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Tufted Titmouse
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22 Jun 2010, 5:53 pm

It's okay for aspies to live at home right?



Last edited by Decepticon on 23 Jun 2010, 2:26 am, edited 3 times in total.

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22 Jun 2010, 6:14 pm

I have this strange feeling that ungratefulness isn't that exclusive to aspies......

...and that it's common amongst all groups. We're an awful species.

I'm now working on living on my own, making plans and seeking help as I know I get into troubles easily. One of my motives to leave my parents' home is that I don't want to be a parasite (even though I pay rent).


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MrXxx
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22 Jun 2010, 6:16 pm

I see I'm not too late for the fireworks.

Do I have time to use the restroom and get some refreshments? :D


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CockneyRebel
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22 Jun 2010, 6:23 pm

I agree with you 100%. I knew an aspie girl from high school. Her mum did everything to try and make her happy. I mean everything. My friend was nasty to her kind and loving mother. It made me feel sick to my stomach.


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22 Jun 2010, 6:28 pm

:cry:



Last edited by Decepticon on 23 Jun 2010, 2:10 am, edited 2 times in total.

Apple_in_my_Eye
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22 Jun 2010, 6:33 pm

My father's mother was nuts and abandoned her family when he was a kid. Because of that my dad forced to live with an aunt's family, where they used him as slave labor on their orange grove. The aunt's kids didn't have to do that work. And my dad got to eat by himself.

His aunt always told him 2 things: to be grateful that he had a place to live, and to always remember that he's not really part of their family (the aunt's family). That was in between having the sh*t beaten out him by his alcoholic, abusive uncle.

At 18, he got out by joining the USMC. If he'd had a disability, say epilepsy, he might've been stuck for a lot longer.

So, people can provide for you, and abuse you at the same time. Being grateful can be a little more complicated than "you just should... becasue."

Real life is often complicated. I'll bet there are lots of women on the spectrum stuck having to have sex with people they don't want to with, because they can't get or keep jobs (and etc) and it's a matter of survival. Who should be grateful for that kind of hell?



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22 Jun 2010, 6:54 pm

Apple_in_my_Eye wrote:
My father's mother was nuts and abandoned her family when he was a kid. Because of that my dad forced to live with an aunt's family, where they used him as slave labor on their orange grove. The aunt's kids didn't have to do that work. And my dad got to eat by himself.

His aunt always told him 2 things: to be grateful that he had a place to live, and to always remember that he's not really part of their family (the aunt's family). That was in between having the sh*t beaten out him by his alcoholic, abusive uncle.

At 18, he got out by joining the USMC. If he'd had a disability, say epilepsy, he might've been stuck for a lot longer.

So, people can provide for you, and abuse you at the same time. Being grateful can be a little more complicated than "you just should... becasue."

Real life is often complicated. I'll bet there are lots of women on the spectrum stuck having to have sex with people they don't want to with, because they can't get or keep jobs (and etc) and it's a matter of survival. Who should be grateful for that kind of hell?


Exactly, I couldn't agree more, well said. Just because people provide for you doesn't mean they're automatically good people that you should bow down and worship. People can be nasty as hell to you and still give you a place to live. If you're unable to do anything to get yourself out of that situation then you're stuck there, depending on someone who treats you like trash.


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MrXxx
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22 Jun 2010, 6:56 pm

There are also an incredible number of people who provide housing for others, not to help them, but because they have a sick need to control others. Too damned many.


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22 Jun 2010, 7:02 pm

:oops:



Last edited by Decepticon on 23 Jun 2010, 2:11 am, edited 2 times in total.

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22 Jun 2010, 7:03 pm

I was abused through my childhood and was threatened to be kicked out when I was a teenager. When I actually did get some resources together and find my own apartment when I was 19, that was when I got called ungrateful.

Things are a lot different at home now, and my NT sister and brother still live there, in their 20s. I live on my own and don't think I could live with my parents again.


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22 Jun 2010, 7:25 pm

Decepticon wrote:
Okay, let's leave the blame game. I know there are situations that people are not able to escape and the situation they are in may be undesirable.

I'm talking here of people with good hearts that provide for an aspie who just takes. I have known a few who feel because they can't work or whatever that they are entitled to cared by their spouse or family.

I'm asking this, do you think they are entitled, especially if they don't even care for their parents or love their spouse?


You say to leave the blame game, but seem keen on keeping it going. You're trying to lay blame to people with AS for doing something that a wide variety of people do, it is not an AS exclusive thing.

The people with AS you mention may not know what else to do, they are just trying to survive like anyone else. Would you prefer they become homeless?

I think some sense of entitlement is alright. People who use wheelchairs are entitled to have wheelchair ramps at public locations to aid in their mobility, and if they got mad that there was not a wheelchair ramp for them, no one would begrudge them that.

So, if we are unable to function in the rest of society the way it is set up, are we not still entitled to have a place to live and food to eat? Or should we just walk the streets in filth begging strangers for help because the world is not built to function the way we do?

Anyway, I personally do not think anyone should marry a person they do not love just because they think that person will take care of them, be they AS or NT. If someone is caring for you, and treats you well, then you should appreciate that, and try to treat them well in return.

