Scientists Test 'Trust Hormone' For Autism Fight

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ShadesOfMe
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06 Jan 2011, 1:40 pm

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/03/132473913 ... tism-fight


opinions?


I dislike how they say that trust and empathy are impaired in people who have autism. if anything, people with Autism can be *overly* trusting, that's why we get taken advantage of so much.



wavefreak58
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06 Jan 2011, 1:50 pm

So I can't read people well enough to figure out their true intentions, but I'm going to take a drug that makes it easier for me to trust them?

Is it just me or is there a problem with this?


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ShadesOfMe
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06 Jan 2011, 1:54 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
So I can't read people well enough to figure out their true intentions, but I'm going to take a drug that makes it easier for me to trust them?

Is it just me or is there a problem with this?
Yes. Everything. That's just calling for more problems.



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06 Jan 2011, 1:55 pm

It's not a "trust hormone" and what was actually shown was that it turns us NT (causing us to ally with people to turn against others and gain more than our fair share, and form excessively high opinions of the people we just happened to ally with and excessively low opinions of the people we turned on-- when I say "we" I mean autistics in general; I was not part of this study). So long as it's not forced on us (...which it might well be), we're fine.


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conundrum
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06 Jan 2011, 2:06 pm

Here's another problem with this: unless people with autism have a DEFICIT of oxytocin to begin with (and I don't think that's ever been studied/demonstrated), giving them more of it would be pointless. Someone quoted in the article even pointed out that it might decrease sensitivity to the hormone's effects, meaning that it might be more harmful than helpful in the long run for that reason, too (not to mention the potential side effects) and actually impair "trust" (and yes, that's up for debate too)!

Five words here: Did Not Do The Research in real life. DANGEROUS.


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06 Jan 2011, 2:30 pm

Yeah...considering it's such a small study with bad side-effects for short term use...I'd prefer to find the actual research article and read that, if one was made and if I felt like it. Based on Conundrum's post. Why do children need to cuddle more?
It can't be forced on anyone...that's medically unethical, unless you are under consenting age. Then your guardian has to consent for you. What's with the NT hate? They're not all like this! It doesn't make a person evil.
It's been theorized that oxytocin has something to do with socialization, at least in animal models. Abnormalities in oxytocin and vassopresin in neurotransmission and all that. Oxytocin, vasopressin, and autism article. Biological Psychiatry



wavefreak58
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06 Jan 2011, 3:35 pm

jamesongerbil wrote:
Yeah...considering it's such a small study with bad side-effects for short term use...I'd prefer to find the actual research article and read that, if one was made and if I felt like it. Based on Conundrum's post. Why do children need to cuddle more?
It can't be forced on anyone...that's medically unethical, unless you are under consenting age. Then your guardian has to consent for you. What's with the NT hate? They're not all like this! It doesn't make a person evil.
It's been theorized that oxytocin has something to do with socialization, at least in animal models. Abnormalities in oxytocin and vassopresin in neurotransmission and all that. Oxytocin, vasopressin, and autism article. Biological Psychiatry


No NT hate here. To be more precise, the hormone seems to help make social interaction easier. But if all it does is mimic the feeling you would get by the natural release of the hormone, then you have removed the behaviors that normally cause such a release. It would seem logical that if I could recognize behaviors that signal bonding and safety I would release the hormone naturally. If supplying the hormone in absence of those behaviors creates the feelings of bonding and safety, then I am in a state of mind incongruent with reality.

I would need to see a study that demonstrated oxytocin helps an autistic RECOGNIZE social cues better, not just feel like they are more social.


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06 Jan 2011, 3:39 pm

Indeed. Recognizing others behaviors would be way more beneficial. I wouldn't even have to be more social, I'd be in a better state already.
Not you, Wavefreak, I was calling out Dandelion.



