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maleb
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13 Feb 2010, 9:13 am

MissConstrue wrote:
rmctagg09 wrote:
Personally, I feel that if you really thought that all of our problems would be fixed in a year, you're either naive or an idiot.


Well said.



Absolutely agree! That has been my feeling since he started campaigning! You can't change a machine that has been turning for 200+ years, especially when human nature is what keeps the wheel spinning.
I mean, if I knew that all it took to be president was promising things I would never have to keep and keep making up excusese with more lies, I would of ran! .... ok, probably not :)


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13 Feb 2010, 9:38 am

maleb wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
rmctagg09 wrote:
Personally, I feel that if you really thought that all of our problems would be fixed in a year, you're either naive or an idiot.


Well said.



Absolutely agree! That has been my feeling since he started campaigning! You can't change a machine that has been turning for 200+ years, especially when human nature is what keeps the wheel spinning.
I mean, if I knew that all it took to be president was promising things I would never have to keep and keep making up excusese with more lies, I would of ran! .... ok, probably not :)


OK. It would probably be impressive if he'd tried. I could accept that.



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13 Feb 2010, 8:18 pm

NeantHumain wrote:
It's about projecting the right image to the public rather than hoping Republicans will come around. Americans tend to value bipartisanship. The problem is Republicans see bipartisanship as getting exactly what they would want if they were in the majority. Obama is giving them another chance for the olive branch, and he seems to be rebuking them more strongly when they snub him, which is good strategy.


When Obama's speaking with the Republican's, I bet he's thinking in the back of his mind "How can I get rid of these idiots, without making myself look bad to the American people?" :D If he would totally steamroll them, then there would be all kinds of backlash, so he has to play it cool.



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14 Feb 2010, 6:23 am

[/quote]
The Democratic party has discredited itself with its spineless cowardice and inability to act on its people. The American electorate supported the Democrats in the last two national elections, and in both cases we have been betrayed by the party leadership.[/quote]
_______________________________
unbelievable- so you think the republicans actually want to fix things [change the stinking status quo for the better]? jeez louise!- i have a bridge i want to sell you. anybody who wonders why the democrats lack spines only needs to look in the mirror. we really do have the government we truly deserve. the dems are twisting in the wind ONLY because not enough of us can be bothered to outshout the tea-partiers and their selfish blather, and show the democrats some support. where are all the people who voted blue in '08 hiding now?

the gop's "health care reform bill" if passed, would actually have resulted in even fewer folk receiving medical care, due to its repeal of the 1986 law which says public ERs must treat all comers regardless of financial status- IOW, just dump the indigent out on the street. how can any thinking person believe that america cannot be better than this? republican attorneys-general across the country are trying to make it impossible to pass any kind of health care reform now or in the future. you think it is good that we are the only western nation to deny primary [as opposed to tertiary care in ERs] health care to our working class CITIZENS?

gawd, i hope 2012 [apocolypse] happens, i just can't bear more years of this country's brain-dead politics. any clod who spews "love it or leave it" can go eat worms for all i care.

go ahead, cut off your nose to spite your face, and vote republican- let's see what it gets you - unless you are mr. 6-figures-and-above, you will not see any net tax decrease, taxes [and worshipping the wealthy] being the only thing most of america seems to care about. this all is enough to drive me SANE!

citizens, pay attention to the man behind the curtain!



maleb
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16 Feb 2010, 4:09 pm

auntblabby wrote:
the gop's "health care reform bill" if passed, would actually have resulted in even fewer folk receiving medical care, due to its repeal of the 1986 law which says public ERs must treat all comers regardless of financial status- IOW, just dump the indigent out on the street. how can any thinking person believe that america cannot be better than this? republican attorneys-general across the country are trying to make it impossible to pass any kind of health care reform now or in the future. you think it is good that we are the only western nation to deny primary [as opposed to tertiary care in ERs] health care to our working class CITIZENS? [/quote]

This is a totally misleading and overly exaggerated statement. The consideration was for those with illegal status only. Also, if you would of spent the time to check your facts instead of just laying out an emotionally charged, unsubstantiated statement, you would of found that both Bills that were published in the House and Senate contained verbage that specifically disallowed people receiving any type of medical care while not lawfully in the US. This contatined in not 1, but 2 Democratic partisan bills!


