Assertiveness and teaching people how to treat you.

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autisticstar
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27 Oct 2010, 1:38 pm

I have been doing a lot of reading lately about being assertive and "teaching people how to treat you." It has been said that people treat other people poorly because they allow it. I don't think that this excuses violent or cruel behavior in other people. However, in relationships with other people, especially some family members, I often feel like I am treated like I am some kind of a joke, like I am only half of a person. I realize that not everyone will like me and want to be my friend, and I understand that. However, I still feel like I am often treated as if I don't count, like I'm not a real person. How can I "teach people to treat me?" Has anyone found ways to stand up for themselves without resorting to yelling, cursing, or physical violence?



Corp900
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27 Oct 2010, 1:46 pm

Im in the same situation but the thing is, the same goes with my small circle of friends also, what you have to do is say on the inside f**k them, and you have to start making your own money enough to live away from them, cut them off, they wont respect you for your past behavior and your mental and social level that they already know of, so ***** them. You have to become independent, even if it means sleeping under a bridge.



ediself
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27 Oct 2010, 2:30 pm

no, living under a bridge will only teach people to treat you worse.....i really want someone to answer this thread an dgive some tips, i have been trying myself , and i found remaining calm is a must. it's really hard to do when you're being treated like some sort of nice pet who should stay in its place. but i found using the "cliché"sentence "i don't like the way you are speaking to me"and stating your opinion in a firm voice works.
Trouble is....it only works when you're aware of how they are exactly dismissing you. then you can point at it and say: this. i don't like. otherwise, if it's all very vague and you just feel uncomfortable without knowing what right of yours they are walking over exactly, well,maybe saying something short and self assured could work.Like "i am a grown up, i can think for myself"

i think what would work would be acting like a CEO. just cut them in their tracks if they are trying to impose on you and state what you want to do, and the fact that you are entirely capable of it and need nobody's opinion.
it's hard to apply on the moment though. i should try and follow my own advice :P



wavefreak58
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27 Oct 2010, 3:05 pm

Ironically, this is part of what has led me to believe I am on the spectrum. I figured out at some point that you don't get anything if you don't ask. So I've spent a lot of energy "asking" by trying to be more assertive. But I SUCKED at it so bad that it actually made things worse. I regularly and sometime spectacularly failed and communicating and often leaving people mad and me utterly baffled.



azurecrayon
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27 Oct 2010, 3:43 pm

that particular saying isnt completely accurate. nice people will usually treat you nice no matter what, and some not nice people will treat you not nice regardless of what you say or do. a lot of it has to do with the other's personality. but certainly there are some people that will take advantage of you and treat you poorly if you allow it, but i havent found these to be the majority.

in those situations, simply standing up to them will often make them back down. remain calm, as ediself suggests, thats imperative. be firm and refrain from being emotional. be specific if you can, "when you say ___ it makes me feel ___". try to maintain logical and rational assertions, and leave no room for argument. if they try to argue, restate your case, refuse to engage in argument, and then walk away. if they ask for more clarification, give them that. if it doesnt work the first time, do it again.

keep in mind, sometimes people dont recognize how they are treating you and that you feel negatively about it. its often best to go into it with that idea in mind, giving them a chance to learn how you perceive it and then they can change it. remember that autistics and nts often perceive things in different ways.

"i statements" are really good for this kind of talk, they take the accusation out of telling someone how they are making you feel and put it in a more neutral manner. an i statement is rephrasing your words to use i instead of you, and focusing on how you are receiving and feeling about their words rather than accusing them of doing things to you. for example, saying "i feel angry when you do this" instead of saying "you make me angry".

hope some of that gives you some ideas =)


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Janissy
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27 Oct 2010, 3:44 pm

A key component of being assertive is being decisive. You don't have to be angry with other people or wait for them to dissmiss you and then fight back. Instead, make your decisions and stand by them calmly but firmly. People take you more seriously when it is clear that you are in control of all your life's decisions.

This can be particularly hard with family. They knew you as a child and if they are your parents or other older relatives who sometimes supervised you, they made decisions for you because you couldn't do it for yourself. Now you make your own life decisions but family (especially parents or anybody else who was a caregiver) will be very reluctant to accept this. Currently they clearly don't accept it. You are still a child in their eyes, not taken seriously as children often aren't.

