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Rainstorm5
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16 Mar 2008, 4:37 pm

sartresue wrote:
Not the incredible invisible woman topic


I take it this has turned up before? Sorry about that :shrug:

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I think we need to reinvent ourselves as asplanet wrote. I know I have had to do this. The evolution of age is also how we prosper as we age. I was never "hot" as a young woman. Now that I am older I know I will never be and so I employ other means to fulfill life goals. Leaving a legacy for my descendants is important, and/or making some important contribution to the world (including the Asperger/Autistic community). :)


I was never 'hot' either - I hung out with the parking lot with the smokers, punkers, metal-heads, goths and gangsters. They were so caught up in their own terrible angst they never took notice of me, LOL. Such was the 80's. I was raised in California, though, a hellish place where 'image' is everything. Girls are taught from a very young age that you have to look your best no matter the cost. I guess this explains girls who wear miniskirts and strappy sandals when it's forty degrees outside. I never could measure up to that sort of yardstick- one of the reasons I left Cali as soon as I was financially able to do so. I don't know any other way to explain it except that with that sort of environment, it's as though I was repeatedly told since the age of five that because of my body structure I would never be good enough to fit in. You are lucky that this was never an issue for you - I mean that sincerely. I on't even know why this sort of stuff matters, except maybe because I was trained from a young age that it was 'supposed' to matter. Sort of disgusts me how much of that mentality still hangs over me like a dark raincloud. If this was some kind of switch I could just 'turn off,' I'd have done so years ago. Not that I wanted pity 'for not being pretty anymore.' I wasn't much to look at back then, either. Just ask the other kids who always referred to me as a 'dog.' My initial question was based on how people dismiss others as being irrelevant just because they're over 40. This included intellectual matters as well as the obvious physical.

thanks for your reply - sorry again that I brought up a redundant topic.

Best wishes,

Jillian


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gwenevyn
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16 Mar 2008, 5:23 pm

I'm glad you brought it up. I don't have a lot to contribute, but this is one of my biggest fears. Okay... the biggest. Every time I read one of those posts where guys are saying that women are only attractive from age 18-24, I feel really bad about myself. I'm 25 and I feel like men are looking at me more than ever, but (I guess) I know it won't last.

I don't have a good grasp on what will happen to me because I love all kinds of people and see beauty just about everywhere... people say that older women aren't attractive anymore and I just don't understand that. It's only recently that I've been hearing such things. I really thought that men thought their wives were beautiful forever. I'm grieving over this not being true... it sometimes makes me not even want a relationship. I don't want to give my best years away to a man and then get ditched when I'm not pretty anymore. I'm terrified of that.

If people stop loving me or listening to me someday or stop recognizing my work because I've grown old, I think I'll get really depressed. I do not have a strong, vibrant personality. I am quiet.

Already I see how I "disappear" to many men when I am with a child. There have been times I've taken my son with me to the store and nobody even glances my way... then I have to leave him with my mom in the car while I run in to get something we forgot... and suddenly guys are opening doors for me, grinning at me, trying to get my attention, being more polite to me, taking more time to help me...

It makes me wonder what it will be like when I am 60. Will I have to stand on my head to get some help at the deli? :?


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Rainstorm5
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16 Mar 2008, 6:09 pm

gwenevyn wrote:
I really thought that men thought their wives were beautiful forever. I'm grieving over this not being true... it sometimes makes me not even want a relationship. I don't want to give my best years away to a man and then get ditched when I'm not pretty anymore. I'm terrified of that.


I was afraid of that as well. After I left my second husband at the age of 25 [edit: typo], I'd already gotten to the point where men didn't bother casting a glance my way anymore. But there's good news. I guess I'm lucky that I kept dumping guys that were bad for me because I found one that I could get along with and even after 16 years finds me attractive. I firmly believe that everyone has a soulmate out there in the world, somewhere, and at some point in your life you will meet that person. Call me crazy, but that's what I believe. It's just a matter of recognizing that person when you find them. After a decade and a half, my husband and I still take long walks together and hold hands. He's stuck with me through my thin years and my fat years and now he's suffering right along with me through perimenopause. There will be someone out there you can rely on to remain by your side. It's only a matter of knowing them when you finally meet them, if you don't know that person already.

