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OddFinn
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13 Jun 2011, 12:57 pm

nick007 wrote:
...the behavior is illegal or could warrant a restraining-order


Yes, that's my daughter's ex-boyfriend :evil:


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13 Jun 2011, 12:58 pm

KenM wrote:
What gets me is these unwritten social rules and how people think what stalker behavior is.

This could be Female/ male but I'll use male to female as an example. I also don't mean to say all women are like this, but for example:

I'm interested in a girl, she has no interest in me. But I call her like 3 times in one day, leaving messages everytime. She thinks I'm a stalker and tells me to leave her alone. But if someone she likes does the exact same thing, that's ok.


Limit those calls to two. You could just say you weren't sure if she got your first message and ..... For some reason more than two sounds desperate and would sure make me start analyzing.



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13 Jun 2011, 1:59 pm

Laz wrote:
I guess that depends what is motivating the stalker to do what they do to begin with. I'm uncertain that all stalkers are predatory people who are seeking those out with vulnerabilities to exploit, disempower and dominate. I think the motivations will vary quite considerably.

Absolutely, just keep in mind the damage done will be the same regardless of intentions.

TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
Both can be extremely scary, and motivation does vary. However, one thing all romantic stalkers have in common is the delusion that they are in some kind of relationship with their victim.

Exactly and even if there has been a relationship in the past by the time the stalking begins there isn't one or at least not the way the stalker sees it.

nick007 wrote:
I think the word stalker shouldn't be used unless the behavior is illegal or could warrant a restraining-order

I agree.

KenM wrote:
I'm interested in a girl, she has no interest in me. But I call her like 3 times in one day, leaving messages everytime. She thinks I'm a stalker and tells me to leave her alone. But if someone she likes does the exact same thing, that's ok.

Consent is the key word here.


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13 Jun 2011, 2:32 pm

hurtloam wrote:
keira wrote:
hurtloam wrote:
I'm sorry to hear of your experience, that must have been scary.

But I would say that a stalker is someone who persistantly crosses over boundaries to the point where it makes you uncomfortable and begins to scare you. Especially when you repeatedly tell the person that you do not want them to contact you. It doesn't have to get this serious to qualify as stalking.


Thank you for your concern.
I agree with you that any persistent boundary-crossing attention that makes you feel uncomfortable and begins to scare you is wrong and could be called stalking. I described the situation I was in to explain my first post in this thread where I talked about stalkers delusional thinking and the reasons causing that kind of behavior. I think "delusional thinking" doesn't always apply in "milder" cases.
However I still don't think that occasional clueless breaking of unwritten social rules should be called stalking. I was referring to Jory (he posted just above my post).


I realised that you were refering to Jory's post about breaking unwritten social rules. That can scare people too and make them feel violated. They expect one thing to happen and then something completely different happens and they are scared because they feel that someone has crossed a line that they knew existed, but unknown to them, the other person didn't realise that this line was there.

This happend between a couple of people I know. We'll call them Alice and Lucy. They met at a party and Alice wanted to be friends with Lucy and they exchanged cell phone numbers. However Alice kept on texting Lucy throughout the next day. I suggested that she might be better off waiting for Lucy to text back before texting her again, but she didn't see why she should hold off. They had got on well the night before, so why would Lucy mind the texts? They were friends now. I later found out that after that Alice had phoned Lucy 15 times in one day. Lucy hadn't been out and had forgoten her cell phone. At the end of the day she was freaked out by the amount of missed calls she had from one person whom she had only met a few days before.

Alice didn't understand that she had broken an unwritten rule and kept trying to get in touch with Lucy not realising that her behaviour seemed obsessive and stalker like. This scared Lucy who then changed her phone number. A stalker doesn't neccesarily mean any harm, they can be a lonely, over-enthusiastic person who doesn't understand social rules. When people break the social rules it can be scary. You don't know whether they mean harm or not. You just know that you feel violated.



And the stalker still may not get the hint and just think they are having phone problems or they maybe lost their phone and got a new number and forgot to tell them.