People who have to learn to be assertive find that it's a lot easier to be assertive with non-relatives because they never knew you as a child. Your best place to start practicing assertiveness isn't with your family because they will just shoot you down and laugh and call it cute or silly or some other thing that shows they don't take you seriously. The best place to start learning a new skill of assertiveness...which is actually decisiveness....is with the people who are expecting it from you, people in the service industry. When you go to a restaurant and place your order, you are expected to be assertive. This doesn't mean you are angry or curt with the waiter. It merely means that you decide exactly what you want to eat and state it. "I would like the chicken soup and a glass of water, no ice please". That's assertive. And it's expected. Restaurants and other places are probably the very best places to practice being assertive because your assertiveness is a part of the expected social script.

Practice on waiters, counter clerks and literally everybody else before you try with your family. Family is the absolute hardest to be assertive with so you want some positive practice before you have a go with them. When the time comes, you state your decision as firmly as you state your dinner order to a waiter. I still have to psych myself up before stating a decision to my Dad and I've been assertive with literally everybody else for decades now. Family is the hardest

. If you have made a decision about your life that you want to be accepted and not shot down or picked apart by your family, you have to have absolute conviction that it is the right decision. Tell them, but don't yell or otherwise get upset or cave in when they tell youthat it's a bad decision and they know better and you can't be trusted tyo decide for yourself. If they disagree, then fine. Part of being assertive is accepting that they may not agree and doing it anyway. Your own decision is the one that matters. If you make a decision and follow through on it, your family will be more inclined to take you seriously in the future. Especially if you do not cave in or re-think your decision. If you are unsure, go to other people for feedback on whether a decision is wise or not (there is feedback aplenty on WP, that's for sure). To be taken seriously by your family, they need to see that you are living life on your own terms and that you are unruffled by their scoffing perception of you and in fact their perception of you does not affect your decisions. Part of that is not getting angry and yelling when they shoot you down. You just go ahead and do it anyway.



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27 Oct 2010, 8:14 pm

Never had any success getting someone who did not already either get me or respect me to change treatment.

I can talk - but even if they listen they often do not have ears to hear.



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23 Nov 2010, 4:21 pm

AS,
I have always been assertive ever since I was born otherwise people will eat you alive. I recently had to be assertive with several people in who I have known for quite a while. When being assertive, it's always best to talk about the problems that you might be having with someone by walking all over you. The beat way to tackle that would be to tell them how much you appreciate them and that you enjoy their company. You then go into the juicy details by talking about yourself. By that, I mean telling them that you issues that you are having or will have with a situation. For instance, I recently was in a wedding for a friend and other friend was in the wedding with me as a bride's maids. I live alone and I would happen to be on the way to the church. I asked them for a ride but they told me no because they were evidently too busy to do so. So, I sent her mother a polite e-mail talking about how much I appreciated her and then I told her that it would take me nearly 2 hours to get down to the church by bus. That led to her apologizing to me and then explaining their situation without having a heart attack about it.



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24 Nov 2010, 2:22 am

Corp900 wrote:
Im in the same situation but the thing is, the same goes with my small circle of friends also, what you have to do is say on the inside f**k them, and you have to start making your own money enough to live away from them, cut them off, they wont respect you for your past behavior and your mental and social level that they already know of, so ***** them. You have to become independent, even if it means sleeping under a bridge.


I think what you might mean (tell me if I’m wrong) is that you suggest one should get themselves into a position where they can afford more choices which include the people you can avoid seeing and avoid having the old reputation tarnish the image you would prefer people have of you (one that would command more respect). It could mean moving to a new area (rather than sleeping under a bridge ).

In a new area you can start again and maybe initially try to ‘act’ in a way that commands you more respect. The old Aspie traits will still come through though I guess but hopefully by then the first impression will be one that commands equal respect strongly enough not to let the traits that usually mean you get less respect take over.
It is hard to know if this would work though and I can imagine it is a fantasy of many people who have felt lesser respected than other people.


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24 Nov 2010, 2:43 am

When I Googled ‘teaching people how to treat you’ I read an example of how to deal with a person that is ½ late late to meet you most of the time. If you have not already seen it, it went something like this.

I really enjoy meeting up with you and having time to talk/doing things together and I know how hard it can be when there are problems with traffic/public transport so I suggest that if we are more than 15 minutes late that we don’t wait. What do you think?

This tells them you like them and their company
It lays no blame on them
It acknowledges their reason for being late but puts out the message that even if it is not their fault it is not a reason for you to suffer waiting for too long for a person to turn up.
At the end it shows that you respect that they have a right to express their opinion on the idea you suggest.