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If people stop loving me or listening to me someday or stop recognizing my work because I've grown old, I think I'll get really depressed. I do not have a strong, vibrant personality. I am quiet.

Already I see how I "disappear" to many men when I am with a child. There have been times I've taken my son with me to the store and nobody even glances my way... then I have to leave him with my mom in the car while I run in to get something we forgot... and suddenly guys are opening doors for me, grinning at me, trying to get my attention, being more polite to me, taking more time to help me...


I had 2 kids in school when I met my current husband, and it didn't scare him off. He had kids of his own from a previous marriage (he left her because she cheated on him). I know what you're talking about though. After I split with my ex, men would find me interesting up until they found out I had kids. That's when they'd run away like I had the plague. The men who look away when they see you with a child (whether it's your own or not) are probably not worth your time, anyway.

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It makes me wonder what it will be like when I am 60. Will I have to stand on my head to get some help at the deli? :?


When you're 60, if they don't pay attention, just whop 'em with your cane. That's what I plan on doing. :twisted:


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Erilyn
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17 Mar 2008, 2:23 pm

I will be 30 in a few months and I've already started to feel invisible. Well.... I've felt invisible my entire life, but for other reasons - LOL. Anyway, I have been working for the same company over 6 years now. I was 23 when I started here, and was one of the "younger" girls. There was one other girl who was younger than me at 21. I worked on reception and customers (95% men as this is the construction industry) would often smile at me, and I suppose even sort of flirt with me (in true Aspie fashion I would never realize it at the time). This went on for some time, even after I was promoted and moved upstairs to my own desk (I would still get smiled at and have doors held for me and stuff when I moved about the office). But - I'm not even exactly sure when it happened - it suddenly stopped at one point. I recently realized that I am now one of the "older" girls - the office downstairs is full of 20-24 year-olds again that were all hired well after me. All of a sudden I wasn't one of the young and cute ones anymore. Disturbingly, I also noticed a few months ago that I am now the only white girl left in the place that is not blonde. 8O

While it was a startling observation, I don't really care, per se. I don't know how to act when people flirt with me anyway. In a way it's nice to be invisible. And I do have a wonderful husband so it's not like I'm looking. But it's still a little unsettling to have it so blatantly confirmed that a woman's looks do seem to be THAT ridiculously important. Jeez I'm not even a "mom" yet. :oops:



littlefrog
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18 Mar 2008, 5:38 pm

honestly ladies, this thread made me a little sad. so many of you are so down on yourselves :(

* beauty is always in the eye of the beholder
* age does not = beauty, it is an out of balance society that even suggests such a thing.
* any woman who takes care of her body and loves herself does get more beautiful as she ages (i'll post pics of older beautiful women if you want)



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18 Mar 2008, 8:05 pm

littlefrog wrote:
honestly ladies, this thread made me a little sad. so many of you are so down on yourselves :(

* beauty is always in the eye of the beholder
* age does not = beauty, it is an out of balance society that even suggests such a thing.
* any woman who takes care of her body and loves herself does get more beautiful as she ages (i'll post pics of older beautiful women if you want)


Oh, littlefrog, that's a great idea...

I'll help, although, I'm not sure how to link to images in here yet...

How about Meryl Streep, Helen Mirrin and Judy Dench.

Liz Taylor

All of the actresses in that show my daughter likes... something housewives...

Goldie Hawn

who else...



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19 Mar 2008, 5:24 am

I plan to make myself visible in other ways, such as busing tables at a local restaurant, volunteering for a cause that I believe in, mowing lawns for people, like I did last summer, and selling my art, at the local flea market, on Ebay, or both. I don't need to be pretty, to get noticed.


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littlefrog
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19 Mar 2008, 9:59 am

Pepperfire wrote:
littlefrog wrote:
honestly ladies, this thread made me a little sad. so many of you are so down on yourselves :(

* beauty is always in the eye of the beholder
* age does not = beauty, it is an out of balance society that even suggests such a thing.
* any woman who takes care of her body and loves herself does get more beautiful as she ages (i'll post pics of older beautiful women if you want)


Oh, littlefrog, that's a great idea...

