Is birth control a sin and wrong ?
AngelRho
Veteran
Joined: 4 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,366
Location: The Landmass between N.O. and Mobile
That just means that God made everything/everyone--including those mentioned here.
Exactly how is this an expression of hatred towards those people? All this is doing is defining who it is that is ritually or ceremonially clean and is allowed to offer sacrifices in the tabernacle and the temple. The Levite priests had the same requirement at all times. Not EVERYONE was required to offer sacrifices at the temple. It was only certain family representatives from the various tribes and clans. So if the head of a clan was ritually unfit to offer sacrifices the next guy in line could go in his place. It wasn't that big a deal, but could be upsetting for someone who looked forward to the festivals. Remember, God prefers obedience to sacrifices. But this does not mean God hates those dealing with unfortunate circumstances. It is certainly not an edict that demands killing cripples.
I didn't ask who Jesus will damn. I asked where it is found in the NT where Jesus commanded His disciples to kill homosexuals.
Hypocrites (Matthew 24:51), The Unforgiving (Mark 11:26), Homosexuals (Romans 1:26, 27), Fornicators (Romans 1:29), The Wicked (Romans 1:29), The Covetous (Romans 1:29), The Malicious (Romans 1:29), The Envious (Romans 1:29), Murderers (Romans 1:29), The Deceitful (Romans 1:29), Backbiters (Romans 1:30), Haters of God (Romans 1:30), The Despiteful (Romans 1:30), The Proud (Romans 1:30), Boasters (Romans 1:30), Inventors of evil (Romans 1:30), Disobedient to parents (Romans 1:30), Covenant breakers (Romans 1:31), The Unmerciful (Romans 1:31), The Implacable (Romans 1:31), The Unrighteous (1Corinthians 6:9), Idolaters (1Corinthians 6:9), Adulterers (1Corinthians 6:9), The Effeminate (1Corinthians 6:9), Thieves (1Corinthians 6:10), Drunkards (1Corinthians 6:10), Reviler (1Corinthians 6:10), Extortioners (1Corinthians 6:10), The Fearful (Revelation 21:8), The Unbelieving (Revelation 21:8), The Abominable (Revelation 21:8), Whoremongers (Revelation 21:8)
And where in all of that does Jesus command us to persecute any of those people? I'm waiting...
Westboro Baptist Church founder Pastor Fred Phelps attempted to clarify his group?s position by proclaiming, ?God doesn?t hate cripples because they?re crippled. Cripples are crippled because God hates them. ret*ds are brute beasts that shamelessly consume their own mucous the way vile dogs eat their own vomit. Their mind is of such a reprobate nature they are given to sexually gratifying themselves in public while their physically disabled cohorts take exorbitantly long periods of time to walk down narrow hallways, slowing the progress of those not despised by God and impeding their holy endeavors.?
How are these attitudes in line with the nature and character of Jesus Christ, who they presume to imitate by calling themselves Christians? Are they even really Christians at all?
That just means that God made everything/everyone--including those mentioned here.
Exactly how is this an expression of hatred towards those people? All this is doing is defining who it is that is ritually or ceremonially clean and is allowed to offer sacrifices in the tabernacle and the temple. The Levite priests had the same requirement at all times. Not EVERYONE was required to offer sacrifices at the temple. It was only certain family representatives from the various tribes and clans. So if the head of a clan was ritually unfit to offer sacrifices the next guy in line could go in his place. It wasn't that big a deal, but could be upsetting for someone who looked forward to the festivals. Remember, God prefers obedience to sacrifices. But this does not mean God hates those dealing with unfortunate circumstances. It is certainly not an edict that demands killing cripples.
I didn't ask who Jesus will damn. I asked where it is found in the NT where Jesus commanded His disciples to kill homosexuals.
Hypocrites (Matthew 24:51), The Unforgiving (Mark 11:26), Homosexuals (Romans 1:26, 27), Fornicators (Romans 1:29), The Wicked (Romans 1:29), The Covetous (Romans 1:29), The Malicious (Romans 1:29), The Envious (Romans 1:29), Murderers (Romans 1:29), The Deceitful (Romans 1:29), Backbiters (Romans 1:30), Haters of God (Romans 1:30), The Despiteful (Romans 1:30), The Proud (Romans 1:30), Boasters (Romans 1:30), Inventors of evil (Romans 1:30), Disobedient to parents (Romans 1:30), Covenant breakers (Romans 1:31), The Unmerciful (Romans 1:31), The Implacable (Romans 1:31), The Unrighteous (1Corinthians 6:9), Idolaters (1Corinthians 6:9), Adulterers (1Corinthians 6:9), The Effeminate (1Corinthians 6:9), Thieves (1Corinthians 6:10), Drunkards (1Corinthians 6:10), Reviler (1Corinthians 6:10), Extortioners (1Corinthians 6:10), The Fearful (Revelation 21:8), The Unbelieving (Revelation 21:8), The Abominable (Revelation 21:8), Whoremongers (Revelation 21:8)
And where in all of that does Jesus command us to persecute any of those people? I'm waiting...