This reminds me of Jerry Newport. When he was in college, he met a girl in his math class she liked. He kept talking to her and trying to ask her out and then he was calling her when she wasn't in math class anymore. Then one day a student showed up at his dorm and told him off about it. He told him why she hadn't been in his math class anymore and how she had been feeling by him and he told him the three strike rule. You can only ask the same person out three times and if they say no every time, do not ask them out again.


But my question for that is, what if they asked you out finally after they have had three strikes with you? Can you ask them out again since they had asked you out finally?



keira
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13 Jun 2011, 2:58 pm

League_Girl wrote:
And the stalker still may not get the hint and just think they are having phone problems or they maybe lost their phone and got a new number and forgot to tell them.

This reminds me of Jerry Newport. When he was in college, he met a girl in his math class she liked. He kept talking to her and trying to ask her out and then he was calling her when she wasn't in math class anymore. Then one day a student showed up at his dorm and told him off about it. He told him why she hadn't been in his math class anymore and how she had been feeling by him and he told him the three strike rule. You can only ask the same person out three times and if they say no every time, do not ask them out again.


But my question for that is, what if they asked you out finally after they have had three strikes with you? Can you ask them out again since they had asked you out finally?


Sorry, League_Girl, I can give you no answers because seriously? Hints? Three strike rule? How are we supposed to know?
I don't think anyone should complain about unwanted attention if all they did was giving hints and relying on some unwritten social rules. Everyone should be entitled to some clarity and honesty. Otherwise every socially clueless person could be called a stalker :roll:



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13 Jun 2011, 3:10 pm

blue_bean wrote:
Becaue they want to feel a connection to you, find out things about you, but are too inept to interact with you to do so. They are having a one-sided relationship with you.
They don't want it to be a one-sided relationship, and that frustrates them and drives them to step over the boundaries by stalking.


Yes.
They don't want it one sided, and are unable to interact in a healthy manner. This is a far as it can go. I'd say if it could develope into something, (say, if he was handsome), likely it would center on her as an object and would burnout in time-- possibly going abusive-- if that was his hangup.



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13 Jun 2011, 3:58 pm

i learned a lot from reading this thread. i haven't ever stalked someone, nor have i ever been stalked, so it was sort of a mystery to me. it's very interesting, and very strange. i wonder if it is a modern phenomenon?


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13 Jun 2011, 4:05 pm

Mdyar wrote:
blue_bean wrote:
Becaue they want to feel a connection to you, find out things about you, but are too inept to interact with you to do so. They are having a one-sided relationship with you.
They don't want it to be a one-sided relationship, and that frustrates them and drives them to step over the boundaries by stalking.


Yes.
They don't want it one sided, and are unable to interact in a healthy manner. This is a far as it can go. I'd say if it could develope into something, (say, if he was handsome), likely it would center on her as an object and would burnout in time-- possibly going abusive-- if that was his hangup.


Off topic, but I love your avatar.


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13 Jun 2011, 4:05 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
i learned a lot from reading this thread. i haven't ever stalked someone, nor have i ever been stalked, so it was sort of a mystery to me. it's very interesting, and very strange. i wonder if it is a modern phenomenon?

The advances with the internet & other technology is making it easier for people to stalk. Stalkers can find out where the stalkee will be from their facebook status updates or the stalker could hack & track the GPS on the stalkeee's phone for example


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Mdyar
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13 Jun 2011, 4:13 pm

zen_mistress wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
blue_bean wrote:
Becaue they want to feel a connection to you, find out things about you, but are too inept to interact with you to do so. They are having a one-sided relationship with you.
They don't want it to be a one-sided relationship, and that frustrates them and drives them to step over the boundaries by stalking.


Yes.
They don't want it one sided, and are unable to interact in a healthy manner. This is a far as it can go. I'd say if it could develope into something, (say, if he was handsome), likely it would center on her as an object and would burnout in time-- possibly going abusive-- if that was his hangup.


Off topic, but I love your avatar.


