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Raziel
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02 May 2013, 5:37 am

I feel like a mixture between schioztypal, schizoid and social phobia.

I totally fit in the diagnostic criteria of schizoid PD of the ICD-10, not really them in the DSM-IV they are more strict and also in the diagnostic criteria of schizotypal, expecially those of the DSM-IV and partly those af the ICD-10 because both have slightly different opinions of those disorders.

The ICD-10 of schizoid PD also mentions "high levels of fantasy" and so on, that applyes to me.
But I'm also a bit social phobic, but mostly I want to stay alone.

I think it's partly my ASD, but not totally because this pattern changes over time and age. It's difficult to explain, but I mostly didn't have this trait as a teenager and than it came back and I've the feeling it's more psychological.

I don't feel avoidant, because mostly I like being alone, eventhough sometimes people scare me and I've a high level of fantasy, especially in those periods of lonelyness.
But I also have some fiew contacts. That's why the DSM-IV doesn't really apply to me, concerning schizoid PD.


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Last edited by Raziel on 02 May 2013, 5:03 pm, edited 6 times in total.

redrobin62
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02 May 2013, 6:25 am

<--- Garden variety AvPD.



Raziel
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02 May 2013, 8:21 am

redrobin62 wrote:
<--- Garden variety AvPD.


yeah, the only reason why I don't fit in the AvPD is that I don't care that much about social contact.
I read through the description of StPD and SPD and both sounded more like me.

The thing is, that the DSM and the ICD have about both disorders (StPD and SPD) slightly different fiews.


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Last edited by Raziel on 02 May 2013, 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Raziel
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02 May 2013, 4:54 pm

24 Points

If your total is  21-24 you can consider yourself a  LOW schizoid


http://www.schizoids.info/tests.html


Well at least just a "low schizoid" :lol:
But that seems about right. 8O


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Raziel
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04 May 2013, 2:34 pm

Found that and liked that, felt a bit like me:


Avoidants who become schizoid
Some personalities who are avoidant in origin, may become schizoid.
The frustrations and humiliations they experience generate an overwhelming anger.
So-called “defence mechanisms” provide a solution to the conflict by isolating and repressing
their anger and their emotions.
The person, who is left with few emotions, has become schizoid – not a pure schizoid, but an intermediate schizoid.
This ‘converted’ schizoid yearns for social relations, but is incapable.
The resultant anxiety, rather than the social indifference, leads to intense loneliness

It is not only avoidants who stand the risk of becoming schizoid, but also obsessives.
DSM-I and DSM-II integrate schizoid and avoidant in the same group,
while DSM-III place the avoidant in a different group.
ICD-10 theorizes that the schizoid fantasizes, but this
is more true of the schizoid-avoidant than of the pure schizoid.

I mention this here merely for clarity, and for the sake of interest.
And continue on the premise that ICD-10 and DSM-IV are similar.



http://www.schizoids.info/avoidant.html

Actually that what the ICD-10 describes under "schizoid" better fits the "older" picture of schizoid who is a mixture out of the "emotionless schizoid", the avoidant and the schizotypal. The DSM-IV sees that a bit different. Also the ICD-10 moves the "schizotypal" closer to schizophrenia (also in it's symptoms), where as in the DSM-IV it's considered to be a personality disorder.

So in the ICD-10 it's more like this:
Schizophrenia-specrum:
- schizoid PD (less severe)
- schizotype disorder (medium severe)
- schizophrenia (extreme severe)

were as the DSM-IV splits more the schizoid and the schizotypal were the schizoid just has the negative symptoms and the schizotypal mild positive symptoms. The avoidant is moved to the Cluster C. But avoidant more a mixture out of the "original schizoid" concept (that's still described in the ICD-10) and anxiety disorders if you will.
The "pure" schizoid PD how it is described in the DSM-IV, with the emotionless is rare.

Actually that's highly interesting. It also explains why many patients show a mixture of symptoms of all three disorders.


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catwhisperer
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07 May 2013, 12:02 pm

Sometimes I think the various personality disorders do not take into account aspergers or another underlying issue. The criteria for all of those relates to aspergers. At least for me. I avoid social situations because 1) its hard work for me, 2) I don't kno what to say or act 3) always end up saying the wrong thing, and 4) feel frazzled and exhausted afterwards and obsess over how I messed everything up again. Are there reasons not related to aspergers that you avoid people?