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06 Jan 2011, 6:10 pm

conundrum wrote:
Here's another problem with this: unless people with autism have a DEFICIT of oxytocin to begin with (and I don't think that's ever been studied/demonstrated), giving them more of it would be pointless. Someone quoted in the article even pointed out that it might decrease sensitivity to the hormone's effects, meaning that it might be more harmful than helpful in the long run for that reason, too (not to mention the potential side effects) and actually impair "trust" (and yes, that's up for debate too)!

Five words here: Did Not Do The Research in real life. DANGEROUS.


Yes, I agree with that. If a deficit of oxytocin hasn't been demonstrated . . . why play around with it?

Oh, wait, I know. $$$$$$$$$$ :roll:



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06 Jan 2011, 6:33 pm

I can either be too trusting or overly cautious of people.
As a kid I was scared of people. That's kind of coming back too.

I don't want this. I don't want to people to suddenly like me because I'm more normal. I want them to love me for who I am.

Quote:
Oxytocin affects the part of the nervous system that controls functions like heart rate, breathing and digestion. Prescription versions carry warnings about side effects, including bleeding and seizures.

I already have these issues. Pretty much the medication that gave/aggravated these symptoms did make me more social, although too impulsive to care about others emotions.


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06 Jan 2011, 6:51 pm

I read a thread about this on Aspies for Freedom. One woman said she'd been on oxytocin and that it turned her NT...and she said she felt violated? Anyway, she brought this study up to confirm her earlier threads on the subject.

I do not trust the idea.



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06 Jan 2011, 7:05 pm

Verdandi wrote:
I read a thread about this on Aspies for Freedom. One woman said she'd been on oxytocin and that it turned her NT...and she said she felt violated? Anyway, she brought this study up to confirm her earlier threads on the subject.

I do not trust the idea.


Having never been NT, how would one now what it was like to be able to say they have become that? The best you can claim is that you are different. But while it may be different than a previously autistic state, it may still be different from NT. In fac, I would think it is likely that it is still not NT.


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06 Jan 2011, 7:10 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
Verdandi wrote:
I read a thread about this on Aspies for Freedom. One woman said she'd been on oxytocin and that it turned her NT...and she said she felt violated? Anyway, she brought this study up to confirm her earlier threads on the subject.

I do not trust the idea.


Having never been NT, how would one now what it was like to be able to say they have become that? The best you can claim is that you are different. But while it may be different than a previously autistic state, it may still be different from NT. In fac, I would think it is likely that it is still not NT.

Going on SSRI meds I felt the same way. Less obsessional. Less anxiety. Less routines. Still rubbish at socialising.
I even left this forum for awhile.
Ah, but then my sensory issues got worse and the meds stopped working.


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06 Jan 2011, 7:26 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
Verdandi wrote:
I read a thread about this on Aspies for Freedom. One woman said she'd been on oxytocin and that it turned her NT...and she said she felt violated? Anyway, she brought this study up to confirm her earlier threads on the subject.

I do not trust the idea.


Having never been NT, how would one now what it was like to be able to say they have become that? The best you can claim is that you are different. But while it may be different than a previously autistic state, it may still be different from NT. In fac, I would think it is likely that it is still not NT.


While you make a fair point, I was paraphrasing her, have no particular dog in this argument except to mention that the one autistic person I know of who's been on oxytocin felt it made her feel like an NT and that she said it was violating.

I agree with you, although I wouldn't bother to argue the point with her beyond asking for clarification.



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07 Jan 2011, 1:35 am

wavefreak58 wrote:
So I can't read people well enough to figure out their true intentions, but I'm going to take a drug that makes it easier for me to trust them?

Is it just me or is there a problem with this?


I had to believe everyone is out to screw me over if I didn't the kids in school would have taken even more advantage of me then what they did. I can not even take a compliment without believing the person is making a veiled insult towards me due to the many people who did this to me in school. I am afraid to take the drug because it could knock down the defenses I erected to keep me from being played or mistreated.


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