Jewish settlers filmed shooting Palestinian protester

Page 2 of 3 [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

snapcap
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2011
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,328

23 May 2012, 4:05 pm

Vigilans wrote:
snapcap wrote:
YourMajesty wrote:
No offense, but it shocks me how much attention every dead Palestinian gets, while other people are fighting wars.

Some years ago the Zimbabweans fought for freedom, against Mugabe, I thought there were about 3000 violent deaths per day. Then, 6 Palestinians got killed. The war in the Gaza zone seemed to increase (and yes it did, but that wasn't clear yet). After the dead Palestinians the papers were full of articles and very interesting opinions on the conflict. Apparently Zimbabwe was voor gooseberry season because these people got totally forgotten. You actually saw a class of kids mourning those Palestinians (muslims) and that was the last drop, as if the death of some Palestinians is so far worse than the death of many thousands of other people.


One thing about the plight in Palestine is that it could trigger a world war. That's why it seems to be more of a pressing issue to me.


Christians, Jews and Muslims all hold that land sacred, so naturally they are going to pay more attention to it than some bush war they don't care about


There's another level of crazy that clouds that area.


_________________
*some atheist walks outside and picks up stick*

some atheist to stick: "You're like me!"


John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

23 May 2012, 7:21 pm

Vigilans wrote:
Christians, Jews and Muslims all hold that land sacred, so naturally they are going to pay more attention to it than some bush war they don't care about

True, though two of those three groups can get along and share the areas around religious sites peacefully without engaging in riots, shootings, suicide bombers, or rocket attacks against each other.

The problem is rarely something other than:
Muslims vs. Jews
Muslims vs. Christians
Muslims vs. Hindus
Muslims vs. Sikhs
Muslims vs. Buddhists
Muslims vs. local traditional/tribal religions
Shia Muslims vs. Sunni Muslims, who are both known to persecute the Sufi Muslims

I don't know who nicknamed them "the religion of peace", but I like their sense of humor! :lol:

There seems to be a pattern developing. Though sometimes Buddhists and Hindus alike don't play with others, but that usually tends to be isolated to remote parts of India, southeast Asia, and the region around the Himalayas.


_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown

"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud


ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 87
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

23 May 2012, 7:33 pm

John_Browning wrote:

I don't know who nicknamed them "the religion of peace", but I like their sense of humor! :lol:

.


Islam does not mean peace. It means submission (to the will of Allah the Compassionate and the Merciful).

And who knows what Allah's will is. The Imams, naturally.

ruveyn



Declension
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2012
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,807

23 May 2012, 7:34 pm

snapcap wrote:
In a prison state, and it messed up the psychology of the people in the surrounding areas. I don't recall extremism being a big problem before 1948.


I agree. But I wasn't talking about the Palestinian displacement. I was talking about the hypothetical displacement of the Israeli settlers that would occur if Israel were to return the territory that it illegally obtained through war.



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 87
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

23 May 2012, 8:58 pm

Declension wrote:
snapcap wrote:
In a prison state, and it messed up the psychology of the people in the surrounding areas. I don't recall extremism being a big problem before 1948.


I agree. But I wasn't talking about the Palestinian displacement. I was talking about the hypothetical displacement of the Israeli settlers that would occur if Israel were to return the territory that it illegally obtained through war.


Since the Israelis did not start the wars, any territory gained in a war of self defense is fairly gotten.

Israel is the only nation on earth which is expected to sue for peace after it has -won- a war.

ruveyn



John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

23 May 2012, 10:56 pm

Declension wrote:
snapcap wrote:
In a prison state, and it messed up the psychology of the people in the surrounding areas. I don't recall extremism being a big problem before 1948.


I agree. But I wasn't talking about the Palestinian displacement. I was talking about the hypothetical displacement of the Israeli settlers that would occur if Israel were to return the territory that it illegally obtained through war.

They won't. If they did, their borders would be nearly impossible to defend, and by their own admission they would have to get trigger happy with the nuclear option if they were invaded.

So in a way, the west bank occupation helps to protect the Arabs from their own stupidity.


_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown

"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud


snapcap
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2011
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,328

23 May 2012, 11:24 pm

They need a solution fast, because the world is losing patience with Israel

ISRAEL AS POPULAR AS NORTH KOREA ACCORDING TO BBC POLL

Quote:
Haaretz reported yesterday that, “Israel, Iran, Pakistan and North Korea were ranked most negatively by 24,000 people surveyed in an annual BBC poll.”...Over 24,000 people from 22 countries took part in the poll, which was conducted from December 2011 to February 2012.


Pretty bad when you're equated with North Korea.

