congratulations Republicans on your elections .....

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LoveNotHate
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13 Nov 2014, 6:39 am

Sweetleaf wrote:

-And by poverty you mean 'black people' and probably other minorities correct?


No as was pointed out with racial integration in Detroit ...

In Milliken v. Bradley (1974), the dissenting Justice William Douglas observed, "The inner core of Detroit is now rather solidly black; and the blacks, we know, in many instances are likely to be poorer."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight

Sweetleaf wrote:
and by 'wealth' you mean 'white people' if I am understanding this correctly.


Yes, since those were the ones with wealth.

Sweetleaf wrote:
Also perhaps it is related to the situations the black people are in, or that people of minorities actually do have quite a few disadvantages some of them due to certain things that have occurred in history. Also if it was a 'wealth' filled area up until the black people came who is it that allowed them to move in and purchase property? :roll:


The courts forced integration, and slaves migrated to Detroit. The white people rioted against this integration, but ultimately "voted with their feet" by fleeing.

Sweetleaf wrote:
Also I am sure poor areas with a majority of white people are probably just as 'ghetto' as poor areas with a majority of black people or any other color of person. But you really think the color of skin people have determines the quality of person and that white people are just inherently better people and yet you aren't racist at all :roll:


No. However, I am not dumb enough to live in a future ghetto. So, I think "white flight" and "black flight" are justified.

Sweetleaf wrote:
-And now there is no such thing as black people with graduate degrees.....lol and why the hell would educated college graduates want to move to such a racist place?


They will be given citizenship if they move there, yes, otherwise, of course, they would not live there. Well, there hundreds of thousands of black people in Detroit, yet, the planned solution is to bring in people outside the country.

Sweetleaf wrote:
This is all a load of garbage not sure why I bothered acknowledging it with a response really.


This is your typical response. What is garbage? The physical existence of ghettos? The creation of ghettos? The governor's plan (easy to find on google)? Or what you say because you don't know anything ?



Last edited by LoveNotHate on 13 Nov 2014, 6:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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13 Nov 2014, 6:48 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
-And now there is no such thing as black people with graduate degrees.....lol and why the hell would educated college graduates want to move to such a racist place?


They will be given citizenship if they move there, yes, otherwise, of course, they would not live there. Well, there hundreds of thousands of black people in Detroit, yet, the planned solution is to bring in people outside the country.


I think it would be a smarter move to improve the access to education for those poor people. I saw a documentary on Detroit a few years ago and in many neighbourhoods people got pregnant before they even finished highschool, and the majority (! !! !) of people never finished highschool. If that is the modus operandi, it will NEVER get better there. The dropouts will stay, and the lucky few who get an education will leave.



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13 Nov 2014, 6:52 am

trollcatman wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
-And now there is no such thing as black people with graduate degrees.....lol and why the hell would educated college graduates want to move to such a racist place?


They will be given citizenship if they move there, yes, otherwise, of course, they would not live there. Well, there hundreds of thousands of black people in Detroit, yet, the planned solution is to bring in people outside the country.


I think it would be a smarter move to improve the access to education for those poor people. I saw a documentary on Detroit a few years ago and in many neighbourhoods people got pregnant before they even finished highschool, and the majority (! !! !) of people never finished highschool. If that is the modus operandi, it will NEVER get better there. The dropouts will stay, and the lucky few who get an education will leave.


Yes, I created a topic on whether immigration is racist. Since what these businesses can do is immigrate from China or India where there is a plethora of graduate degree people, and ignore the locals who would be lucky to have a 4 year degree.



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13 Nov 2014, 6:53 am

Many well reasoned points and just a bit of snark.

Seperate but equal in a town half black, was an agreement of power sharing, where each economy, one richer and more educated, besides being white, had full power over their own group.

Black schools were under black control, with State funding, certified black teachers, and the lunch lady. They also got hand me down supplies from the white schools. Think what you want, but it provided role models, showed a working black community.

Employment was unequal, because the blacks lacked higher education, so Legal, Engineering, Management did go to those who were able. Public employment was shared, as I remember Dr. King addressed the black sanitation workers. Garbage pickup, ditch digging, are needed, and were almost all black, and a few white felons.

