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veiledexpressions
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16 Feb 2010, 5:02 pm

LoveMoney wrote:
veiledexpressions wrote:
On another site, my literal thinking made me the subject of derision and dismissal. I asked a question after literally interpreting another poster's words. She insisted I was trying to be rude. I suppose I'm just used to this reaction. People need to learn more precise wording.


Why? Okay sometimes you can wonder to take it literal or not but, because it can be both. But if you look at the situation or the post you can know if it literal or not.
Aspies can think logical so, so try to use your logic. And try to look the whole image, less narrowed. In your narrowed view it can be logical, but when you look at the whole image its not.

Sorry for my bad English.


I could not tell what she meant by it. It is precisely why I asked. Logically, the words she used did not fit anything besides what I asked. If I had known not to take it literally, I wouldn't have had an issue. Are you suggesting my interpretation was purposely flawed?

I looked at it, less narrowed, and it appeared even more disturbing. I questioned her word usage, and she was incredibly offended. I have learned that if I don't ask, and misunderstand, I'm in trouble.If I do ask, I'm offensive. There really is no middle ground.

Why use words if you do not mean them? Precise language really reminds me of the book, "The Giver". While I dislike the need for "sameness" in the society portrayed in that book, the usage of precise language appeals to me.



bhetti
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16 Feb 2010, 5:13 pm

one of my mother's many complaints about me when I was a kid was that I was "too literal". I could never figure out what she meant, and I really wanted to so she'd be happy with me.



jc6chan
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16 Feb 2010, 5:30 pm

I never had much trouble misinterpreting things people say



millie
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16 Feb 2010, 5:44 pm

veiledexpressions wrote:
LoveMoney wrote:
veiledexpressions wrote:
On another site, my literal thinking made me the subject of derision and dismissal. I asked a question after literally interpreting another poster's words. She insisted I was trying to be rude. I suppose I'm just used to this reaction. People need to learn more precise wording.


Why? Okay sometimes you can wonder to take it literal or not but, because it can be both. But if you look at the situation or the post you can know if it literal or not.
Aspies can think logical so, so try to use your logic. And try to look the whole image, less narrowed. In your narrowed view it can be logical, but when you look at the whole image its not.

Sorry for my bad English.


I could not tell what she meant by it. It is precisely why I asked. Logically, the words she used did not fit anything besides what I asked. If I had known not to take it literally, I wouldn't have had an issue. Are you suggesting my interpretation was purposely flawed?

I looked at it, less narrowed, and it appeared even more disturbing. I questioned her word usage, and she was incredibly offended. I have learned that if I don't ask, and misunderstand, I'm in trouble.If I do ask, I'm offensive. There really is no middle ground.

Why use words if you do not mean them? Precise language really reminds me of the book, "The Giver". While I dislike the need for "sameness" in the society portrayed in that book, the usage of precise language appeals to me.


I was recently on the receiving end of literal interpretation regarding my use of vocabulary.
There may be a literal dictionary interpretation, but even across cultures, within the same language group of English, the cultural nuances, the levels of brashness, the levels of reservation are going to be different. Vastly different at times. It also depends on sub-group and sub-culture usage and also individual usage. There are so many factors influencing language and its use and interpretation and meaning.
It even depends on the dictionaries one refers to to gain the "correct" meaning! Australian versus British or Canadian or American!! ! SO where then, is the truly objective and TRUE meaning of the words?

The reality is, there is no correct and objective meaning. semantics is inevitably linked in with context and that makes the world a confusing place for us. But the acceptance of that confusion, rather than the enforcement of the literal, can in fact lead to a bit more peace, in my experience.

This is one of the most painful and also most freeing things to learn as an aspie, in my opinion.
It loosens us up a bit to the ways of the world.


Here is a model of communication based on the writings of Verderber and Verderber:

The "encoder" or person communicating, sends a message. That message formation is affected by culture, by experiences, by sex, by occupation, by attitudes, by knowledge and by values, environment etc. The choice of vocabulary used is also affected by these things. The message is also impacted by what is termed "noise" - which can be semantic and relates to issues of intended meaning, or it can be feelings based noise - which relate to the feelings of the person sending the message, or external noise - which relates to sights, sounds and other stimuli.

This message is then sent to the "decoder" or recipient whose reception of that message is affected by culture, by experience, by sex, by occupation, by attitudes, by knowledge and by values, environment etc. The interpretation of the vocabulary received is also affected by these things. The message and its decoding is also impacted by the same "noise" mentioned above - which can relate to semantics and interpretation of words used, or feelings based noise - which relates to the feelings of the person receiving and decoding the message, or by external noise, which relates to sights, sounds and other stimuli.

At the same time as ALL OF THIS STUFF is going on, there is a to and fro of decoding and encoding, plus face to face interaction in some circumstances where meanings are linked to "affect and expression."


This is precisely WHY we ASD people struggle so much with communication. IT requires being able to do ALL OF THE ABOVE naturally and fluently, and our brains struggle with it.

IT certainly helps to understand the above complexity of communication exchange from a cognitive position. Learning the above years ago, certainly helped me to STOP the demand for literal interpretations from others. It helped me to understand that to do so would always lead to Pyrrhic victories where in the end...I would LOSE out painfully. I might think I had "won" the battle for the "correct" way for language to be used, but what I in fact did, was alienate myself from everyone because of that exacting attitude and because I would impost it on others.

There is no right and wrong or correct and incorrect use of language. It evolves and shifts and alters....as soon as a new edition to a dictionary is printed it is redundant, and the next edition is already being planned. For many people with an ASD, it's a painful reality to understand, but once comprehended it can make life and relating a little bit easier. A good communicator or even a poor communicator who wants to improve a bit, can understand the flexibility and fluidity of language as part of the rich variation of humans and human expression. It can be factored in and it can help me to understand myself and other people.

These days what I do try to factor into my communications is that everybody uses language a little differently. It's hard for me to get my head around it, but it does help me.

And I also do know that i am not one for wanting to be on the receiving end of corrections about my language usage and what I actually mean. Even as an ASD person I find this very affronting when it repeatedly happens.

Anyway, I hope the breakdown by Verderber and Verderber can help a few people here. It has helped me.



Last edited by millie on 16 Feb 2010, 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sedaka
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16 Feb 2010, 5:48 pm

a_minority_of_one wrote:
I have always thought and spoken literally, even earning the nickname "Technical Tom" as a teenager.

To this day, when asked "how are you?", I think and often reply with: "how am I what?" -- it always registers as an incomplete question/sentence..

Fortunately, I have adapted to the less literal ways of most others, and am less obvious about it than I used to be..


Haha! I remember saying that before.

I find that I STILL think literally... But I often remember WHEN I learned the correct response to things as well, so I don't respond as (openly) literal anymore... Though they still OCCUR to me in my thought processes as such.

Before knowing of AS and such things... I just always wondered why my instincts were wrong and just tried to remember what to do instead.


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veiledexpressions
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16 Feb 2010, 5:50 pm

In the instance I had trouble,it was said that what she used was a "figure of speech". While I have heard many and understand one, this one was not one I had encountered.

We were discussing circumcision, and she was mentioning anti-circ people "having their noses down little boys' pants" and in another post, "sniffing down the pants of little boys". To me, this was disgusting. I took it literally, and could not understand why someone would be bringing up sniffing genitals while we were discussing circumcision.

It was an odd conversation. I do try my best to "get" the meaning, and will often ask questions. I was raised with a lot of sarcasm (thanks to my aunt), and can often pick that up. I do not sit and discuss the "correct" meaning of words, etc..