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16 Feb 2010, 10:47 pm

This is a totally misleading and overly exaggerated statement. The consideration was for those with illegal status only. Also, if you would of spent the time to check your facts instead of just laying out an emotionally charged, unsubstantiated statement, you would of found that both Bills that were published in the House and Senate contained verbage that specifically disallowed people receiving any type of medical care while not lawfully in the US. This contatined in not 1, but 2 Democratic partisan bills![/quote]
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spare us all the red-state bile. i question your "facts" also- the repub bill would NOT have extended coverage to the uninsured, period - citizen or no citizen. i would much prefer having an "emotional" bleeding heart [i know you don't care for such] than an unemotional heart of stone.
i will not further waste my time by discussing so much as the time of day with a repub. spew all the bile you will.



maleb
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16 Feb 2010, 11:34 pm

auntblabby wrote:
This is a totally misleading and overly exaggerated statement. The consideration was for those with illegal status only. Also, if you would of spent the time to check your facts instead of just laying out an emotionally charged, unsubstantiated statement, you would of found that both Bills that were published in the House and Senate contained verbage that specifically disallowed people receiving any type of medical care while not lawfully in the US. This contatined in not 1, but 2 Democratic partisan bills!

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spare us all the red-state bile. i question your "facts" also- the repub bill would NOT have extended coverage to the uninsured, period - citizen or no citizen. i would much prefer having an "emotional" bleeding heart [i know you don't care for such] than an unemotional heart of stone.
i will not further waste my time by discussing so much as the time of day with a repub. spew all the bile you will.[/quote]

Your joking here, right? If so, I'm bad at picking up hidden meanings and am far from seeing anything funny here.

Any simple search will turn up what I stated! You can either be like all the rest of the sheep and chose to just ignore the facts, or you can stare them straight in the face!

Fact 1 - section 246 of the The House bill, titled "America’s Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009"
"No Federal payment for undocumented aliens."
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin ... ih.txt.pdf

Fact 2 - section 3111(h) of the Senate's "Affordable Health Choices Act"
“Nothing in this Act shall allow Federal payments for individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States.”
short letter to Senator Kennedy expressing the concern of - http://healthyamericans.org/assets/files/BWHealth.pdf


Now, what facts do you question? and what Republican bill are you referring to? The bills proposed by the GOP in both Houses are posted here- http://www.gop.gov/solutions/healthcare

I see nothing that prevents extended coverage to the uninsured! I do see a cautious approach to addressing the issues at hand rather then the ones which chose to shove a whale down the throat of a seagull! Again, you speak nonsense and just go futher in demonstrating the ignorance that is prevelant amongst many of our citizens.


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18 Feb 2010, 2:25 am

The problem is corporations and will continue to be. Nearly all republicans and a good chunk of the democrats care about corporate money and nothings else.

When the majority of the country says we want are health care system fixed, we want our education system fixed, we want our infrastructure fixed, we want the banking system fixed, and we want out of Iraq... and then not one of those things happens when 1 party controls the entire government and runs saying they want the very things the majority are asking for.... well something is up.

Sure republicans voting lock step no on everything is a pain but when your party has that much control, a party being a pain is not enough to stop jack.

Often you will hear a lot of stuff that is of little to no meaning on the news. Media likes to talk about what they want to talk about. They like to act like the country hates Obama but polls don't agree. Polls do agree that congress is hated by both parties.

And the final problem, Obama appears to be one of the Democrats that cares about money and not the people. Lucky for him he is better at talking than most so he looks good even when he is screwing up. As has been pointed out here, if he was a real leader and actually cared, he would use the White house to get out the message that congress is not doing what the people want and they ALL need to be voted out. That isnt happening, they are acting like Republicans are the only problem which just inst true.