(This pattern of communication can be used in other scenarios)

If they were to say you are making a mountain out of a molehill or something that dismisses the reasonable suggestion. You could ell them that they would not be consistently late for work – so why for a social meeting.

If you really wanted to still see a person that dismisses that though you could be an hour late so if they are ½ hour late they either wait ½ for you or they assume you had been and gone. Either way it should make them know what is like.

Of course there is infinity of scenarios and many answers to each.


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24 Nov 2010, 2:54 am

When I worked with this assisstant manager at the resteraunt I kept asking him not to touch me or put his arm around my shoulder because it bothered me even the union told him to knock it off but he kept doing it. We had massive industrial rotissary cookers that had to greased ever so often. So I took some of the grease that was black as pitch and left big black hand prints all over his leather bomber jacket across the shoulders and arms where he would touch me all the time. (he managed to wipe almost all of it off) He tried to get me fired but the union protected me because no one saw me put the grease on his jacket. :P :twisted: He went out out of his way to touch me after that and then adding big bear hugs to his harrassment so the union made the company to move him to another resteraunt. :roll:


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Morph500
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24 Nov 2010, 3:11 am

Todesking wrote:
When I worked with this assisstant manager at the resteraunt I kept asking him not to touch me or put his arm around my shoulder because it bothered me even the union told him to knock it off but he kept doing it. We had massive industrial rotissary cookers that had to greased ever so often. So I took some of the grease that was black as pitch and left big black hand prints all over his leather bomber jacket across the shoulders and arms where he would touch me all the time. (he managed to wipe almost all of it off) He tried to get me fired but the union protected me because no one saw me put the grease on his jacket. :P :twisted: He went out out of his way to touch me after that and then adding big bear hugs to his harrassment so the union made the company to move him to another resteraunt. :roll:


whoa dude, awsome, are you a chick or a dude btw?



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24 Nov 2010, 3:49 am

I do the same thing to them that they do to me, in a slightly more exaggerated way. If they talk down to me, I talk down to them right back. I "mirror" them. If someone were touching me at work every few hours, I'd make it my mission to touch them every 10 minutes with dirty hands or to continually close my hands over their eyes from behind and say "guess who!" I take their own behavior and escalate it right back at them. However, this doesn't go over well and people consider me "nasty" even though I only did to them what they did to me, and stopped when they stopped. Yet it quickly ends their unwanted behavior.

Another tactic I've recently started with success is to immediately start talking of nothing except the tone of their voice, what they said condescendingly, or whatever else the problem is. Whatever they were trying to say or do comes to a complete standstill until we have a thorough discussion about their tone of voice etc. After 2 - 3 consecutive times of their conversation being interrupted by these boring and unpleasant side-topics, they become avoidant of triggering them. This has actually been extremely successful and I plan to continue in this manner.

If I feel especially vicious towards them, I'll combine method 1 and 2, which means that I'll interrupt whatever they were saying or doing to have a long and boring conversation about their tone of voice or something inappropriate they said, AND I will continually bring it up at every opportunity afterwards. For example a social worker once told me I was "overbearing", at which point I insisted on a long discussion on the meaning of the word "overbearing", and whenever I saw her I'd use the word "overbearing" at every opportunity and ask her whether I was being overbearing now? How about now? How about now, am I overbearing now? Is this overbearing? Is that overbearing? She left me the hell alone after that.



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24 Nov 2010, 4:06 am

You can't teach anything to anyone who doesn't want to learn. :?



ediself
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24 Nov 2010, 4:45 am

menintights wrote:
You can't teach anything to anyone who doesn't want to learn. :?


it's the truth.
But you can "make " them ! by putting your foot down.



Last edited by ediself on 24 Nov 2010, 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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24 Nov 2010, 6:38 am

Usually if someone mistreats me, I avoid them all together. If it is like family or such, I just give them the silent treatment and go about my buisness...then when they ask what my problem is...I will politely tell them what they did.
I refuse to beg and b***h for respect and regard. I dont bother fighting people who dont treat me right, I just dont give them the time of day.
Not saying anything, says alot more than anything you can say because only when you ignore them, do they reflect what they may have done to push you away. As long as you are fussing at them, they are comfortable and dont feel the need to change.
And while you are avoiding them, stay busy and pretend that you dont have time for them.
I promice you that you can yell, scream, throw things, but when it comes to getting people in your life to reflect on their own actions, only silence will get their attention.


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