We did not have thrift stores, yard sales, or missions, white churchs collected and sent to black churches. A good coat will last through several growing children, and still be warm. We did the same in our own families.

Blacks were considered less scary than poor whites, who are poor for a reason. Blacks do treat their children well, the real horror stories came from poor whites. They were the third group, and the most problem. Blacks are not animals, they are better, animals are better than poor whites.

Had a little dog and his name was Dash, rather be a ****** than poor white trash.

Each to their own group, leave the others alone, live in peace as best we can.

Intergration and the Voting Rights Act changed everything. Blacks failed in white schools. Whites left for Church Schools, The all black schools now had white trash mixed in.

They had the votes to elect a Mayor, but not the sense to run a government. The money vanished, nothing was maintained, white people moved out, more blacks moved in. As there were no longer people who gave them things, they just took it from the stores, because slavery. Business left.

Welfare and food stamps produced generations that had never worked. Just vote Democrat and keep the checks coming. What do you call an employed black person? On Parole.

Most whites did not move far, built new houses, did not form towns, had church schools, and life was better. They took the economy with them.

The black community suffered, crime spiked, most crime is black on black. Drug gang warlords moved in, drugs and death followed. Mexicans like these outlet towns.

The smarter moved to where they could live next to white people.

The small towns across the south were lost, both black and white flight went to cities with entrenched white populations. This lead to Gentryfication, where traditional black areas were redeveloped, because it was the only housing available close to jobs and good schools. Rents rose, some blacks were pushed out.

It turned out they were doing the crime, the Gentry were heard by the police, held nights out against crime, kept the lights on, and the result was, their black neighbors joined them. People who had lived in blight cleaned their yards and painted their houses, seeing a better life, they took it. Turns out it is not that hard to revitalize a neighborhood.

The social connection grew, black residents were invited to neighborhood meeting, and white people got street lights replaced, roads paved, drains cleared, and crime almost vanished. The fastest rising property values were those black owned next to the white Gentry.

As the road to hell is paved with good intentions, people still defend these laws that destroyed what most blacks had. Black complaints were met with the Prison Industrial Complex.

Food clothing and shelter in exchange for picking cotton sounds better.

It is not racist to say that the plight of blacks has worsened over the last fifty years.

We did regulate life in our old culture, all communities do. We did not have millions of blacks in cages, which is now the case. We did not have the crime rates now seen everwhere. We did not have the murder rate that now kills young black men.

You say I am racist, Rosa Parks agrees with me. The people we so carefully trained to function and provide the leadership blacks needed agree with me. This was not the intended outcome of the Civil Rights Movement.

Killing Dr. King, selling Crack, were not the only government ops to keep the black people from gaining economic and political power. Remember, they were raised by Conseritives. We had power sharing.

As for the Dick Move, New Orleans was called Sodom and Gammora on the Mississippi by the Simpsons. Up until 1908 when a Navy prude closed it we had Storyville, a famous red light district. Take that Nevada. Boy sex had been going on since before the Greeks, New Orleans was an open and worldly city. Up until the 1960s when a huricane destroyed it, The Club My Oh My on the lakefront had female inpersonators providing the entertainment. It was not some hidden cult, it drew a large audience, for the entertainment. We had drag queen strip clubs in the French Quarter, I think we still do.

The new homosexuals called it discrimination when HIV showed up in the bath houses of San Francisco, and public health wanted to close them, track the cases, isolate them, and the usual methods of stopping the spread of disease. It worker on Typhoid, TB, it would have worked on HIV, Cuba did it, it worked.

They threw a hissy, swished in the streets, and threatened to expose the other customers.. The Bath Houses stayed open, five million have died, more than all our wars, fifteen million are infected, it is bankrupting Social Security and Medicare. It showed a connection with IV drug use, and prison populations. The current death rate is 15,000 a year, and rising.

I wish they would marry, research shows homosexual males have 500 sex partners, 17 out of 18 people who die of Colorectal Cancer are homosexual males, besides HIV, they are big in Hepititus, A,B, C, and who knows. Everyone dies, they do it fifteen years younger.

On the plus side they are mostly 100% homosexual, so they keep it in the group sex.