Westboro Baptist Church founder Pastor Fred Phelps attempted to clarify his group?s position by proclaiming, ?God doesn?t hate cripples because they?re crippled. Cripples are crippled because God hates them. ret*ds are brute beasts that shamelessly consume their own mucous the way vile dogs eat their own vomit. Their mind is of such a reprobate nature they are given to sexually gratifying themselves in public while their physically disabled cohorts take exorbitantly long periods of time to walk down narrow hallways, slowing the progress of those not despised by God and impeding their holy endeavors.?
How are these attitudes in line with the nature and character of Jesus Christ, who they presume to imitate by calling themselves Christians? Are they even really Christians at all?
actually you didn't ask about homosexuals you asked about cripples
and it clearly states that cripples will profane the altar of God if they approach which means disrespect with their presence and thwe Westboro Baptist Church and those like them are the ONLY Christians who truly follow the teachings of the bible as it is written unlike you faux Christians, before my end as a Christian i was turning fundamentalist hell i used to pray to God to leave me behind when the rapture occured so i could suffer with the unsaved and try to convert them and to hopefully become a martyr in the process, that is literally where my head was back then, when i was a Christian i was a True Christian unlike most of the slanderers of His name, such as yourself
but even i admit that back then i was ignorant and my old beliefs were the ravings of a madman
_________________
WP Strident Atheist
If you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, have accepted him as your lord and savior, and are 100% proud of it, put this in your sig.
Attention Right-to-Lifers:
If birth control is wrong, because you are playing god by not fertilizing an egg that "god" wants to become a child..
THEN so is Invitro-Fertilization!
*May be god doesn't want you to get pregnant, and getting invitro is AGAINST his/her will!
Also:
How many of you PRO-LIFE People are against the wars? against the death penalty? against forced vaccinations/drugging by the state?
And how many of you Pro-lifers have actually ADOPTED one of the thousands of foster kids out there???
Likewise you could ask how many pro-choicers are against wars, death penalty, etc.
That is actually not a contradiction. For "conservatives," it comes from a patriarchical model of family governance: father know best, obey him, if you mess up you will be punished so you will learn to do the right thing next time. For "liberals," it comes from the nurturing model of family: parents support the child, and forgive them even when they mess up, try to gently teach and guide them to do the right thing next time of their own volition. "Moderates" use both of these techniques, sometimes one, sometimes the other.
WRT abortion: the Patriarch model says "you messed up, pay the price by taking responsibility and raising the child. The Nurturing model says: "it is awful this happened, you should have a chance to start over."
WRT to capital punishment: the Nurturing model says: "You should have a chance to learn why what you did is wrong, and reform yourself." The Patriarch model says: "you messed up. accept your punishment and serve as a deterrent to other wrongdoers."
WRT vaccinations: Partiarchy says: "we know better than you and you should trust us and obey for your own good." Nurturing says: "for good or ill, you should be able to choose what happens to your body, even if it means becoming a disease carrier that might infect other people."
Not contradictory at all, seen from this perspective.
Fundamentalists are rather firmly in the partiarch camp. "God told us what to do, obey His laws, or suffer the punishment you deserve."
_________________
No dx yet ... AS=171/200,NT=13/200 ... EQ=9/SQ=128 ... AQ=39 ... MB=IntJ
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birth_control
No.....procreation is.
Both birth control and abortion (at any time, for any reason....punch a late-term fetus for Jesus )....are gifts from the Ancient Ones who rightfully want nothing more than to see even the memory of humankind's existence wiped from the cosmos.
Just a friendly reminder from your local anti-natalist misanthrope.
Horus! You're back.
I am surprised anyone remembers me.
It's been many moons. I have much to say as soon as I can find the time to say it. I've actually been employed for nearly a year now after 18 months of unemployment.
Hope you are well!! !
-remembers the Horus- Oh and... Aren't you from Egypt or somewhere like that? :O I think you had posted your picture long ago.
Hahahaha.....no....I am not from Egypt. I did post my picture and since I have a dark, Mediterranean complexion, ( I am Italian, Serbian and Ashkenazi Jewish and I live in South Florida) I suppose I could be mistaken for an Egyptian. I chose the name "Horus" more out of my fascination with ancient cultures, mythology, mysticism, occultism (Aleister Crowley referred to our age as "The Aeon of Horus") and all that jazz.
Cheers!! !
_________________
Morning comes the sunrise and i'm driven to my bed, I see that it is empty and there's devils in my head. I embrace, the many-colored beast...I grow weary of the torment....can there be no peace? I find myself just wishing, that my life would simply cease
AngelRho
Veteran
Joined: 4 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,366
Location: The Landmass between N.O. and Mobile
I asked about both, actually. See page 2:
teach them the scriptures? anything but that!
we were debating gays in the military today in my economy class and one girl tried suggesting its wrong because America is based in Christianity and the forefathers wanted us to follow scriptures which involved killing homosexuals and cripples as the bible demands even though in truth America is a Secular nation as George Washington himself even said and America believes in Equallity for ALL men which the bible is against
Sounds like that girl doesn't really know what she's talking about.
