Gingrich just thinks Obama won't go for the throat.

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Inuyasha
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16 May 2011, 5:15 pm

simon_says wrote:

Yes, I believe you believe that. :lol:

I love the war he's started with the GOP over the Republican Medicare plan. Ryan said of Gingrich, ""with allies like that, who needs the left?" That is classic Newt. He's on 12 sides of every issue. His record on global warming is equally erratic.

His candidacy will be an epic disaster.

I disagree with Newt over Ryan's healthcare plan. The Global Warming ad was before climate gate was exposed, so that can be explained as something other than a flip flop.

MarketAndChurch
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16 May 2011, 5:23 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

Obviously if both opinions are still current then one did not win.
and listen close this is the tricky part.
since your view is nearly identical to British imperialism and mine seems to be homegrown.
I am forced to say that mine is the uniquely American view even if most of our regimes have
been European style internationalists.

For the question of why you are sentimental beats me maybe you are more NT than me.
maybe you were raised wrong. Maybe you believe in a giant ghost that smiles on Americas murders.
I think there might be organic physiological reasons that Theism and Jingoism correlate so strongly.

Well that's fine if you think that way... I don't agree, but at least your acknowledging that you were wrong in your misread of our history.

I don't know why you can't refrain from looking down on me for having the views that I do. I find it unfortunate yet normative when speaking to someone and they treat their views as objective and mine as one of an idealist, often implying that I'm not a crazy kook, and that history doesn't support my thinking. I wish I were an NT... my asperger symptoms I find more sever then other Aspies I've met, at least they can vocalize their thoughts without caring what other people think of it. I didn't come to these views until the last 4 years of my 24 years of existence through reading and studying.

Also, drop the "The" from Theism and that quote is correct, just so we can include political religions like the Communism or Fascism.

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simon_says
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16 May 2011, 5:34 pm

Also, you can't impose a no-fly zone without the US knocking down the door. The Qatari air force would be shot out of the sky. Gingrich said impose it that evening. Something only the US and NATO could manage. And the Arabs are not under his command to impose anything. He would need to negotiate their involvement as Obama has done. That took weeks to get a few dozen jets. The only reasonable interpretation of "this evening" involves US/NATO forces.

If you believe that Gingrich meant he would "impose" a NFZ "this evening" with someone else's second or third rate air force, that would be even more embarrassing for him. That shows a lack of understanding of the military and diplomatic requirements of getting a NFZ together.

He's better off with the flip-flopper label.

Inuyasha
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16 May 2011, 5:40 pm

simon_says wrote:

Last I checked the UK, France, Italy, Egypt, Turkey, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia all have Air Forces with military aircraft.

JakobVirgil
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16 May 2011, 5:48 pm

MarketAndChurch wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

Well that's fine if you think that way... I don't agree, but at least your (1)acknowledging that you were wrong in your misread of our history.

I don't know why you can't refrain from looking down on me for having the views that I do. I find it unfortunate yet normative when speaking to someone and they treat their views as objective and mine as one of an idealist, often implying that I'm not a crazy kook, and that history doesn't support my thinking. I wish I were an NT... my asperger symptoms I find more sever then other Aspies I've met, at least they can vocalize their thoughts without caring what other people think of it. I didn't come to these views until the last 4 years of my 24 years of existence through reading and studying.

Also, drop the "The" from Theism and that quote is correct, just so we can include political religions like the Communism or Fascism (2).

I treat nationalism, patriotism, Particularism, and militarism as diseases that come from emotionalism.
you embrace them I assume you so are infected with them
(1) I think you are misreading me I am accommodating that some
Americans are simple minded imperialists and that the scum rises to the top.
I reject your primary American urge to power theory as reductionist revisionist nonsense.
I maintain that the authentic American view is isolationist even the Monroe doctrine
and manifest destiny (both stains as vile as slavery on the american character)
are statements of limits.
(2) the belief in God seems to correlate with Jingoism more a more profound way then Marxism.
morale was a profound issue in soviets.
and Fascism is almost always theistic so no.

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simon_says
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16 May 2011, 5:50 pm

Quote:

Last I checked the UK, France, Italy, Egypt, Turkey, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia all have Air Forces with military aircraft.

Sweetheart, subtract the NATO allies if you know them. I said US/NATO. And even NATO heavily relied on US cruise missiles to take out his air defenses. Many hundreds of them. Gingrich said he wouldnt use US or Euro forces.

The Arab states that signed on just don't have that kind of ground attack capability. If you just fly over without disabling the AA, you'll be shot down. Saudi Arabia and Egypt would have had a very rough time but they refused to come anyway. They certainly aren't available for a highly structured Libyan NFZ in a single evening's notice. That's a fantasy.

It would be up to Qatar and UAE and they havent struck a single AA site.

Kraichgauer
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16 May 2011, 6:04 pm

I'd be loathe to depend on Arab, or any third world military force, anyhow.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

simon_says
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16 May 2011, 6:09 pm

Exactly. And the Arabs who did show aren't striking ground targets at all. They are only doing air patrol. If they had magically survived his intact AA, they would have been flying over as Gaddafi's tanks took the country back.

Clearly Gingrich meant "impose" the NFZ "this evening" with US-NATO forces. The only option he would have as US president to implement a rapid response.

Jacoby
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17 May 2011, 5:56 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G2vovE12tk[/youtube]

Newt's campaign is self-destructing after the Paul Ryan thing, I love it.

JakobVirgil
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17 May 2011, 6:20 am

Jacoby wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G2vovE12tk[/youtube]

Newt's campaign is self-destructing after the Paul Ryan thing, I love it.

wow fox eats their own

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Kraichgauer
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17 May 2011, 12:07 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G2vovE12tk[/youtube]

Newt's campaign is self-destructing after the Paul Ryan thing, I love it.

wow fox eats their own

Still, that put a smile on my face!

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Inuyasha
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17 May 2011, 6:05 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G2vovE12tk[/youtube]

Newt's campaign is self-destructing after the Paul Ryan thing, I love it.

wow fox eats their own

Actually it shows that Fox News will report negatives on politicians running for office, it doesn't matter if they are Democrat or Republican. Nor does it matter that it is a former contributor, if someone decides to shoot themselves in the foot from a political standpoint, Fox News will report on it.

Their slogan is: "Fair and Balanced" for a reason.

dionysian
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17 May 2011, 6:09 pm

Inuyasha wrote:

Their slogan is: "Fair and Balanced" for a reason.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDthMGtZKa4[/youtube]

Jacoby
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18 May 2011, 6:44 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSb3kTA6vVI&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

Poor Newt can't catch a break :cry:

He apparently called up Paul Ryan to apologize to him for his comment too

Vexcalibur
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18 May 2011, 7:31 am

Inuyasha wrote:

simon_says wrote:

Yes, I believe you believe that. :lol:

I disagree with Newt over Ryan's healthcare plan. The Global Warming ad was before climate gate was exposed, so that can be explained as something other than a flip flop.

ClimateGate: Distortion by mainstream media

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Kraichgauer
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18 May 2011, 12:53 pm

Jacoby wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSb3kTA6vVI&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

Poor Newt can't catch a break :cry:

He apparently called up Paul Ryan to apologize to him for his comment too

And I was gaining a little grudging respect for Gingrich for standing up to Ryan's heartless class warfare, till he tucked his tail between his legs.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

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