On the minus side, sex is one thing, the HIV, Hep, IV drug use, and several boyfriends in prison, leads me to wonder if they are the best person for the job. Historic Sodomy covered a lot more than sex. Every country that is seeking spies who will sell out their own country, looks for Sodomites, and always has.

History also connects that with poisoning, con games, thefts, and funding the prison population, maybe things change, maybe history was written by homophobes.

It is a small part of the drug using prison population, altogether maybe 5%, that cause a lot of problems.

Lesbians do not spread disease, but they do have the highest rates of domestic violence police calls. They beat out blacks and poor whites!

Women have most of the money, they live longer, make out as serial brides, and get the house, kids, and child support in divorce. it is said, they have most of the money and all of the p****. They get most of the University Degrees, and men still spend money on them.

Recent reports say they want to strut their stuff through black neighborhoods and not have black men offering them the D. Saying good morning is a form of rape, and they wonder why people will not talk to them, and exclude them.

They are displaying power they do not have, and making public fools of themselves.

Now would I want that in a smoothly running office of ten? They are here to play everyone against each other and tear down the power structure, that produces the paychecks.

Even employed, when the next downturn comes, guess who is wearing the pink slip. It is called biting the hand that feeds you.

We have not had full employment in a decade, and will never have it again. Computers and robots are expected to take a third of jobs in the next decade.

From here we are going to have two worlds, the working and the underclass slum. Or we could join, hopeless I know, and as The People rewrite the tax laws, provide a universal income, with education.

Education has been the best thing for economic development. Social Unity is the best thing for any country.

Splintered single issue politics hides the elephant in the room, all go down when the ship sinks.



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13 Nov 2014, 7:06 am

LoveNotHate wrote:

Yes, I created a topic on whether immigration is racist. Since what these businesses can do is immigrate from China or India where there is a plethora of graduate degree people, and ignore the locals who would be lucky to have a 4 year degree.


Can't really blame the businesses. Why would they hire someone without a highschool diploma when they can hire who someone who actually qualifies for the job? It's the government that should improve the school system and try to teach kids about how not to get pregnant. Also, if the businesses can't import the employees they need they will just move part of their company to China or wherever.



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13 Nov 2014, 1:48 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:

This is your typical response. What is garbage? The physical existence of ghettos? The creation of ghettos? The governor's plan (easy to find on google)? Or what you say because you don't know anything ?


Considering this is the first time I responded with that, I have a hard time seeing how it is typical. Also the garbage was your racist launguage and attitude 'Oh god black people coming into an area automatically makes it ghetto guys' and defending the phraise 'freeing the blacks to destroy city after city' I mean what shall we 'un-free' them? Also clearly its false that I don't know anything otherwise I wouldn't be able to use a computer :roll:.


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13 Nov 2014, 1:51 pm

trollcatman wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
-And now there is no such thing as black people with graduate degrees.....lol and why the hell would educated college graduates want to move to such a racist place?


They will be given citizenship if they move there, yes, otherwise, of course, they would not live there. Well, there hundreds of thousands of black people in Detroit, yet, the planned solution is to bring in people outside the country.


I think it would be a smarter move to improve the access to education for those poor people. I saw a documentary on Detroit a few years ago and in many neighbourhoods people got pregnant before they even finished highschool, and the majority (! !! !) of people never finished highschool. If that is the modus operandi, it will NEVER get better there. The dropouts will stay, and the lucky few who get an education will leave.


Yeah maybe that would be an idea.


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14 Nov 2014, 4:46 am

We could just come to terms with slavery.

It makes sense because we are spending enough to send them all to Harvard on prisons.

Saying black people are equal does not make it so. They are at a disadvantage because of our shared history.

They are disavantaged because 500 years ago Europe had technology, industry, nation states, and those soon to be sold as slaves had huts of mud and sticks in the poor village.

Europe had set land ownership for a thousand years, so they developed what they had, built stone houses that lasted generations, where Africa lacked ownership, and after a few years the fields ran down, the animals moved away, the huts were falling apart, so they moved a few miles away and built a new village.

