PDD-NOS/AS vs. Giftedness?

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A way of thinking about giftedness is to understand the spectrum, their are two types of brain on the spectrum, autistic brain at one extreme and normal brain at the other.

autistic brain -------------------------------------------------------------------------------normal brain
in between are the pervasive development disorders
they are aspergers, pdd,nos high functioning autism etc.

autistic brains like routine, sameness, being focused on repeating behaviours etc

normal brains i understand, like chaos, if your on the spectrum you will have more autistic traits than normal traits, inparticular asperger individuals have brains structured like autistic brains, but are less effected by austic disability. to be gifted you must have a narrow set of traits, such as very focused, divergent intelligence not convergent like NT's and so on. in other words you must be autistic to be gifted, it is almost impossible for NT's to be gifted. Both Einstien and Mozart were thought to be aspies.

A good book that deals with giftedness is 'The world of the autistic child' by Bryna Siegal.

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High functioning neurotypicals, another kind of human?

I define giftedness as "I was tested in the first grade and classified as gifted." Since I have a lot of mixed feelings (and bitterness) about this and its impact on my school life and lack of support, it's not really about ego.

And I agree it is about traits that society values, although it's even spotty on that.

What bothers me about the whole thing is the assumption that being gifted or a genius means being able to overcome cognitive disabilities with wit and intellect. I do think that to some extent, it is easier to develop coping strategies, but at the same time coping strategies can only compensate for so much. Plus, one's intellect might not be ideally suited toward compensating for particular cognitive disabilities or combinations thereof.



Yeah, I get along with people I can talk to about my favorite things. I don't really care how intelligent they may or may not be.

You can be intelligent without necessary accomplish something. Gifted is somethings that some peoples simply are, either or not they succesfull.


Some NTs are indeed gifted. That there is some commons traits between autism and giftedness don't mean they're the same thing.


I guess gifteds are likelly to have a better theory of mind, even though they can have difficulty to relate to "normal" peoples from being weirds.


Very true.


I was said be "gifted and lazy" by some professional as a kid. A more recent test don't seeem of the opinion that I'm gifted though. (I can confirm the "lazy" part at least )
Online I get along well with the gifteds of Gifted Haven, but I can't say for real life.

Last edited by Tollorin on 06 Feb 2011, 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

Just an interesting article and perspective RE "intelligence"

http://answers.learninginfo.org/iq-scores.htm

I find it interesting that there are so many people saying they are "gifted" and also "low functioning" This article talks about being careful to pin too much weight on the IQ scores alone.

My psychologist used my job title/role, hobbies, my salary/net worth, my accomplishment and other factors in determining my IQ and subsequently my "gifted" label. He says that is the way he does it for court cases as well. IQ is MUCH more than just the test scores.

Another post by mistake, sorry

I have never claimed to be "low functioning" or really any level of functioning. If you have to put a functioning label on me, it'd be "high functioning" based on what amounts to arbitrary standards.

Everything you've listed here is impacted by executive function, something that seems to get ignored in these discussions.

Anyway, my therapist already has indicated I'm far more aware of my own mental state and have developed an extensive array of coping strategies that goes well beyond what she has seen from other clients. Unfortunately, these coping strategies don't really help with executive dysfunction on a consistent basis despite attempts on my part to do otherwise.

And I mean aside from that, I learn things fast. I taught myself all of the basics of playing a guitar in under a day and from there it was learning songs, you know? I've written a 50,000 word book in a week (which had good reactions) - although in the long term, that was a mistake (burnout is no fun). These aren't my only accomplishments, and if I can sustain focus I can succeed at whatever I am working on. Unfortunately, more often than not, I can't. If I can get myself mobilized, I can do things, but I can't sustain it for more than a few months at a time. It's like building a house of cards near open windows - I can make progress, but eventually the wind's going to knock it down.

It's difficult to judge everything about a person from a medium like a forum, we're not revealing everything. Not able to reveal everything.

The last paragraph of this is very sobering.

Yes. But for many people, it IS about ego, especially among certain folks I've encountered among socially isolated set ("I can't make friends because I'm so darned smart and special...no one can comprehend my deep thoughts...boohoo! Everyone else is super dumb and talks on their cell phones all the time, but not me! I'm just like Newton with my special abilities!!" Me: "Meh."), which is why I do not gel with many self-described "gifted" people. Most of the people I've met who meet my personal criteria for "high intelligence" have been 1.)extroverts, and 2.) don't actually go around describing themselves as "highly intelligent."