I'll help, although, I'm not sure how to link to images in here yet...

How about Meryl Streep, Helen Mirrin and Judy Dench.

Liz Taylor

All of the actresses in that show my daughter likes... something housewives...

Goldie Hawn

who else...



I have to post 5 legitimate posts before i can post pics .. be right back .. ok, i have to wait until i've been here five days.

i found fabulous pics of jane seymour - 57, demi moore - 45, Michelle Pfeiffer - 49, Cindy Crawford - 41, Goldie Hawn - 62 and Helen Mirren - 62



gwenevyn
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19 Mar 2008, 11:23 am

I hate to be the party pooper here, but I'm honestly not at all comforted by photos of beautiful older women who are wealthy. These woman can afford gym memberships, personal trainers, expensive clothing and cosmetics, medicine, doctor and dentist visits, spa treatments, cosmetic surgery, etc. etc. etc. Most of the women of the world have zero hope of being similarly privileged.

I spent a good long while just looking around at middle-aged women at the store yesterday. What I saw was not very comforting. They look fine to me, but they're nothing like Jane Seymour.


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littlefrog
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19 Mar 2008, 11:45 am

gwenevyn wrote:
I hate to be the party pooper here, but I'm honestly not at all comforted by photos of beautiful older women who are wealthy. These woman can afford gym memberships, personal trainers, expensive clothing and cosmetics, medicine, doctor and dentist visits, spa treatments, cosmetic surgery, etc. etc. etc. Most of the women of the world have zero hope of being similarly privileged.

I spent a good long while just looking around at middle-aged women at the store yesterday. What I saw was not very comforting. They look fine to me, but they're nothing like Jane Seymour.


i completely understand that, all true.

i'm 40, and i am far from wealthy but i've stayed in shape (without a personal trainer or a fancy diet or a fancy gym membership).

i dance and i eat healthy (no sugar, very few starchy carbs, whole foods) i hike once a week, and i take an antioxidant, pycnogenol

it's totally possible to stay lovely as you get older without it costing you a lot of money. women also become more distinguished as they age, just like men. :)



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19 Mar 2008, 9:03 pm

I'd love to look like Catherine Zeta-Jones at 40 or Marie Osmond at 50+
I don't know if I want to look like Dame Judy Dench, but I'd sure like to have her money...


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wisteria
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20 Mar 2008, 11:33 pm

What is hardest for me about getting older is not appearance or being invisible (I found I turned invisible, in terms of male attention, once I became a mom). It's the feeling that with every passing day-- and days turn into weeks, months, and then years-- I have lost just that much more opportunity and hope. When I was 25, going back to finish my degree, so that I could be self-sufficient, seemed very possible. Then I hit 30 and in a dr's office was met by resident physicians who were younger than I am. Now, getting close to 35, I realize that if I ever do finish the degree and support myself, it will be something practically news-worthy. With each day I feel increasingly trapped and less able, and it's very painful. It's like a slow coming to terms with my inabilities and shortcomings. I never thought my life would be like this.



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21 Mar 2008, 7:59 pm

I can empathize with that. At 40, I find myself questioning all that I haven't accomplished yet, and it's hard to ignore everything I've left undone. the only thing you can do is set goals and hope you find time to complete them.


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23 Mar 2008, 2:13 am

I have a slightly different experience. I still get (unwanted) attention, and I am 50 years old. I have inherited the ability to look at least twenty years younger than I am. Sometimes I will deliberately leave the gray in my hair, just to stop getting stared at. What's really disconcerting, is that I don't think I am pretty. In fact, I sometimes am filled with such self loathing, I can't stand to look in the mirror. But this comes from a history of Body dysmorphic disorder, and anorexia/bulemia issues. And yet I have to hear all the time about how attractive I am, and see the shocked looks when I reveal my age. I feel as if I don't really belong to any set group, as I generally relate better to older or younger people than myself. Sometimes I wish I could go invisible.


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23 Mar 2008, 5:46 pm

I have been invisible from day one. Now after reading this thread all hope is lost in ever getting any attention if thing go to hell in my marriage. I’m already 35 and I can see that this is the end of the road in my wanting to feel like a female.