Off topic: Thanks, it is a pretty but hostile world. (a Wiki picture.)



zen_mistress
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13 Jun 2011, 4:36 pm

Mdyar wrote:
zen_mistress wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
blue_bean wrote:
Becaue they want to feel a connection to you, find out things about you, but are too inept to interact with you to do so. They are having a one-sided relationship with you.
They don't want it to be a one-sided relationship, and that frustrates them and drives them to step over the boundaries by stalking.


Yes.
They don't want it one sided, and are unable to interact in a healthy manner. This is a far as it can go. I'd say if it could develope into something, (say, if he was handsome), likely it would center on her as an object and would burnout in time-- possibly going abusive-- if that was his hangup.


Off topic, but I love your avatar.


Off topic: Thanks, it is a pretty but hostile world. (a Wiki picture.)


Yes, but is it any more hostile than this one?


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13 Jun 2011, 6:25 pm

nick007 wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
i learned a lot from reading this thread. i haven't ever stalked someone, nor have i ever been stalked, so it was sort of a mystery to me. it's very interesting, and very strange. i wonder if it is a modern phenomenon?

The advances with the internet & other technology is making it easier for people to stalk. Stalkers can find out where the stalkee will be from their facebook status updates or the stalker could hack & track the GPS on the stalkeee's phone for example

yeah, i can see that being a problem. i wonder what it was like 500 years ago or something? like, in a village of 500 or so, where mobility was less common and everyone knew everyone else's business, would there have been the same problem?


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Mdyar
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13 Jun 2011, 7:36 pm

zen_mistress wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
zen_mistress wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
blue_bean wrote:
Becaue they want to feel a connection to you, find out things about you, but are too inept to interact with you to do so. They are having a one-sided relationship with you.
They don't want it to be a one-sided relationship, and that frustrates them and drives them to step over the boundaries by stalking.


Yes.
They don't want it one sided, and are unable to interact in a healthy manner. This is a far as it can go. I'd say if it could develope into something, (say, if he was handsome), likely it would center on her as an object and would burnout in time-- possibly going abusive-- if that was his hangup.


Off topic, but I love your avatar.


Off topic: Thanks, it is a pretty but hostile world. (a Wiki picture.)


Yes, but is it any more hostile than this one?
Figuratively, yes--but only by a few notches :lol:

(The temp. atmosphere ,pressure and winds clock 600 meters a second and would squash life in an instant.)

Edit: I think "600" is a wiki typo error. That is 1900 feet/ second. 1150 is supersonic.



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13 Jun 2011, 8:08 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
nick007 wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
i learned a lot from reading this thread. i haven't ever stalked someone, nor have i ever been stalked, so it was sort of a mystery to me. it's very interesting, and very strange. i wonder if it is a modern phenomenon?

The advances with the internet & other technology is making it easier for people to stalk. Stalkers can find out where the stalkee will be from their facebook status updates or the stalker could hack & track the GPS on the stalkeee's phone for example

yeah, i can see that being a problem. i wonder what it was like 500 years ago or something? like, in a village of 500 or so, where mobility was less common and everyone knew everyone else's business, would there have been the same problem?


From a point of computer security and from my own experiences both personal, and in the academical knowledge of the field of computer science and computer forensics Facebook make its too easy to do cybercrime: hacking, phising, social engineering attacks, malware attacks, cyberbullying and cyberstalking!



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14 Jun 2011, 1:35 am

cdfox7 wrote:
...

From a point of computer security and from my own experiences both personal, and in the academical knowledge of the field of computer science and computer forensics Facebook make its too easy to do cybercrime: hacking, phising, social engineering attacks, malware attacks, cyberbullying and cyberstalking!


It seems to be quite fashionable these days to disclose the colour of your underpants, phone no, school, workplace etc to the world. If anything it may take the fun out of cyberstalking etc because is too easy:)

I've had a read through here and I think Bloodheart hits the nail on the head perfectly re 'stalking' and stalking


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14 Jun 2011, 2:15 am

TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
Laz wrote:
Some of them used to be in a relationship with their victim too. 8O


Yes, and I believe those ones tend to be the violent type. Usually, it was a dysfunctional relationship to begin with.


My ex-husband is one of these type. I don't know if he is still doing it. :waves at ex husband who is probably reading this:.


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