Entitlement without appreciation seems to be what you are upset about. But I think there are often extenuating circumstances, of which you might not be aware.


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Willard
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22 Jun 2010, 7:39 pm

:evil: Who's that trip-trapping across Decepticon's bridge? :roll:



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22 Jun 2010, 7:41 pm

Decepticon wrote:
It seems to me that if you dislike whom pays your bills then consider leaving and find your own way to care for yourself. If you can't, then perhaps you should be more accepting and appreciative. Also, if you truly don't love somebody and yet take their money, then maybe you should be ashamed.


Okay.


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Apple_in_my_Eye
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22 Jun 2010, 7:42 pm

Decepticon wrote:
Okay, let's leave the blame game. I know there are situations that people are not able to escape and the situation they are in may be undesirable.


Well, it is precisely a blame-game: who is the "bad guy"? Abusers tell one story, and leeches tell another. What is the truth? Hard to know without really deeply knowing the details.

Of course, some people are ungrateful leeches. But I don't see that as being too bad of a problem. People stuck under other people's thumbs, being stuck being abused seems far worse a concern IMHO.

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I'm talking here of people with good hearts that provide for an aspie who just takes. I have known a few who feel because they can't work or whatever that they are entitled to cared by their spouse or family.

I'm asking this, do you think they are entitled, especially if they don't even care for their parents or love their spouse?


Given that set-up, they are obviously wrong. But that's the problem -- there's not enough detail to tell if that pre-fabricated set up is really the truth.

I've seen people describe themselves as saintly, and later found they out weren't. And I've met con-men/leeches who described their pitiful plight and were lying. This is very much in the realm of human narrative, and people always tell the story to make themselves sound innocent. I never trust such stories on their face.

Either the person can work and self-support or not. If they can't they can apply for disability and maybe get that. If they're living a luxurious lifestyle at someone else's expense, yeah I see that as a problem. (If they're on SSI that won't be happening.) Though, that leaves one to wonder why the people are providing them so much. It is their right to give away "free money" if they choose. Entitled? I dunno. Are Dick Cheney's kid entitled to the millions they'll inherit?



MrXxx
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22 Jun 2010, 7:47 pm

Decepticon wrote:
Okay, let's leave the blame game. I know there are situations that people are not able to escape and the situation they are in may be undesirable.

I'm talking here of people with good hearts that provide for an aspie who just takes. I have known a few who feel because they can't work or whatever that they are entitled to cared by their spouse or family.

I'm asking this, do you think they are entitled, especially if they don't even care for their parents or love their spouse?


Nobody here is playing the "blame game." These are your own words: "However, they don't mind getting their bills paid for... "

That right there seems to indicate every Aspie you know that complains about their caregivers, is like this. Your omission of any mention of Aspies who might have good reason not to like the situation they are in made it seem as though you thought all Aspies who complain are just ungrateful.

Now you've cleared that up. I didn't think you were that unaware anyway, and my previous comment about "fireworks" was only in anticipation of people making the same assumptions from what you wrote they are already making.

Okay, so you do realize there are folks in bad situations who do have good reason to complain, even though the people they are complaining about treat them well, and pay for all their needs.

Now let me tell you a little story that hopefully will help you not to be quite so judgmental of situations you are not in yourself:

I WAS one of the "caregivers" you mentioned. I provided a home and food for a family member who was years ago was diagnosed with AS. He never accepted the diagnosis. He never came to understand anything about his AS, and therefor never really understood himself at the time. My wife and I were as understanding and patient as we possibly could be with him. He would spend days on end in his room, not looking for work, on his computer day and night. He would only come down to eat after we had gone to bed. He complained to his mother constantly of the horrible treatment he got from me, yet all I ever did was keep telling him he had to find a job. Three times, he left our home, and moved to various places to live with people he'd met on the Internet. Every time he came back. He had a job once and lost it because he had gone to work with pants on that didn't meet the dress code, was sent home to change, came home, and never went back!

He complained constantly of joint pains, and chest pains. He was in his early twenties for crying out loud, and the only reason he had these pains was because he'd never leave his room!

He's approaching thirty now. He lives hundreds of miles from here now, with another group of people, and still doesn't have a job.

Pretty ungrateful huh?

Yeah, well, that's what I thought too.

He recently went to the hospital to be seen about chest pains, and it was discovered he had already had several mild heart attacks. His joint pains were caused by a poor circulation due to a leaking heart valve. He is also only now beginning to accept that his AS is not only real, but pretty severe.

The bottom line is I now realize what was going on with him was very real symptoms caused by very real physical and neurological conditions. We now realize it wasn't his fault entirely. He simply did not know how to cope with his AS, and nobody knew about his physical problems until now.

The message to you is this:

Don't be so quick to judge others whose lives you do not lead. They may have very good reasons to feel as they do, or they may not.

The other bottom line is that it's their business, not yours.

(Unless you are the caregiver - and that's a whole different discussion, but you can take some hints from my story anyway, because I was one. :wink: )


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22 Jun 2010, 9:04 pm

8O



Last edited by Decepticon on 23 Jun 2010, 2:12 am, edited 1 time in total.