I’ve never been one to wear make up or girlie myself up. I kind of lack the feminine beauty that most men look for.



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26 Mar 2008, 2:00 pm

To the original poster,

I know exactly what you mean. At least you have a husband so you're not looking for men now. I will turn 38 pretty soon so I am rapidly closing in on 40 myself. I had to give up doing silly things and giggling because it was just ridiculous to be my age and act like that. I am much more mature than 15 mentally however. In terms of looks I would say that I was considered pretty when I was much younger but I was never considered "hot" in the way that someone like Paris Hilton is considered to be. I was very much overweight from my late twenties until relatively recently; I've lost almost 40 pounds and still have about 60 more pounds to go. So in a way being overweight for a number of years meant that I became accustomed to not getting attention from men. But I think it's more than just the lack of male attention that scares me. I think it's the negative stereotypes of older women that depress me, particularly the "old maid" stereotypes as I have never been married. I have had boyfriends and dated but nothing ever worked out in terms of resulting in a marriage. I did get asked out recently from a man from church but this is a relatively new development so it remains to be seen as to what will happen with him in terms of dating.

I think the media has a lot to do with the way older women are perceived in American society. There are very few positive images of older women in the media. Some years ago there was a show called "The Golden Girls" back in the 1980's that showed a group of older women who had style and had lives. As someone pointed out in one of the earlier postings there is obviously a biological factor in terms of youth in a woman being attractive to men. I don't know if you are religious at all or have any religious beliefs. I have found it helpful to find outlets that are not dependent upon one's looks or youth. For example, I do some volunteer work in my spare time and I find it very rewarding. I also like to read in my spare time. Is there a cause that you feel very strongly about? I am involved in a Toastmasters group, which is a club in which people practice speaking in front of other people. It might be helpful to get involved in something like that because it might help you come across in a more mature manner. What kinds of things are you interested in?

There are other qualities besides looks that are attractive to other people. I don't mean just in terms of attracting men; I mean qualities that will make you an enjoyable person to be around. As I have gotten older there have been some positive developments in my life. I have adopted an overall much more positive outlook on life and am now much more upbeat and pleasant to be around than when I was younger. I was very negative and complained a lot when I was in my twenties. I have rediscovered spirituality and have gotten much more involved in the Church and worked at developing myself both spiritually and intellectually. But, yes, I do still very much understand what you are saying. I don't know what your beliefs are in terms of religion and spirituality so I don't know exactly how to advise you. But even if you don't believe in God you can still embrace a spirituality of some sort. Spirituality can simply mean that there is a purpose in life greater than oneself. For me one of the keys is to find ways to contribute to the world around me. I went to visit a friend of mine who is temporarily staying at an assisted living facility since she has Spina Bifida and broke her leg and needed help temporarily. She is not elderly. I talked to some of the other residents there and I do see beauty in older women. It is a different kind of beauty than the type of beauty one sees in a young woman of 20. There is a woman there who is 78 years old and she has this incredible glow about her. She smiles a lot and reaches out to the people around her. There are four seasons during the year and life has its seasons. Each season has a different kind of beauty to it. Fall and winter have their own beauty.

I hope I offered you some encouragement. I can definitely relate to the feeling of being invisible. I watched the movie "10,000 B.C. and they showed the oldest woman being the Wise Woman of the group. I wish our society had roles like that for older women. But ultimately what really matters in the end is living life in a way that is enjoyable for you and making a positive contribution in some way. Feel free to send me a private message if you wish as I am going through the exact same thing right now. I think it's true that a lot of quirks and oddities would be considered cute and charming in a very young woman but would simply come across as weird and inappropriate after a certain age. So I try to contain my silliness. I draw funny cartoons at home and hug stuffed animals at home. I am now working on finding clothing that is neither frumpy nor teenagerish and that is somewhat of a challenge. I think it's important to pay attention to grooming and dressing even more so than when I was younger. A young woman of 19 or 20 could get away with jeans and a ratty t-shirt but it just looks pitiful to many people to look raggedy after a certain age. I have noticed that people take me more seriously when I am nicely dressed and have some make-up on. Presentation is an important factor in determining how one is perceived by others.