Some things seem hardwired, after hundreds of years as slaves, when the Union Army set up a line upriver from New Orleans, from the river to the lake, slaves fled to them, but were rejected. They settled in front of the Union lines, and built huts of woven brush plastered with mud. They were called contraband, they are still there, now in lumber houses.

That everyone can learn the same thing at the same pace does not work with white people.

Admit it, we have a black underclass that fails to meet educational goals, which are the fault of the goals. It is not impossible to adjust the educational system to the abilities of the students. Sitting in a desk all day, learning Calculus in Greek, does not work for some, so they drop out.

Our current school system came from Child Labor Laws, where instead of sending them to the factories, mines, mills, they were sent to school, to learn to obey the bell, turn to their work, till the lunch bell, return to work till the end of shift bell. It was pre factory training, not education.

In our old seperate schools there was more play, and the overall goal was learning to function as a community. Knowledge was put on exibit, not force fed.

The learning style is different. I had a computer repair business, and shopped Goodwill back in the 90s. It was my parts supply. A black girl that worked in the back asked me some questions, I answered, and over several years she became quite good at computer repair. Listening to other conversations, I found that the knowledge had been spread to the whole black staff. I taught one, she taught all.

Things that are useful will be told to the whole community. Black people live in survival mode.

While the social and learning style may differ, it is there, does function, and does not fit the white one size fits all methods.

The greatest predictor of black education sucess, is if someone around them has learned the same thing.

The black underclass, about 10% of the country, cannot be left behind, or sent to prison. They can be educated, do function in communities, and we have just been applying the wrong methods.

It is a prime example of why we need a universal income and more, such as a black education system that is not just academic and football. They learn best by seeing and doing, so a self building school that was sited on four sections, farmed, could teach all the crafts to build a town, and build it.

Ownership and pride in community need to be developed. It is there, it just needs time and space to grow.

How you treat the least among you is a good measure of a culture.

I have met many older black people who would do anything to make Learningtown happen.

The problem with white people is they do not realize how stupid they are, and no one tells them not to do dumb things.



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18 Nov 2014, 2:56 pm

sly279 wrote:
you do realise that smaller companies can't afford it they aren't making millions and billions like walmart and other corporations are.


Small businesses are exempt. I personally would have preferred to see the exemptions on a sliding scale (based on profitability) vice an arbitrarily picked 50 employee line, but smaller businesses are still exempt.

sly279 wrote:
more worrisome is what horrible s**t the out going democrates will pass in the lame duck session.


I wouldn't worry about this. Most of the Democratic Senate bills will be filibustered (which only went away for certain types of appointment approvals, before anyone jumps on that) and even if they did manage to stuff something through, it would go absolutely nowhere in the House. More business as usual, for the most part.

I think what you will mostly see is attempts to push through as many pending nominations as possible, with a few purely symbolic gestures to make the Republicans look bad when they get shot down.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:14 pm

Tollorin wrote:
More so republicans will lose a lot of support when peoples will begin to notice the effects of climate change. Combining that with the demographic changes, and it's likelly republican party won't survive 21th century. The consequence after that I guess will be the democrat party splitting in two between the left and the right wings of the party. History won't be nice to conservatives.


You really don't get how the Republican party works, do you?

They will succeed for a very very long time. They are masters at manipulation and PR. Just take a look at how much the narrative has changes in the past few weeks. They were the party valiantly fighting against the passing of legislation in defiance of the evil tyrant Obama, but now that they are going to have both Senate and House it has instantly changed to valiantly fighting against the tyrannical obstructionism of Reid and Obama.

Not to mention the fact that they sold their base on how bad Medicaid expansion would be, and now in states where it didn't happen they have convinced so many that Obama is to blame. It just amazes me that even up through most of the 2008 primaries, something amazingly similar to Obamacare was championed by most of the Republicans contenders, but once it was Obama's baby, it suddenly turned into socialism somehow. Even on same sex marriage they have backed down from their vocal fist shaking and within a few years you will not see it even mentioned in most congressional races. Even marijuana legalization now has many decades long war on drugs Republicans changing their tune.

A few plays from Republican playbook:
1. If they are for it, it is evil and will destroy jobs. If they are against it, it is good and will create jobs.
2. If it worked well, we supported it all along and they opposed it.
3. If it didn't work well, we were against it all along and they were for it.

