're on the hook.


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