I do think that the forefathers built our nation on Christian principles. But also keep in mind they were also children of the Enlightenment. So it's not JUST about Christian values. It's more complicated than that.
I don't get where the Bible is against "Equality for ALL." Ecclesiastes teaches that Sheol is the fate of the rich man and the poor man. When the disciples argued about who would be the greatest in the kingdom of heaven, Jesus told them that in order to be the greatest, you must first become the least. Also, the greatest on earth would be the least in heaven. So... How can the greatest (richest) on earth become the least and the least (poorest) on earth be the greatest in heaven if they all share in God's providence? It's not a competition. Christians are to be servants to each other and not show favoritism. And if all brothers and sisters in Christ are servants and children of God the Father, then we are all equals before God. Clearly the Bible does teach equality.
Killing homosexuals is Hebrew law for the purpose of an Israelite theocracy. That has nothing to do with Gentiles/Christians.
Killing cripples? Where is that in the Bible at all? The only thing about cripples is that they are ritually unclean for the purpose of serving in the temple. That doesn't make them outcasts of society. And...again...that's Hebrew ceremonial law. That's not for Christians.
Advice against homosexuality in the NT has to do with moral behavior that is acceptable for Christians. If you don't like that homosexuality is considered wrong, then that's your issue. I can't help you with that one. But where is it written in the NT that Jesus instructed His followers to kill homosexuals?
In bold.
All you have been able to prove so far is that ritually unclean people were forbidden to approach certain areas of the tabernacle/temple. That's all. You have not demonstrated that in any way God hates anyone for being sinners OR for being imperfect, whether they become impure by deliberate sinful actions, whether they are born that way, or whether they become impure for reasons beyond their control. As I recall even Aaron the high priest was prevented from offering sacrifices due to a death in the family. And even in the event that things happen, as they do, there are other rituals through which the unclean may be declared clean and can resume religious activities. Even when Jesus healed the unclean, He commanded them to present themselves to the priests in order to satisfy the requirements of the Levitical law. So if this is what you're going by, you're only proving that God, while demanding only the best in the way of worship and service, is still a loving and merciful God who loves and cares for His people in spite of their condition.
Now, that's all well and good for the ancient Israelites. But what about Christians? Christians are not Jews (though Jews are welcome as well as Gentiles, and there are Jews who are also Christians), so we are subject to the laws and customs of the societies in which we live. The little civil disobedience we are allowed by tradition has to do with the refusal to compromise our faith. The NT serves as a guide for proper behavior of Christians as well as a guide for correct doctrine.
Where in the NT, particularly the gospels, does Jesus command His disciples to kill the people you mentioned? Could be homosexuals, could be cripples, could be any kind of sinner you can think of. Still waiting...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birth_control
No.....procreation is.
Both birth control and abortion (at any time, for any reason....punch a late-term fetus for Jesus )....are gifts from the Ancient Ones who rightfully want nothing more than to see even the memory of humankind's existence wiped from the cosmos.
Just a friendly reminder from your local anti-natalist misanthrope.
Horus! You're back.
I am surprised anyone remembers me.
It's been many moons. I have much to say as soon as I can find the time to say it. I've actually been employed for nearly a year now after 18 months of unemployment.
Hope you are well!! !
-remembers the Horus- Oh and... Aren't you from Egypt or somewhere like that? :O I think you had posted your picture long ago.
Hahahaha.....no....I am not from Egypt. I did post my picture and since I have a dark, Mediterranean complexion, ( I am Italian, Serbian and Ashkenazi Jewish and I live in South Florida) I suppose I could be mistaken for an Egyptian. I chose the name "Horus" more out of my fascination with ancient cultures, mythology, mysticism, occultism (Aleister Crowley referred to our age as "The Aeon of Horus") and all that jazz.
Cheers!! !
Oh. Ok. :p I just remember reading that people that had commented on your picture "thought" you were egyptian, so maybe that stuck. And the name surely didn't help me. ^.^;
I don't consider that a human, and I'm not even sure I consider it alive.
.
It has half of what it takes to be a living thing. Any organic thing that can maintain its thermodynamic state far from equilibrium for a significant period of time has one of the characteristics of a living thing. The other is the ability to replicate. Sperm cells (and eggs) cannot replicate themselves. Together they make a thing that can replicate itself.
ruveyn
If birth control is wrong, because you are playing god by not fertilizing an egg that "god" wants to become a child..
THEN so is Invitro-Fertilization!
*May be god doesn't want you to get pregnant, and getting invitro is AGAINST his/her will!
Actually, AspieRoss, I think the Catholic Church is pro-life AND against in-vitro fertilization. So yes, some pro-lifers are also opposed to IVF.
Similar Topics | |
---|---|
US Border Control is a Joke |
14 Feb 2024, 3:47 pm |
something wrong |
17 Mar 2024, 8:04 pm |
Something Wrong With my Cat |
04 Feb 2024, 9:32 pm |
Would I be wrong to do this? |
21 Feb 2024, 5:40 am |