As for your other points, I agree completely. Being "good" at one thing in no way implies being "good" at something else, and that includes "life skills."



Which is just a fancy way of saying you're good at doing something. Jocks are "gifted" at sports, kids who are good at cooking are "gifted" at frying eggs, kids who get good grades in math are "gifted" with numbers...blahblah. It's practically meaningless, unless, of course, you can actually be bothered to do something with your "giftedness." Otherwise, so what? Also, I never understood the point of "gifted" classes. It seems that ALL children could benefit from extra attention and resources.



Darn straight. And, for the record, you certainly meet my definition of an "intelligent person." It's not that I suspect you care what I think, I just wanted to say something positive since it seems I'm being a "Negative Nancy" in this thread.

I didn't meant it that way. What I talk about is intellectual giftedness. A intelligence in the top 2-5% of the population. And it's not because you accomplish nothing and not having a college diploma with a high paying job that this intelligence don't exist.
Of course giving more attention and ressources is good for all kids, but gifted kids do need special program because their differents, got special needs and regular class may be painful and detrimental to them.

So was I. Do sports and cooking not fit into your definition of "intelligence?"



What is this "intelligence?" Can you define it? My point is, without actually accomplishing anything, it's really a rather pointless distinction to make, especially since there is no concrete, standard definition of what constitutes "intelligence."

Personally, I define a "genius" as someone who conributes to human understanding in the realm of science, art, ect., and helps push civilization to the next level. If you haven't done that, then you may be "bright," "talented," or even "intelligent," but I will not see you as a "genius." As for "intelligence" itself, it's an ill-defined, nebulous concept that people tend to describe in ways that are most flattering to themselves. Meh.



Regular classes are painful and deterimental to many children, regardless of where they fall on some arbitrary spectrum of "gifted/not gifted." It's about how society chooses to define what constitutes "giftedness."

I agree with all the posts saying being gifted or uber smart can be mostly about ego. I've seen plenty of people claim they are geniuses, but, as Wendy once asked, where's the beef?

I'd rather be shown the beef patty than told about it.

LOL.

Good one, and much more succint than I've managed thus far.

This is intersting as I wonder what this intellectual "gifted" is on the IQ charts. If it is only 2.2 percent who fall in the 140+ range than there is no way that there are so many "gifted" people here on WP. I suspect that this label encompases 130+ or perhaps even lower.

The way my pyschologist did it and the algorithm that was used is actually a pretty cool and unique way of looking at intelligence because it actually takes the raw IQ tests and adds the ability to reason/adapt in the world to the equation. The system was designed for court cases whereby an adult suffers head trauma and the amount awarded is based upon the victim's previous IQ and their current IQ. The previous IQ can be determined (even without formal IQ testing) by taking all those "social" factors into consideration and this is proof enough to stand up in a court of law. He says that 10 points loss is worth a million dollars. He also gave me caution as he handed this label to me that I thought was prudent. He warned me, "Take this information and go out into the world and exercise extreme compasion and understanding to the rest of the world, because you are one car-wreck away from being normal!"

Those words ring loud and clear in my head and will for the rest of my life...

Yes. Or even worse, many people don't even understand that some of us need to compensate for poor social abilities using coping skills. They think that everybody should be able to learn social skills the "usual" way, because most people can. They call those of us who cannot learn social skills via the normal methods "weird", "strange", or "losers". They don't understand that some of us cannot learn social skills the way that they do. There is just something missing in our brains.

While I'm sure his method is valid, what about people like me? High IQ score, Master's Degree, job titles after graduating: typist, customer service representative, warehouse worker.....let go for being "too slow"...salaries include minimum wage...

I would like to unlock this puzzle, which for now, I sum up to "very poor social skills."

Even if gifted is 130+, this mean two standard deviations above the average - around 2% of the population.

Why so much gifteds in the forum? Possibly causes:

1 - Autism is really more usual in intelligent people

2 - Autistic people tend to the extremes of intelligence distribution - many gifteds and many with mental retardation; because autistics with very low IQ will have difficulty in participating in the discussions, only the gifted autistics appear in the forum

3- High IQ people are over-represented in the Net, and specially in discussion forums

4 - Discussing about autism is a relativity abstract topic of discussion, then attractive to high IQ people

5 - many gifted children are being diagnosed as having AS