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Trouble remembering faces?

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guywithAS
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18 Nov 2011, 4:17 pm

emtyeye wrote:
I have always had trouble recognizing people's faces. Some people are less problematic and some just don't stick. A lot of times, people look familiar but I feel uncertian if it is the person I think it is. Once I saw my boss (I think it was my boss) at the video store but I was so unsure wheather it was him or not that I got all confused as to what to do. It's very frustrating and can be embarresing or hurt people's feelings. I have learned to smile and nod and act like I recognize people if they seem to recognize me even if I have no idea who they are or if I ever met them. Then other times I do recognize people but am unable to show it. I must be very annoying.


you have absolutely nothing to apologize for. if you've wound up partially faceblind and also on the autism spectrum you've already paid for enough in life.



sogj
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18 Nov 2011, 5:13 pm

guywithAS wrote:
do you feel you make exactly the same amount of eye contact as an NT during a conversation?


I don't know, but it doesn't matter. Autism causes people to not make eye contact, not the other way around. There is an actual physical neurological difference in the brains of people with autism vs without. Suddenly forcing yourself to make eye contact is NOT going to shrink the number of cells in your prefrontal cortexes, nor is it going to reroute synapses that have been improperly routed prenatally.

I majored in psychology and am studying neurology pre med right now. It's just way more complicated than that.


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sogj
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18 Nov 2011, 5:15 pm

emtyeye wrote:
I have always had trouble recognizing people's faces. Some people are less problematic and some just don't stick. A lot of times, people look familiar but I feel uncertian if it is the person I think it is. Once I saw my boss (I think it was my boss) at the video store but I was so unsure wheather it was him or not that I got all confused as to what to do. It's very frustrating and can be embarresing or hurt people's feelings. I have learned to smile and nod and act like I recognize people if they seem to recognize me even if I have no idea who they are or if I ever met them. Then other times I do recognize people but am unable to show it. I must be very annoying.


This is my LIFE. This happens to me ALL THE TIME!! !! ! Even today I have a hard time recognizing my own family members that only see at holidays but I've known my whole life. Facebook is fantastic for this, I study up before I'm going anywhere I might be expected to remember people.


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18 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm

sogj wrote:
emtyeye wrote:
I have always had trouble recognizing people's faces. Some people are less problematic and some just don't stick. A lot of times, people look familiar but I feel uncertian if it is the person I think it is. Once I saw my boss (I think it was my boss) at the video store but I was so unsure wheather it was him or not that I got all confused as to what to do. It's very frustrating and can be embarresing or hurt people's feelings. I have learned to smile and nod and act like I recognize people if they seem to recognize me even if I have no idea who they are or if I ever met them. Then other times I do recognize people but am unable to show it. I must be very annoying.


This is my LIFE. This happens to me ALL THE TIME!! !! ! Even today I have a hard time recognizing my own family members that only see at holidays but I've known my whole life. Facebook is fantastic for this, I study up before I'm going anywhere I might be expected to remember people.
I also use Facebook to make sure I correctly identify people when I haven't seen them in a while.



guywithAS
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18 Nov 2011, 5:25 pm

sogj wrote:
guywithAS wrote:
do you feel you make exactly the same amount of eye contact as an NT during a conversation?


I don't know, but it doesn't matter. Autism causes people to not make eye contact, not the other way around. There is an actual physical neurological difference in the brains of people with autism vs without. Suddenly forcing yourself to make eye contact is NOT going to shrink the number of cells in your prefrontal cortexes, nor is it going to reroute synapses that have been improperly routed prenatally.

I majored in psychology and am studying neurology pre med right now. It's just way more complicated than that.


i disagree. and i'm curious that you dismiss it. i think not reading body language accurately is the root cause of autism.

you may find it interesting to discuss this paper in your neurology premed class:
http://cbc.ucsd.edu/pdf/brokenmirrors_asd.pdf

consider the implications of that paper on face blindness. without knowing you, i will bet anything you are not reading body language properly and don't make anywhere near as much eye contact as an NT. your family / friends could certainly tell you. this isn't intended to be critical -- its a terrible disability.

if anyone with face blindness is willing to explain why you don't make eye contact i'd love to hear about it. are you able to make it happen if you force yourself?



Ria1989
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18 Nov 2011, 5:54 pm

Question. Now that I think about it, I can remember what people look like at a better rate if I memorize a picture of them. If I don't have a picture of them memorized it is a little more difficult. The picture is stable and steady, whereas talking with a person generally isn't. They're constantly moving around distorting my image of them. Also other factors come to mind. I still think recognizing faces isn't difficult for me since one of my interests is drawing people.

Can any of you remember what people look moreso with a picture of them in mind?


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sogj
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18 Nov 2011, 6:24 pm

guywithAS wrote:
i think not reading body language accurately is the root cause of autism.


