Some verbally strong people and their attitude

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Sora
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02 Jun 2009, 7:28 am

Is that really just me or do others also get picked on or are outright treated as inferior by some of those people with strong language skills?

I have my moments when I have excellent language, especially in a 1-on-1 situation. But in group interaction and most normal everyday interaction, I struggle with language. I happen to use wrong grammar, struggle for words, use words incorrectly and so on.

So far, it's always been the language-savvy teenagers and middle-aged adults who had the nerve to try to treat me as if I was dumb and inferior for my speech/language deficits. I never give in but that seems to really anger them.

Sure, it's not all highly verbose people that treat others so. But if people tried to hardcore bully me or just treat me inferior, it's always been people who had high language abilities.

Is that something society spreads too? That high language skills mean you're a better person than someone who can't speak as well? Or is it just some few people being idiotic?


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Abstract_Logic
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02 Jun 2009, 7:46 am

As language is used everyday, usually without conscious awareness of it's specific function, it is no doubt considered a skill by everyone. So if one has poor language/speaking skills, their general intelligence is likely to be questioned. It isn't that the people who judge you are being idiotic, but they are merely being judgmental without knowing exactly what they are judging. They are being prejudiced. They are not aware that someone having poor language skills can have a considerable amount of intellect. Language, it seems, is like a window into someone's level of intellect. So, naturally, you are judged to be unintelligent if you have poor use of language. Language seems to govern intelligence to some degree. Language is also dependent on intelligence, but not as much as intelligence is dependent on language. Language skills can improve with the growth of intellect, more so than intellect can grow with the improvement of language. They have a mutual relationship, but intellect is more independent than language.

To draw an analogy: you have a very beautiful and high quality vehicle. This vehicle represents one's level of intellect. The better the vehicle, the higher the level of intellect. Language can represent the operator of the vehicle. Without a good operator, the vehicle may never be able to show it's full potential as a high quality vehicle. So if you don't know how to drive it, people will (wrongly) assume that the vehicle must not be that great. That is, given that they have no other knowledge of the vehicle's abilities and performance capacity (which is usually the case when you talk to strangers or people who know little about you).

So, it is likely that someone with high verbal ability will say "He's an idiot, he doesn't even know how or what he's talking about." That would be a prejudiced statement. The more appropriate way of describing it would be "He's not an idiot, he just needs to improve his ability to articulate his thoughts."

I apologize if this seems too complicated. It is early in the morning here in Chicago, IL so it is difficult for me to explain my thoughts (as I could use better language skills myself). So, if you do have any questions, I will likely be able to explain this post in a more clear and concise manner later on in the day.



Sora
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02 Jun 2009, 8:04 am

Oh gosh, I totally failed to remember this until now. Thank you for explaining it Abstract_Logic.

I just don't judge people based on their language and speech so it's hard to remember that others who do it do not do it on purpose and are often even unaware of that they're judgemental. I suppose that's where my autism shows again. I know something, have learnt something, but I can't quite remember it's true because it appears to be so mad.


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Abstract_Logic
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02 Jun 2009, 8:14 am

You're very welcome, Sora.

I understand what you are saying. Sometimes I forget a lot of things too. Sometimes I'll profess something and people will respond and tell me what's wrong with my post. Then I'll remember exactly what they are talking about and I'll feel dumb for not putting it in my original post. There is so much to learn and know in this life. No wonder I'm half-mad. :roll:

Take care :)



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02 Jun 2009, 8:30 am

It is like Abstract_Logic says, people are judged first on their language and words. In the past I had job interviews and I could not find the appropriate words to describe what I thought, I missed some jobs because of that. Not really nice, since I was qualified.

Now I follow some communication courses and try to practice.



outlier
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02 Jun 2009, 8:33 am

I have often experienced being treated as inferior due to my language skills.

Professors would patronize me terribly and automatically assume I had little intelligence. They would project all sorts of assumptions onto me. One treated me like a little girl/ornament for his office. He would call me in for special sessions where he'd just sit commenting on all my (what I now know as) autistic traits and not tutor me; he assumed I had little potential. He talked to me in a baby voice. When he realised I had acquaintances, he became quite scared and tried to respect me a little more, thinking my personhood was less questionable.

