Psychopathy, Asperger's: a 'serious' combination

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Ganondox
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14 Dec 2011, 9:39 pm

fraac wrote:
"psychopaths are made not born"

They have defective amygdalae.



If I'm correct the difference between Pyschopathy and Sociopathy is that pyschopathy is stereotyped as having a neurological basis (born evil), while sociopathy is stereotyped as having a pyschological basis (turned evil).


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ediself
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15 Dec 2011, 3:34 am

Ganondox wrote:
fraac wrote:
"psychopaths are made not born"

They have defective amygdalae.



If I'm correct the difference between Pyschopathy and Sociopathy is that pyschopathy is stereotyped as having a neurological basis (born evil), while sociopathy is stereotyped as having a pyschological basis (turned evil).

I think you mean "sociopaths" (ASPD) are born, not made, and malignant Narcissists (so close in terms of evilness) are made (turned evil).



ediself
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15 Dec 2011, 3:38 am

By the way, I changed my mind.
I don't think an autistic person can be born both sociopathic and autistic, but I do think given the right amount of trauma, an autistic person can be turned into a malignant narcissist.
I think all it takes is trauma+intensive training by a personality disordered , and a lightbulb moment where the person decides they refuse to be a prey any longer.



ediself
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15 Dec 2011, 3:46 am

FunnyFairytale wrote:
My ex is a person who is hard to label but who may come across as a bit aspie at times.What makes him stand out and not have anything in common with me or my aspie friends is that there is something else that that we dont relate to, like the manipulation, the strange intentions, the very calculated moves.I wouldnt be able to outsmart him ( so to speak) on any of those things because I wouldnt know how to construct it in my mind, neither would I have any desire to do so.
There is this strange difference there that is hard to pinpoint and makes him come across more like a psychopath somehow.

It's the long term planning and the long term view, like they can predict the future or something, and your long term reactions....
I understand how you would think you "can't outsmart him", but think of it as their special interest: manipulation. They're very focused on that. They're not burdened with any other idea or desire.
The thing that could stall an autistic person would be wondering whether they will be successful, lacking self confidence, and even caring when they fail. The sociopath does not linger on failure: he goes again. He does fail half the time, and that goes unnoticed anyway. Noone know of his plans but himself.



fraac
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15 Dec 2011, 3:51 am

ediself wrote:
but I do think given the right amount of trauma, an autistic person can be turned into a malignant narcissist


I already explained that's what I am. I like totally explained it. Totally.



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15 Dec 2011, 4:01 am

The Unabomber seemed autistic. I know Martin Bryant was diagnosed with AS. Cho (Virginia murder spree) seemed to have symptoms of AS, not just selective mutism.

Social isolation, social persecution, and an extreme focus on something inappropriate, can probably equal a bad mix in the right and rare person. No need for anti-social PD to be there.



nikki191
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15 Dec 2011, 5:37 am

The article is definitely wrong. The moment I read him mention Dahmer probably having asperger's it rang warning bells. everyone who met him said he was a wonderful social person. Its why he could get away with what he did for so long.



ediself
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15 Dec 2011, 6:23 am

fraac wrote:
ediself wrote:
but I do think given the right amount of trauma, an autistic person can be turned into a malignant narcissist


I already explained that's what I am. I like totally explained it. Totally.

I just said I changed my mind :D Meaning I believe you exist as you say you do. You shouldn't care whether I do or not this much! (sorry. Joking)
The fact that you explained it previously doesn't mean everyone has to believe you're telling the truth right?
But ok, I do now.



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15 Dec 2011, 6:37 am

jamieboy wrote:
Maybe psychopathy doesn't always have be a negative thing. There's a skill set there that needn't necessarily be used for ill. Or am i wrong?

the skill set is awesome, I wish I had super powers too. But combined with another point in the personality, which is "viewing normal people as cattle", it can't be used for anything else than domination of said cattle. There is no wish to do good unless it serves oneself as a side effect... it's a bit like being drunk on power, because a superior cognitive empathy (superior to NTs), is a huge amount of power.
I think once you place yourself above others and direct them around with such ease, it must be close to impossible not to use this ability to advance yourself in life, even at the expense of others. I mean, especially if you're immune to affective empathy.



Ganondox
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15 Dec 2011, 8:35 am

ediself wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
fraac wrote:
"psychopaths are made not born"

They have defective amygdalae.



If I'm correct the difference between Pyschopathy and Sociopathy is that pyschopathy is stereotyped as having a neurological basis (born evil), while sociopathy is stereotyped as having a pyschological basis (turned evil).

I think you mean "sociopaths" (ASPD) are born, not made, and malignant Narcissists (so close in terms of evilness) are made (turned evil).


It was just my interpretation of wikipedia's page on anti-social personality disorder.


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Aussie_74
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17 Dec 2011, 2:39 am

Sociopathy is a term that shows the influence of sociology, rather than psychology, and is more reflective of current beliefs of aetiology of the condition.

...and so what if they have defective or different amygdalae, fraac, has the concept of neuroplasticity completely passed you by?



fraac
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17 Dec 2011, 2:48 am

Aussie_74 wrote:
Sociopathy is a term that shows the influence of sociology, rather than psychology, and is more reflective of current beliefs of aetiology of the condition.

...and so what if they have defective or different amygdalae, fraac, has the concept of neuroplasticity completely passed you by?


You can't neuroplastic your way to emotions if your amygdala is broken.



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17 Dec 2011, 5:12 am

"Psychopathy (/saɪˈkɒpəθi/[1][2]) is a mental disorder characterized primarily by a lack of empathy and remorse, shallow emotions, egocentricity, and deceptiveness. Psychopaths are highly prone to antisocial behavior and abusive treatment of others, and are very disproportionately responsible for violent crime when in a violent emotional state or situation. Though lacking empathy and emotional depth, they often manage to pass themselves off as average individuals by feigning emotions and lying about their past."

It sounds like Asperger :lol:
Hell yes!


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ediself
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17 Dec 2011, 6:16 am

fraac wrote:
Aussie_74 wrote:
Sociopathy is a term that shows the influence of sociology, rather than psychology, and is more reflective of current beliefs of aetiology of the condition.

...and so what if they have defective or different amygdalae, fraac, has the concept of neuroplasticity completely passed you by?


You can't neuroplastic your way to emotions if your amygdala is broken.


Oh my! I battled a psychologist who spoke of accidentally brain damaged people and compared it to autism, and told me neuroplasticity would allow my son to just "recover" from not being able to read non verbal cues just by being exposed to them...I never thought of throwing a definitive sentence like that in her face.
Thank you.



fraac
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17 Dec 2011, 6:20 am

Depends. I can read nonverbals better than anyone I've met but I guess it isn't the same mechanism most people use. If your kid is exposed to enough harm early so that he needs to learn to read people, he will.



ediself
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17 Dec 2011, 6:31 am

fraac wrote:
Depends. I can read nonverbals better than anyone I've met but I guess it isn't the same mechanism most people use. If your kid is exposed to enough harm early so that he needs to learn to read people, he will.

That's actually true. But you learn to read only the manifestation of incoming trauma that is the same you've been through.... For instance I could real sexual intentions in men from the age of maybe 7 or 8, and knew not to put myself in harm's way in that respect.
It didn't teach me much about anything else though.
Bullying taught me not to assume anyone liked me, but didn't teach me to recognise a "real friendly behaviour" from a fake one. It only taught me to avoid people who seemed friendly lol........