That's great that you think that, but we're just arguing chicken and eggs here. You're arguing that being unable to read body language properly is the root cause of autism. I'm (and every medical professional in the country is) arguing that autism is the root cause of being unable to read body language properly. It's whether you consider autism to be a group of similar symptoms or an actual neurological disorder. You consider it to be a group of symptoms and once you've "worked past" the symptoms you no longer have autism. The rest of the medical community (and myself included) consider it to be an actual neurological disorder. You can cope with the symptoms, even make them disappear entirely, but the autism is still there.


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18 Nov 2011, 6:52 pm

sogj wrote:
emtyeye wrote:
I have always had trouble recognizing people's faces. Some people are less problematic and some just don't stick. A lot of times, people look familiar but I feel uncertian if it is the person I think it is. Once I saw my boss (I think it was my boss) at the video store but I was so unsure wheather it was him or not that I got all confused as to what to do. It's very frustrating and can be embarresing or hurt people's feelings. I have learned to smile and nod and act like I recognize people if they seem to recognize me even if I have no idea who they are or if I ever met them. Then other times I do recognize people but am unable to show it. I must be very annoying.


This is my LIFE. This happens to me ALL THE TIME!! !! ! Even today I have a hard time recognizing my own family members that only see at holidays but I've known my whole life. Facebook is fantastic for this, I study up before I'm going anywhere I might be expected to remember people.

Oh... yes, that happens to me too. I'm out and about and I'll inadvertently ignore someone that I should know. Or, the reverse, that I'll say hi to someone I thought I recognized, only to realize that they weren't the person I thought they were. Both are quite frustrating!

As for the eye contact thing, I do look at people. I just don't look at people all the time. If I'm concentrating on what I'm saying, I'm definitely not gonna be looking them in the eye. The phrase... "do you want me to talk with you or do you want me to look at you?" is very applicable. I have trouble doing both at the same time.


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syrella
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18 Nov 2011, 7:00 pm

Ria1989 wrote:
Question. Now that I think about it, I can remember what people look like at a better rate if I memorize a picture of them. If I don't have a picture of them memorized it is a little more difficult. The picture is stable and steady, whereas talking with a person generally isn't. They're constantly moving around distorting my image of them. Also other factors come to mind. I still think recognizing faces isn't difficult for me since one of my interests is drawing people.

Can any of you remember what people look moreso with a picture of them in mind?

I think the problem is generating that picture of them. If I had a clear image in my head, I'd probably have much less difficulty recognizing them.


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guywithAS
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18 Nov 2011, 8:35 pm

syrella wrote:
As for the eye contact thing, I do look at people. I just don't look at people all the time. If I'm concentrating on what I'm saying, I'm definitely not gonna be looking them in the eye. The phrase... "do you want me to talk with you or do you want me to look at you?" is very applicable. I have trouble doing both at the same time.


absolutely fascinating!

if we tie this in, via a very tough way and said -- you could grow out of autism if you learned to really pay attention to facial expressions -- would you be able to force yourself? or is the fact that its hard to both look at people and listen at the same time make this impossible?



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18 Nov 2011, 9:35 pm

guywithAS wrote:
syrella wrote:
As for the eye contact thing, I do look at people. I just don't look at people all the time. If I'm concentrating on what I'm saying, I'm definitely not gonna be looking them in the eye. The phrase... "do you want me to talk with you or do you want me to look at you?" is very applicable. I have trouble doing both at the same time.


absolutely fascinating!

if we tie this in, via a very tough way and said -- you could grow out of autism if you learned to really pay attention to facial expressions -- would you be able to force yourself? or is the fact that its hard to both look at people and listen at the same time make this impossible?

It's that I have trouble maintaining a proper conversation if I'm also busy staring at their face. I'm easily distracted and will lose my train of thought. In other words, I won't respond in time or appropriately. For me, making eye contact isn't really a problem if I'm not actively talking or listening. I will study people's faces sometimes, for example, when in a group talk situation. Groups are probably the worst for me since I never know where to look and tend to feel overwhelmed.

I find it's easier when I'm talking with people I know well and in one-on-one situations. They don't mind frequent pausing in the conversation or me getting distracted.

I also feel inclined to say I'm probably more on the ADHD/ social anxiety side rather than traditionally autistic. I can pick up on social cues-- I just miss them sometimes.

For me, I'd say the trouble comes down to difficulty with multitasking.


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sogj
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18 Nov 2011, 9:45 pm

guywithAS wrote:
if we tie this in, via a very tough way and said -- you could grow out of autism if you learned to really pay attention to facial expressions -- would you be able to force yourself?


You can't grow out of autism. You can learn to handle its symptoms but you can't rewire your brain.


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syrella
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18 Nov 2011, 10:15 pm

sogj wrote:
guywithAS wrote:
if we tie this in, via a very tough way and said -- you could grow out of autism if you learned to really pay attention to facial expressions -- would you be able to force yourself?


You can't grow out of autism. You can learn to handle its symptoms but you can't rewire your brain.

Agreed. There are ways of managing symptoms, to the point where they seem to go away or are no longer diagnosable, but that isn't the same as never having had them in the first place... and the original wiring of the brain has not changed significantly.


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