Children with ADHD have faulty offswitch for mindwandering

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Moog
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27 Jan 2011, 1:43 pm

http://www.sciencecodex.com/brain_scans ... wandering#

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The common complaint about children with ADHD is that 'he can concentrate and control himself fine when he wants to', so some people just think the child is being naughty when he misbehaves," says Dr Liddle. "We have shown that this may be a very real difficulty for them. The off-switch for their 'internal world' seems to need a greater incentive to function properly and allow them to attend to their task.


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pgd
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27 Jan 2011, 2:32 pm

Words: Inattention - Possibilities include: Petit/absence and so on, ADHD Inattentive, central auditory processing disorder (CAPD), brain injuries, sports concussions, and so forth. Neurology of paying attention, processing, and memory: Nerves In Collision book by Walter C. Alvarez, M.D., the How To (understand) Hyperactivity book (1981) about ADHD Inattentive by C. Thomas Wild, and A Remarkable Medicine Has Been Overlooked book by Jack Dreyfus. In the year 2011, there are 4 ADHDs and over 10 epilepsies. Other words: Distractible, distracted, short attention span, sustained attention, on task vs off task, mindwandering, brain fog, etc.



TallyMan
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27 Jan 2011, 3:09 pm

Interesting article. Does Ritalin also work on adults? I'm fairly certain I have ADHD but have never sought medical advice and the symptoms fit me perfe.... Ooooh a bunny rabbit.... :wink:


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aghogday
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27 Jan 2011, 4:16 pm

I was diagnosed with it and was prescribed wellbutrin, but not until I was 47. Before this the stress of work and a good work-out were my focusing mechanisms. Computers also helped. I have known some adults diagnosed with ADHD and they mentioned being treated with adderall, which I believe is similiar to Ritalin. From their feedback, it helped them alot to focus. When I was diagnosed the Doctor did suggest adderall, but never ritalin

The natural coping mechanisms I had earlier in life were the best balance for me. But, after getting older with health issues and not getting the same adrenaline boost from working out, and losing my ability to work, I started feeling lost in space quite a bit more, and needed the stimulation provided by the medication to get myself focused to keep moving forward.

I saw another post about a person meeting their wife while they were "on". Fortunately I was also in a circumstance like this when I met my wife. She found out soon enough how I turned "off" at home. Particularly when I was away from work more than a couple of days. With the balance at work and home, the "off" condition was relaxing to me, because my wife took care of the home duties, for the most part. I could also zone out and follow her around in the stores. Now, I drive my wife crazy.

I don't know how prevalent it is with ADHD, but with some extreme stress, I got stuck in the "on" position, and boy did I miss the "off" position when that happened. It led to quite a few health problems.



pensieve
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27 Jan 2011, 4:24 pm

Yes adults can take stimulant medication. I've been on Ritalin.

My initial reaction to this article was 'duh.' Of course we can't switch off our mind wandering. Do people really have a hard time understanding this?


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aghogday
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27 Jan 2011, 4:38 pm

I really do think people have a difficult understanding ADD or ADHD, if they don't have it. I can't really understand what it is like not to have it and to have a normal level of focusing most of the time. My wife could never understand how I could be such a perfectionist at work and not be able to concentrate at home. She still thinks I do it on purpose.



TallyMan
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27 Jan 2011, 5:04 pm

Interesting replies. I think my ability to concentrate on necessary (but dull) tasks is getting worse as I get older (I'm now 50). I too am a perfectionist and can concentrate very deeply on things that stimulate my mind but have massive problems motivating myself to do anything else - even very important financial / income related things. It is seriously messing with my life. I think it is time I saw a doctor about it.


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Moog
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27 Jan 2011, 5:31 pm

pensieve wrote:
Yes adults can take stimulant medication. I've been on Ritalin.

My initial reaction to this article was 'duh.' Of course we can't switch off our mind wandering. Do people really have a hard time understanding this?