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18 Feb 2010, 4:05 am

maleb wrote:

Your joking here, right? .

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i might as well enter a barking contest with a dog. you will never understand. you will continue to be a repub and i will continue to be a democrat, never the twain shall meet. instead of ridiculing me and my emotional stance, you might consider examining your own narrow-mindedness.



maleb
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19 Feb 2010, 6:49 am

narrow-mindednss? I voted for a Republican President and a Democratic Governor, and would vote for an independent if I felt driven so.

I look at who I understand to be the most qualified and who I think would lead us in the best direction. None of which I've seen from Obama, I'm a believer of action, not words!

Admittedly, I do lean more towards the right, but that is because they have been more solid in their ideals and conservative views. However, I don't let a particular party alone drive my vote. Now who's narrow-minded?


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19 Feb 2010, 7:55 am

maleb wrote:
narrow-mindednss? I voted for a Republican President and a Democratic Governor, and would vote for an independent if I felt driven so.

I look at who I understand to be the most qualified and who I think would lead us in the best direction. None of which I've seen from Obama, I'm a believer of action, not words!

Admittedly, I do lean more towards the right, but that is because they have been more solid in their ideals and conservative views. However, I don't let a particular party alone drive my vote. Now who's narrow-minded?

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and the best direction is the status quo? refusing to admit that the united states and its increasingly dysfunctional ways of doing things cannot keep going in the same direction without consequence, now THAT is narrow-mindedness. putting all your eggs in the right-wing basket of counterfeit "more of the same" goods is narrow-mindedness. refusing to acknowledge that there are other countries with wisdom we could learn from [persisting in spewing the same old, "USA is the best! RAH! love it or leave it" garp], is narrow-minded.
winston churchhill said that the u.s. eventually does the right thing, but only grudgingly and after pursuing every other wrong course of action. you think it is a fine thing to be this way as a nation?
you criticise obama and the dems for not accomplishing much, conveniently leaving-out the fact that your party is what is preventing any accomplishment, through various types of sabotage- legislative obstructionist tactics as well as the use of "tea party" bullies to scare the [embarrassingly cowardly] dems from voting for the change they were elected to effect in the first place.
barking contest, indeed! good sir, i wish i had your sharp mind, but just the same you are lacking somewhat in compassion for your fellow humans, as well as a grand vision. putting metal in the church collection plate is narrowly pro-forma - voting for CHANGE [progress] benefitting the whole nation of citizens [not just the ones in your elevated social class] is doing something - "action, not words."
i've had enough of your depressing nimby philosophy, i'm changing the channel to watch something else which is edifying.
have a good life, luv.



maleb
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21 Feb 2010, 6:47 pm

I have no idea what you are trying to say or what point you are trying to make, and I'm not so sure you do either.

Your arguments can be thrown both ways. Anyway, I've yet to see a perfect living human in this day and age. live well!


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21 Feb 2010, 8:26 pm

maleb wrote:
I have no idea what you are trying to say or what point you are trying to make, and I'm not so sure you do either.

Your arguments can be thrown both ways. Anyway, I've yet to see a perfect living human in this day and age. live well!


i know exactly what i am saying but it seems you still don't get me, do you?
as i said earlier, you will never understand, you need another lifetime of lifelessons.
good day to you sir



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21 Feb 2010, 9:58 pm

Obama's chief of staff is former investment banker and Israeli soldier Rahm Emanuel. The chief of staff is the closest thing in the American system there is to a prime minister. He serves as gatekeeper to the president and leads the arm twisting on Capitol Hill. Emanuel has of course been twisting the progressives' arms whilst giving the right wing Blue Dogs, whose ranks he tried to boost repeatedly, complete freedom to twist legislation to their liking. Emanuel had a large role in 1994 debacle when he worked for Clinton to get NAFTA passed. Emanuel said that the Democrats have no base, that the progressives are "ret*ds". To him, all that matters is getting money from rich people and they're the only people that count.

