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CrazyCatLord
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17 Apr 2012, 3:43 am

roronoa79 wrote:
Studies show that some homophobes are gay or have gay tendencies.
Therefore, all homophobes are gay or have gay tendencies.

...is your logic.
Something evidently went very long in that extremely complex and intricate two-step process.


Not just some homophobes, but the vast majority of homophobes. According to this research (<-- link), the likelihood that a homophobic male person is a closet case is 80%.

Quote:
... the homophobic men showed a significant increase in penile circumference in response to the gay male porn: specifically, 26 percent of these homophobic men showed “moderate tumescence” (6-12 mm) to this video and 54 percent showed “definite tumescence” (more than 12 mm).


So perhaps we can all agree on the following statements: Homophobia is very likely the result of suppressed homosexual desires. Studies suggest that most homophobic people are closeted gays or bisexuals.



CrazyCatLord
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17 Apr 2012, 4:06 am

bizboy1 wrote:
"Ergo all homophobes are gay" sounds fallacious to me. How do you even define homophobe? Personally, I could be one one day and not another depending on my mood. In general, I don't mind gays. You're taking the position of a property being applied to a certain group of people and saying that applies to the whole group.


From the above-linked study:

Quote:
In this study, 64 self-reported straight males with a mean age of 20.3 years were divided into two groups (“non-homophobic men” and “homophobic men”) on the basis of their scores on a questionnaire measure of aversion to gay males. Here, homophobia was operationally defined as the degree of “dread” experienced when placed in close quarters with a homosexual—basically, how comfortable or uncomfortable the person was in interacting with gay people.


I think that's a pretty good definition. People are homophobic if they experience dread in the presence or at the thought of a gay person, which is solely caused by the knowledge that the person is gay.



Kraichgauer
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17 Apr 2012, 4:10 am

A friend, who had attended the Catholic Gonzaga University in Spokane, had told me how there was a priest and instructor who was vehemently homophobic in his lectures. He told me his gay friends on campus had said this priest was hung like a horse.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Grebels
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17 Apr 2012, 4:39 am

What are the implications of the statement, that Homophobes are gay. Is it that they might be frightened of actually being repressed homosexuals. That might be true in a few cases, but overall I don't buy it.



CrazyCatLord
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17 Apr 2012, 6:39 am

Grebels wrote:
What are the implications of the statement, that Homophobes are gay. Is it that they might be frightened of actually being repressed homosexuals. That might be true in a few cases, but overall I don't buy it.


More likely, they are frightened by the reaction of their peers and relatives. Imagine that you were a gay or bisexual teenager surrounded by peers who use the term gay as an insult and boast with their heterosexuality. Male kids are especially eager to do this. Anything that remotely reminds them of homosexuality or gender-ambiguity is immediately mocked, called gay, and made out to be something horrible and disgusting. Gay kids who want to fit in and be accepted (who doesn't) learn to go with the program, and fake both an interest in the opposite gender as well as greatly exaggerated disgust for all things homosexual. Ask any gay person; chances are that they went through this phase of denial and/or play-acting as an adolescent.

Now add orthodox Abrahamic religions to this picture, which teach kids long before they hit puberty that homosexual urges and behavior are a grave sin and a one-way ticket to hell. And let's not forget about parents who would be devastated if they found out that their offspring is gay. Their reaction doesn't even have to involve homophobia, it might simply be the dread that their child is somehow different from the norm and will never give them any grandchildren.

This social pressure and the contempt of gay people shown by peers, parents, priests, and large parts of society in general, can be so strong that it drives gay teenagers into suicide. Compared to that, the desperate attempt to conform to social and religious norms by denying one's sexuality (or one side of it) is an easier way out. Of course closeted gay or bi people who are trying to pass as "normal" need to constantly reaffirm and justify this difficult decision by telling themselves and others that they are doing the "right thing". Think of people like Ted Haggard, who did not only marry and had children, he also felt the need to rain down gay hatred and homophobia from the pulpit every Sunday. "If I can't have it, nobody can".



ArrantPariah
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17 Apr 2012, 8:19 am

Note, too, the visceral, defensive reaction of a few people who briefly entered the discussion.