I can't even explain ADD to my parents in a way that they understand, despite them both having it, or some kind of attention problem.


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syrella
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27 Jan 2011, 5:54 pm

TallyMan wrote:
Interesting replies. I think my ability to concentrate on necessary (but dull) tasks is getting worse as I get older (I'm now 50). I too am a perfectionist and can concentrate very deeply on things that stimulate my mind but have massive problems motivating myself to do anything else - even very important financial / income related things. It is seriously messing with my life. I think it is time I saw a doctor about it.

My brain likes to shut itself off when the subject's not interesting. It's particularly annoying when this happens in class or when I'm supposed to be studying. I don't remember having such problems as a kid, but it's certainly gotten worse over time. Mind you, I am still young (24).

On the bright side, meds do seem to help. The key for me is just remembering to take them. :roll:



Yensid
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27 Jan 2011, 6:05 pm

pensieve wrote:
My initial reaction to this article was 'duh.' Of course we can't switch off our mind wandering. Do people really have a hard time understanding this?


Unfortunately, people do have a hard time understanding it. I love research like this, because it helps to dispel the notion that psychological problems are only due to some sort of personal failing.



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27 Jan 2011, 9:55 pm

syrella wrote:
My brain likes to shut itself off when the subject's not interesting. It's particularly annoying when this happens in class or when I'm supposed to be studying. I don't remember having such problems as a kid, but it's certainly gotten worse over time. Mind you, I am still young (24).

On the bright side, meds do seem to help. The key for me is just remembering to take them. :roll:


Same. My brain shuts off when conversation around me is completely uninteresting.

I saw my therapist for the first time today. At some point she started asking leading questions about ADHD and then asked me outright if I had it. I was more animated/involved in the conversation because my mental health is practically an interest of its own and I've been waiting for months to talk to someone. Holding back was pretty much impossible, but sticking to one point in a complete paragraph was nigh-impossible. This combined with my usual communication problems I think left some inaccurate perceptions, but I think I got most of the information out I needed to in order to lay my groundwork. I don't think I managed to communicate enough about AS to explain why I think I have it, but she at least took the possibility seriously.

I think it'd be a lot more obvious if this was a chore, but it's not, I love being able to finally talk about all this baggage I've been carrying for decades, and my main problem will be organizing the information instead of being random.



syrella
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27 Jan 2011, 10:43 pm

Verdandi wrote:
syrella wrote:
My brain likes to shut itself off when the subject's not interesting. It's particularly annoying when this happens in class or when I'm supposed to be studying. I don't remember having such problems as a kid, but it's certainly gotten worse over time. Mind you, I am still young (24).

On the bright side, meds do seem to help. The key for me is just remembering to take them. :roll:


Same. My brain shuts off when conversation around me is completely uninteresting.

I saw my therapist for the first time today. At some point she started asking leading questions about ADHD and then asked me outright if I had it. I was more animated/involved in the conversation because my mental health is practically an interest of its own and I've been waiting for months to talk to someone. Holding back was pretty much impossible, but sticking to one point in a complete paragraph was nigh-impossible. This combined with my usual communication problems I think left some inaccurate perceptions, but I think I got most of the information out I needed to in order to lay my groundwork. I don't think I managed to communicate enough about AS to explain why I think I have it, but she at least took the possibility seriously.

I think it'd be a lot more obvious if this was a chore, but it's not, I love being able to finally talk about all this baggage I've been carrying for decades, and my main problem will be organizing the information instead of being random.

That's great that you've been able to talk to someone about it. I've got a lot of questions for the next time I go to see my therapist, a good portion of them stemming from what I've learned about AS (I didn't know anything about autism spectrum disorders a month ago). I figure, even if I don't have it, it'd still be nice to have a professional's opinion. I don't think having it or not will make a huge difference in my life. However, it would be good to know if I just have social anxiety issues or if there is something deeper going on. It'd be great to learn more so that I can learn to manage my life better. That's really my ultimate goal.