1. Predict the neighbors will burn down the house.
2. burn down the house.
3. Blame the neighbors for burning down the house.

1. Less big government . . . unless we want it.
2. Less government spending . . . unless we want it.

1. They are coming to take away your (fill in the blank to pander to the current audience).

Although to be fair, that last one is the also the very first page in the Democratic playbook, as well.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:22 pm

Dox47 wrote:
I had to look them up because I kept hearing about them from liberals, I came to similar conclusions to Fnord. Seriously, a decade as a libertarian and I'd never heard the name Horatio Alger until liberals started throwing it at me. Same with Ayn Rand actually, never read her until liberals kept accusing me of being brainwashed by her, figured I should know what the fuss was about if people were going to keep making stupid assumptions.


To be fair, you can blame some over the top conservative Republicans who call themselves "libertarians" despite ignoring most of the actual core tenets of Libertarianism. Some of the more visible TV tropes trotted Rand and Alger out of the closet and dusted them off. Paul Ryan is probably one of the worst, considering that he got plenty of federal "handout" money and now wants to pull the ladder up behind him while talking about how he made it because he worked hard.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:28 pm

Lukecash12 wrote:
Everyone's rates have gone up and many people have a hard time even receiving the care that the ACA offers.


Everyone is probably not the right word. My premiums for 2015 are down almost 2%. They were down a few dollars a month in 2014.

I now have a lower deductible, and I have gained coverage for 2 medications and my monthly MRIs (I was only covered for 2/year previously).

And btw, the 2015 numbers are out and average premiums are DOWN by 0.7% with 25% more insurers available.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:33 pm

Lukecash12 wrote:
Huckabee in particular has been making serious proposals on the issue of health care since long before ACA.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !! !!

You do realize that what Huckabee was pushing since the Clinton days was almost identical in every way to the PPACA as passed, don't you?

Same goes for Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh, two of the most vitriolic anti-ACA tools out there.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:35 pm

GoonSquad wrote:
That just proves how intellectually bankrupt the far right is...

The names they REALLY need to know are Locke and Burke...

THEN, we'd have actual libertarians instead of selfish, amoral as*holes.


I'd drink to that.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:49 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Explain to me how not being immediately familiar with the authors of fiction that morons erroneously tie to my beliefs make me "intellectually bankrupt"? I only even use the label 'libertarian' because it's easier than explaining the myriad of positions that I hold, even if it's an imperfect fit, as I actually form my opinions by educating myself about things and thinking, as opposed to simply believing what my party tells me to.


Actually, the Rand influence on Libertarianism was more from a non-fiction philosophy piece titled "The Virtue of Selfishness." Even then, it never gained much traction in politics, considering how she tainted her philosophy by linking it to her hatred towards pretty much every group of human beings on the planet that did not accept Ayn Rand as a holy prophet, particularly the unabashed and almost gleeful antisemitism. She tainted atheism in her day even more than she did Libertarian philosophy. She was a shining example for holier than thou types to point to and talk about how evil and selfish all atheists must be.

The mainstreamed "Atlas Shrugged" fixation on fiction as some sort of blueprint for government is fairly recent. Less than a decade, really.


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18 Nov 2014, 3:58 pm

Lukecash12 wrote:
The disease is the culture. An absolutely casual attitude towards sex. Examples abound of callous disregard towards life programmed into people from a young age in gangs. Hard drugs are abundant and celebrated. It's pointless to have a debate about ethics and which culture is better, but clearly there are self destructive elements of this culture.


I find your crass generalizations quite offensive. Have you ever lived in a poor, black inner city neighborhood? Have you ever even been to one? After living in these types of neighborhoods for years and years, I can attest that none where I have lived have anything other than the tiniest fraction who match your bigoted stereotype. The last place I lived in Cleveland was mostly black, but most of the crime came from the poor white people a few blocks over where you would go if you were looking for some crystal meth. But the police still had no problems stopping black people and questioning them without providing any reasons. Even to the point where I was once talking to my neighbor on the sidewalk (who was in a shirt and tie on his way to work) and had the cop ask me if I was being bothered.

So please give up your 1980s drive by gang-banger stereotype and come visit us here in 2014.


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