8O


_________________
*some atheist walks outside and picks up stick*

some atheist to stick: "You're like me!"


Declension
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2012
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,807

24 May 2012, 1:59 am

ruveyn wrote:
Since the Israelis did not start the wars, any territory gained in a war of self defense is fairly gotten.

Israel is the only nation on earth which is expected to sue for peace after it has -won- a war.


Not true. Israel is being treated by international law just the same as any other country would be under similar circumstances. If the Soviets had retained control of Berlin at the end of World War 2 and started building settlements there, it would be nonsensical to say that it is fair because the Germans started the war.

But anyway, it is basically just playing with words to say that Israel didn't start the wars. The beginning of the existence of Israel started the wars. It's like saying that an elephant that suddenly pops into existence just above a sandcastle is not the cause of the destruction of the sandcastle. Okay, maybe it would be more fair to say that whatever caused the elephant to pop into existence is the true cause of the destruction of the sandcastle, since the elephant didn't have any say in the matter. But it would be ludicrous to say that the sandcastle is the cause of its own destruction!



John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

24 May 2012, 3:09 am

Declension wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Since the Israelis did not start the wars, any territory gained in a war of self defense is fairly gotten.

Israel is the only nation on earth which is expected to sue for peace after it has -won- a war.


Not true. Israel is being treated by international law just the same as any other country would be under similar circumstances. If the Soviets had retained control of Berlin at the end of World War 2 and started building settlements there, it would be nonsensical to say that it is fair because the Germans started the war.

But anyway, it is basically just playing with words to say that Israel didn't start the wars. The beginning of the existence of Israel started the wars. It's like saying that an elephant that suddenly pops into existence just above a sandcastle is not the cause of the destruction of the sandcastle. Okay, maybe it would be more fair to say that whatever caused the elephant to pop into existence is the true cause of the destruction of the sandcastle, since the elephant didn't have any say in the matter. But it would be ludicrous to say that the sandcastle is the cause of its own destruction!

Check your history. The entire communist bloc was made up of Soviet puppet states with figureheads that answered to Moscow. When Khrushchev came to power, his inability to take control of West Berlin was a major thorn in his side.

As for the creation of Israel, Palestine was the sovereign territory of the British empire to use as they pleased, and they chose to give it to the Zionists. The Arabs picked a fight with them and the Israelis found they absolutely needed to keep the lands they did. up between 1994 and 2001 Israel and Palestine used to have peace talks where they would periodically relinquish a little piece of land. Eventually they ran out of land they could safely give up, and that's when Arafat secretly started sending suicide bombers to try and pressure the Israelis into relinquishing more land. Numerous battles were fought in the next few years until Israel built the wall and guarded it well, then the suicide bombers stopped. If Palestine would remove violence from their list of options, they would get a lot farther in negotiations with Israel.


_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown

"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud


Declension
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2012
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,807

24 May 2012, 3:45 am

John_Browning wrote:
Check your history. The entire communist bloc was made up of Soviet puppet states with figureheads that answered to Moscow.


Exactly! And to the extent that this happened, it was a bad thing, right? It would have been even worse if the Soviets had claimed that East Germany was literally part of the Soviet Union. And it would have been even worse than that if the Soviets had claimed that all of Germany was part of the Soviet Union. You are not supposed to obtain permanent territory through war, and it doesn't matter how the war started.

John_Browning wrote:
As for the creation of Israel, Palestine was the sovereign territory of the British empire to use as they pleased


If we are talking about morality, a statement like this is literally meaningless. Or are you now going to start defending the morality of British imperialism? The only defensible position is to say that places primarily belong to the people who live there, and only belong to states inasmuch as the states are the democratic representatives of the people who live there. The people who lived in Palestine, amazingly, didn't like it when their land was partitioned by an external power which did not democratically represent them in any sense.



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 87
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

26 May 2012, 9:08 pm

John_Browning wrote:



As for the creation of Israel, Palestine was the sovereign territory of the British empire to use as they pleased, and they chose to give it to the Zionists.


It was a mandate awarded to Great Britain by the League of Nations after WWI. The Ottoman Empire collapsed and Britain was given the job of administering the territory. It was never, ever sovereign British soil. The Brits chose to surrender the Mandate in 1946 and were trying to play both sides as usual. The give the best military positions to the Arabs, but the Jews won anyway.

ruveyn



snapcap
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2011
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,328

27 May 2012, 12:25 pm

Here's a first hand account of the take over of Israel.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS4OXOom_vk[/youtube]

Basically, soldiers "cleared" the land, then the settlers came in and "inherited" it.


_________________
*some atheist walks outside and picks up stick*

some atheist to stick: "You're like me!"