The way that I found out about my ADHD was that I found myself falling asleep when trying to study or in large lectures. I reluctantly told my parents and they immediately got me an appointment with a psychiatrist. Turns out, it wasn't a stretch to think I might have it, especially as my dad has all of the symptoms and more. He is chronically late, for one thing. The annoying thing is that I found out later that I'd actually been tested for ADHD as a kid. My family, great though they are, completely forgot about the diagnosis. So I grew up consistently underachieving in relation to other classmates and just assuming I wasn't trying hard enough or I was lazy. I'm glad at least I'm able to start recognizing some of these problems now and dealing with them.

I guess it's never too late.

And I'm tired now, so I don't know if I even responded to your post properly... suffice to say, I can relate. I can talk for hours about subjects I care about. Definitely use your interest in mental health to get as much as you can out of your therapy sessions. As much as I hate to admit it, talking about problems does seem to be useful.



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27 Jan 2011, 11:07 pm

My brain wanders when something does not interest me or a conversation lacks interest. My son 13 runs into problems with school work, unless he is interested in what he's studying he does not remember, this is something he just recently shared with me and I really have know idea what to do. He had Structure of Intellect testing done last summer which showed his memory was really bad and we have worked on various modules in an attempt to build up his memory but to no avail as far as I am concerned. Luckily we home school so we can spend extra time when it is needed, but he was totally switched off when he was in school, as was I. Clearly it also affects other areas of his life although we have not considered any medication.



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27 Jan 2011, 11:12 pm

AS_mom wrote:
My brain wanders when something does not interest me or a conversation lacks interest. My son 13 runs into problems with school work, unless he is interested in what he's studying he does not remember, this is something he just recently shared with me and I really have know idea what to do. He had Structure of Intellect testing done last summer which showed his memory was really bad and we have worked on various modules in an attempt to build up his memory but to no avail as far as I am concerned. Luckily we home school so we can spend extra time when it is needed, but he was totally switched off when he was in school, as was I. Clearly it also affects other areas of his life although we have not considered any medication.


Medication is the usual strategy.

I outline my meditation strategy in this thread. Well, it's not mine, I borrowed it.

I've never taught a child how to meditate,so I've no idea how that would go.

When I read with my niece who has terrible attention span, I prompt her to concentrate every time I can tell her mind is wandering. I don't really get enough time with her to make it into a routine thing. The problem with an outside prompt is that they don't learn to do it for themselves.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp3336023.html#3336023


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28 Jan 2011, 1:16 am

TallyMan wrote:
Interesting replies. I think my ability to concentrate on necessary (but dull) tasks is getting worse as I get older (I'm now 50). I too am a perfectionist and can concentrate very deeply on things that stimulate my mind but have massive problems motivating myself to do anything else - even very important financial / income related things. It is seriously messing with my life. I think it is time I saw a doctor about it.


Indeed. I grew up in a house where four of the five of us had some form of ADD/ADHD. You can imagine how much got done around there. :lol: My mom just went on meds and can *finally* sit down long enough to read a magazine cover to cover. :roll: There are some excellent supplements one can take either with or without meds, too, but it's good to get some sort of regimen going.

I highly recommend fish oil and Vitamin D. They are pretty easy to find, and offer all sorts of brain boosts. Also, L-Tyrosine is fantastic if you have trouble getting focused first thing. If I don't have a plan outlined for my day the night before, forget it. My day is shot before I've even had my coffee. :oops:

Anyway, I could go on for weeks about this lol, but the take home message being yeah, see someone, or at least read up on it. No need to suffer.

Thanks for posting the article, Moog. 8)


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28 Jan 2011, 1:50 am

Thanks Moog for the information. :) I had a look at the website and I will follow the other links/videos for further information. I used to practice more of a meditation "prayer" but haven't for awhile but giving a mantra for focus would probably work for both my children as they have other anxiety issues as well P.T.S.D. etc. It is worth trying as a I'm not keen on more meds at the moment.