Emanuel is a bungling fool whom the mainstream media wrongly credited for the 2006 Democratic victory. Obama himself owes his own victory to rival Howard Dean's 50-state strategy, and not to Emanuel's attempt to build a larger kennel of Blue Dogs.

That Obama chose him to be Chief of Staff tells us everything about what a sellout Obama is.

Obama has this obsession with bipartisanship - clearly he doesn't think elections mean anything, Republicans must always rule even when they lose. The media is also obsessed with it, or at least CNN is. They claim that people in the US are mad at the "partisanship". What nonsense. They just want things to be done.

Despite being a sellout who is trying to force a Republican health care plan (Romneycare) on the country, Republicans have branded Obama a Nazi, a Communist, and many of the Republican base have suggested that he should be killed. He turns around and keeps saying that they need to help him make policy or else no policy will be made.



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22 Feb 2010, 12:01 pm

Sand wrote:
In other words, he is not a very good leader.


Correct. Any leader who can alienate his own base is not very good a leading.

B.O. is on his way to becoming a one term president.

ruveyn



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22 Feb 2010, 12:22 pm

xenon13 wrote:
Obama has this obsession with bipartisanship - clearly he doesn't think elections mean anything, Republicans must always rule even when they lose. The media is also obsessed with it, or at least CNN is. They claim that people in the US are mad at the "partisanship". What nonsense. They just want things to be done.

Despite being a sellout who is trying to force a Republican health care plan (Romneycare) on the country, Republicans have branded Obama a Nazi, a Communist, and many of the Republican base have suggested that he should be killed. He turns around and keeps saying that they need to help him make policy or else no policy will be made.


george wallace [whatever else you may think of him] once said "there's not a dollar's worth of difference between the democrats and the republicans." i'd say he was half-right- at the top the money is much more alike than different, as big money interests butter whichever side of its bread as is prudent for them. it is at the bottom where there are real differences between the parties - the dems have at their base:

1] compassionate liberals of all stripes who believe society can be improved via good government-
2] working-class folk of mixed quality- some cannot be bothered to leave their sports game and malt liquor long enough to cast a ballot to save their lives, some who can be bled-off by repub red herrings such as gays, race, et al- and some that are usefully active in pushing for progressive social change-
3] folks with libertarian aims who see the folly of diluting a powerful established party vote for a marginal party vote [choosing the lesser of 2 evils], and who fear the repub's nasty habit of invading their privacy-
4] many contentious minority groups, racial and sexual

the repubs have as their base:
1]violent, sometimes incoherent tea-party bully mobs who are unaware they are just being used as a tool in the repub black bag of dirty tricks-
2] passionate social-darwinists of varying income levels, who have selfishness and nimby-ism in common, individualists run rampant, a few libertarian-ish types, ayn rand-types who see "average schlubs" as nothing but parasites-
3] religious-right fanatics who are pushing the party to support theocracy [american taliban, if you will], and are biding their time in the party until they see their chance-
4] minorities who have climbed the ladder of success and seem unwilling to acknowledge those climbing up behind them [clarence thomas, anyone?], a few who seem embarrassed by their race and think "acting the part" will endear them to repub elites who barely conceal their contempt for them [michael steele versus limbaugh].

so as an average schlub, all i can say is vote for the party which at least pays lip-service to representing the interests of average schlubs, which means if you are without healthcare, the dems at least are TRYING to enact SOMETHING that would extend coverage and curb insurance company misbehavior [even if it is somewhat clumsy and mediocre], whereas all the congressional repubs want to do is indemnify careless medical providers for their errors and ERs for dumping the indigent, neither of which is immediately helpful to those of us who can't afford health coverage.

"the m[e]n behind the curtain" really run things, and it is all that us mere mortals can do to choose among the lesser of 2 evils. that is why there never has been a successful third-party presidency, it is just too convenient to play 2 against the middle, and too many are afraid of losing a vote to the evil other party [pick one] to risk supporting a 3rd-party fella.
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
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