I would be advised to leave academia; one misunderstood my communication problem to such a degree he was too terrified to let me get a word in, and, when I wrote my thoughts down, told me he'd had no idea I was capable of coherent thought.

Other people would assume I was a child, a bit simple, rude, or boring.



Michjo
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02 Jun 2009, 8:39 am

I usually struggle with speaking, i usually have an idea of what i want to say, but i don't know the words to use. I'll end up going around in circles around my idea as to point people towards what i mean, most people don't have the patience. I tend to mix up pronouns a lot as well, and sometimes i just use the plain wrong words. I understand that words have multiple meanings and i don't tend to take things literally, but i tend to forget that some of the extra meanings are contextual. I guess my speech can be likened (only a little bit) to someone using a dictionary to write in a foreign language, and although being understood the wording leaves a lot to be desired.

So yes, i understand exactly what you are saying. I get judged on my speech all the time, and i don't think it's fair.



Erlyrisa
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02 Jun 2009, 8:57 am

you canhave bad languageskills and still bean ahol

People that r judgemental r jus that... has nothing to do with ur language skils (r u blonde)

forget them and try to brush it off... if those people r judgemental u can make judgement on them as being judgmental snobs.


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Xs142
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02 Jun 2009, 9:54 am

Stuttering people are also deemed as 'inferior' generally.
:roll:



GhostOfTheChameleon
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02 Jun 2009, 10:59 am

Yes, people generally tend to treat me pretty badly when they hear me try to speak.
I try not to open my mouth unless I know exactly what I'm going to say, but sometimes it's unavoidable even without preparation. Sometimes I do well, other times I just can't find the words.

My 4th grade teacher thought I was ret*d.
She was very surprised at my scores on the gifted tests. :)
Similarly, people at work are generally surprised when they read emails from me.

The old HR manager, here at work, used to talk to me like a 5-year-old.
Then she accused me of being sexist because I didn't respond very well to her condescending tone. Boy, she sure was surprised at the very nasty email I wrote to her. I thought I was sure to be fired, but she actually started treating me like a human being.



Abstract_Logic
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02 Jun 2009, 11:21 am

Michjo wrote:
I usually struggle with speaking, i usually have an idea of what i want to say, but i don't know the words to use. I'll end up going around in circles around my idea as to point people towards what i mean, most people don't have the patience. I tend to mix up pronouns a lot as well, and sometimes i just use the plain wrong words. I understand that words have multiple meanings and i don't tend to take things literally, but i tend to forget that some of the extra meanings are contextual. I guess my speech can be likened (only a little bit) to someone using a dictionary to write in a foreign language, and although being understood the wording leaves a lot to be desired.

So yes, i understand exactly what you are saying. I get judged on my speech all the time, and i don't think it's fair.


That is EXACTLY what I go through. Like you described, I feel like a foreigner using a dictionary to form my sentences. I mix up pronouns all the time. That is why I usually have to double check my writing. Speech is very difficult for me.

Someone needs to invent a mind-translating device that you hook up to your head and it reads your thoughts, translating them into proper speech. It would be neat to think about having one with EVERY single language. Then, I would certainly be a good diplomat.



Abstract_Logic
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02 Jun 2009, 11:26 am

GhostOfTheChameleon wrote:
Yes, people generally tend to treat me pretty badly when they hear me try to speak.
I try not to open my mouth unless I know exactly what I'm going to say, but sometimes it's unavoidable even without preparation. Sometimes I do well, other times I just can't find the words.

My 4th grade teacher thought I was ret*d.
She was very surprised at my scores on the gifted tests. :)
Similarly, people at work are generally surprised when they read emails from me.

The old HR manager, here at work, used to talk to me like a 5-year-old.
Then she accused me of being sexist because I didn't respond very well to her condescending tone. Boy, she sure was surprised at the very nasty email I wrote to her. I thought I was sure to be fired, but she actually started treating me like a human being.


Good for you, GhostOfTheChameleon! :lol:



activebutodd
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02 Jun 2009, 11:59 am

I have ok language, but it's useless when I'm under stress because the stress of dealing with people makes me freeze up or get confused.



Warsie
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03 Jun 2009, 1:57 am

Xs142 wrote:
Stuttering people are also deemed as 'inferior' generally.
:roll:


I try to speak louder to counter that. That helps me with debate. Gesturing also helps with that and assists my transferring the info.

In most people people are cool with that ^_^


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