In another post I asked about schizotypal because I score high on the free online assessments. But I think that's because of things that I do related to aspergers. So how many characeristics do you have that could not be explained as part of aspergers....?



Raziel
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07 May 2013, 12:27 pm

catwhisperer wrote:
Sometimes I think the various personality disorders do not take into account aspergers or another underlying issue. The criteria for all of those relates to aspergers. At least for me. I avoid social situations because 1) its hard work for me, 2) I don't kno what to say or act 3) always end up saying the wrong thing, and 4) feel frazzled and exhausted afterwards and obsess over how I messed everything up again. Are there reasons not related to aspergers that you avoid people?

In another post I asked about schizotypal because I score high on the free online assessments. But I think that's because of things that I do related to aspergers. So how many characeristics do you have that could not be explained as part of aspergers....?


What irritates me is the fact that I was a very social person until puberty. 8O
So there must be something else than ASD, because I was clearly already autistic back than. I'm not sure, maybe it has more to do with the fact that I'm transgender and withdraw because I avoidet talking to people and I didn't wanted them to find out about it or because of other reasons. :?
I think it has several different reasons, not just ASD.

But other than that I think, maybe others, diagnosed with those conditions, also have underlying neurological brain abnormalities going on, just in their case we don't know for certain and call it therefor a personality disorder!? :?


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catwhisperer
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07 May 2013, 1:42 pm

Diagnoses sometimes have more to do with the focus for that particular therapist. Some look for personality disorders first and then consider ASD later. For me, aspergers is the only thing that seems to fully capture what its like to be me. My former eating disorder, and my chronic PTSD stem from aspergers. So that's two diagnoses for me at this point. :wink:

I think people with aspergers can have various degrees of social interaction, and I guess what I was thinking was we can avoid social interactions due to aspergers without it being a separate issue.

And it looks like aspergers combined with clairvoyance can be considered schizotypal. What do you think? I've tried getting more info on it, but I mostly have the diagnostic criteria and some information from the internet.



Raziel
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07 May 2013, 5:18 pm

catwhisperer wrote:
Diagnoses sometimes have more to do with the focus for that particular therapist. Some look for personality disorders first and then consider ASD later. For me, aspergers is the only thing that seems to fully capture what its like to be me. My former eating disorder, and my chronic PTSD stem from aspergers. So that's two diagnoses for me at this point. :wink:


Yeah, I also once had PTSD (still many symptoms left, but it's getting better) and I needed a long time to understand that it happened because I didn't understand the situation right and so on. Well, it didn't helped totally. :?

catwhisperer wrote:
And it looks like aspergers combined with clairvoyance can be considered schizotypal. What do you think? I've tried getting more info on it, but I mostly have the diagnostic criteria and some information from the internet.


I don't know. I've some articles about the relationship from schizotypal and ASD.
It's propably really just sometimes from wich side certain psychiatrists are seeing your problems.
I've had clear autistic symptoms since very early on (speech delay and so on), but I also identify to some degree with the schizophrenic spectrum (schizoid and schizotypal) what propably also has a lot to do with the fact that my half-brother had schizophrenia and so I'm very avare about the similarities (and differences) of the two spectrums: ASD and the schizophrenic spectrum.

Here some articles, that might interest you :D

Schizophrenia and Autism compared
http://the-mouse-trap.blogspot.de/2006/ ... tures.html

and here that's very interesting:
The Relationship of Asperger’s Characteristics and Schizotypal Personality Traits in a Non-clinical Adult Sample
http://libres.uncg.edu/ir/uncg/f/T_Kwap ... p_2006.pdf

The Evolution of Autistic-Like and Schizotypal Traits: A Sexual Selection Hypothesis
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3153759/

I can identify very much with this one:
Overlapping phenotypes - a clinical and magnetic resonance imaging investigation of schizotypy and pervasive developmental disorders in adolescents with cognitive impairment
http://www.era.lib.ed.ac.uk/handle/1842/1947

and this one, also highly intersting:
Controversies in autism: is a broader model of social disorders needed?
http://www.capmh.com/content/7/1/9

Dimensional schizotypy, autism, and unusual word associations in artists and scientists
http://eppl604-autism-and-creativity.wm ... icle-5.pdf


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