"How dare you start a topic on the link between homophobia and repressed homosexuality! You should be banned from the internet!"

If someone really isn't interested in a topic, then all he has to do is ignore it and either participate in a different discussion that does interest him, or start his own topic.

One implication of the article is that it may become more difficult for people who don't want to be suspected of a repressed homosexual orientation to come out with overtly homophobic statements. Repressed homosexuals are going to be very confused about what to do.

Rick Perry and Frothy Santorum did play to homophobia among Repugnican voters, which must mean that they were keenly aware of a very large undercurrent of repressed homosexuality within the party.



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17 Apr 2012, 10:25 am

CrazyCatLord wrote:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=single-angry-straight-male


Thanks for the interesting article.



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17 Apr 2012, 10:43 am

I just want to know if I can be gay without being homosexual.

Quote:
1... b : keenly alive and exuberant :
having or inducing high spirits <a bird's gay spring song>.
2. a : bright, lively

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gay

Also, can a gay person have sombre sex? Or is it always "bright, lively"?
I mean, I have gay sex with my wife all the time, but it's heterosexual.

(Just a point about words. No offense intended.)


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ArrantPariah
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17 Apr 2012, 10:48 am

Ragtime wrote:
I just want to know if I can be gay without being homosexual.


Of course. You're right, as usual.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmv3WlKa6U8[/youtube]



Ragtime
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17 Apr 2012, 11:49 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
Ragtime wrote:
I just want to know if I can be gay without being homosexual.


Of course. You're right, as usual.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmv3WlKa6U8[/youtube]


:lol: That was a great scene. Oh, the frustration in Sandler's character...


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Kraichgauer
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17 Apr 2012, 2:41 pm

Ragtime wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Ragtime wrote:
I just want to know if I can be gay without being homosexual.


Of course. You're right, as usual.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmv3WlKa6U8[/youtube]


:lol: That was a great scene. Oh, the frustration in Sandler's character...


It's a sure sign of acting genius when a dramatic actor like Jack Nicholson can pull off comedy so perfectly.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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18 Apr 2012, 7:33 am

Thanks for your explanation CatLord. You may know that public expressions of homophobia are illegal here in the UK. So any expressions of disgust are silent, or people keep their opinions to themselves. We do have the UK eqivalent of rednecks who can be violent at times. They certainly don't get that from The Bible though. I don't understand homosexuality myself. I can sympathise because we can all be born with certain things, like Asperger's for example. Then I found out that somebody who had been close to me had been sexually abused as a child. She became a lesbian after two failed marriages. I have to wonder why people single out homosexuality and smoking as the great sins of our time.



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18 Apr 2012, 7:59 am

With smoking, it certainly isn't a repressed desire to take up smoking.

With homosexuality, it certainly is.



ArrantPariah
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18 Apr 2012, 10:03 am

AstroGeek wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
With smoking, it certainly isn't a repressed desire to take up smoking.

No, it is a desire to be able to breath without inhaling carcinogens.



...and to stay away from something that is noxious and stinky, as one might stay away from a skunk.

But, come to think of it, placing a phallic-shaped instrument into one's mouth and sucking in the hot fumes--that might be a manifestation of certain repressed desires.



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01 May 2012, 5:12 pm

Romney had to give the boot to another homosexual

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/open ... 51633.html



AdamAdam
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01 May 2012, 6:35 pm

Grebels wrote:
You may know that public expressions of homophobia are illegal here in the UK.

Not true. Hate speech etc is. Simply voicing homophobic views isn't. Plenty of religious leaders do it all the time.


Quote:
I don't understand homosexuality myself. I can sympathise because we can all be born with certain things, like Asperger's for example.

Not the same. Homosexuality isa difference. Aspergers, whether we like it or not, is a disability.

Quote:
Then I found out that somebody who had been close to me had been sexually abused as a child. She became a lesbian after two failed marriages.


:roll:

People do not "become" gay. Have you considered that maybe her marriages failed because she was gay, rather than the other way round?

And there is no evidence to suggest that gay people are gay because they were sexually abused as a child