"It's my birthday, so vote against 'Gay Marriage'"

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CrazyCatLord
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02 Feb 2012, 11:27 pm

TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
CrazyCatLord wrote:
I think that TV series like Star Trek inspired many kids to want to become a scientist like Spock or an engineer like Scotty. I missed out on all those influences, and also on memes that heavily influenced the youth language (like the internet does nowadays). As a result, I had very little to talk about with my peers at school, which made it even harder for me to socialize and find friends than it already is for most aspies.


I had TV as a kid and still couldn't find anything to relate to my peers with. :shrug:


Perhaps I didn't miss out on much then :)

But you have no idea how badly I wanted to see the first Star Wars movie. Everybody was raving about it and all kids collected the action figures and toys, which I also wasn't allowed to buy. Oh well. I survived it :)



TeaEarlGreyHot
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02 Feb 2012, 11:32 pm

CrazyCatLord wrote:
TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
CrazyCatLord wrote:
I think that TV series like Star Trek inspired many kids to want to become a scientist like Spock or an engineer like Scotty. I missed out on all those influences, and also on memes that heavily influenced the youth language (like the internet does nowadays). As a result, I had very little to talk about with my peers at school, which made it even harder for me to socialize and find friends than it already is for most aspies.


I had TV as a kid and still couldn't find anything to relate to my peers with. :shrug:


Perhaps I didn't miss out on much then :)

But you have no idea how badly I wanted to see the first Star Wars movie. Everybody was raving about it and all kids collected the action figures and toys, which I also wasn't allowed to buy. Oh well. I survived it :)


The things I watched on TV as a kid put me in the 'weird' category. By the time I was in school, Star Wars was a nerd thing and would get you ostracized. It also didn't help that I always carried at least 3 books with me (many of which were insect books or sci-fi) and was constantly writing in my notebook.

I found out rather fast that other kids (especially the other girls) didn't want to hear about the super cool new information I'd read about some obscure beetle or that Black Widows rarely injected poison when they bit humans.


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AngelRho
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02 Feb 2012, 11:46 pm

puddingmouse wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
but public school is particularly friendly to children who don't fit the "norm"

Say WHAT??? Since WHEN???


Sarcasm sammich!

I'm not the one being sarcastic. Granted, I was brought up in a private school and saw myself, a few of my friends, and every disabled kid and every foreign exchange student treated lower than garbage. Public schools are probably on even par with private schools in terms of how odd ducks like myself are tolerated--the main difference being the level of physical brutality involved and the greater tendency of teachers to just look the other way.

I also taught in public schools for three years. While I eventually did gain the respect of the students, the administrators I had to put up with were horrible. I faired somewhat better the two years I spent in a private school. Snobby students turn into snobby parents, though, so I spent more time fighting old demons than actually getting quality instruction in. Since I don't really fit in anywhere, I ended up going into business for myself and working one-on-one with elementary kids. I'm MUCH happier now, and I'm able to pursue things I'm genuinely interested in.

Slight digression: "Those who can't, teach" really does seem to be true quite often. What sucks is that if you "can," they don't want you! Heaven forbid I actually try to be active in my field of interest...



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02 Feb 2012, 11:56 pm

^

I meant reverse sarcasm sammich! :lol:

I've found that you can't generalise too much about which type of schools are the most welcoming of 'different' students. Plus kids will be bar stewards everywhere. I've found that the status of a school has little relation to how seriously they deal with bullying.


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AngelRho
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03 Feb 2012, 12:13 am

TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
AngelRho, I knew some churches did that but I really was curious why the no TV part. I don't own one myself, but it's a personal choice. I don't, as of right now, go to any church but was raised (and plan to go back as soon as I figure out logistics) in the LDS church.

I think one should always be careful what organized religion they choose to join, but obviously not everyone understands or sees the warning signs that indicate the religion may be a cult.

I've GOT to stop posting here tonight...

Anyway...

That's funny to me...I don't think I'd have ever pegged you as the LDS type!

Actually, what's also funny to me in a sad sort of way is that many if not most Protestant groups view LDS as a dangerous cult. I got to know a few LDS members in my area, and with one exception they were all really nice people. The part that really made it hard not to laugh was when a good LDS friend of mine commented on how many cults there are in this area. I wanted to ask whether she thought I was a cult member.

8O

The lady who was NOT so nice to me was one of those who just smiled all the time. I mean ALL the time. I can understand the need to appear cheerful all the time, especially if you feel blessed by God and today is the first day of the rest of your life. I do that, too. But just smilin'-cuz-God-luvz-you all the time doesn't do you a bit of good if you aren't genuinely happy. This particular person had a very condescending way of communicating, all behind that eat-$h!+-and-die happy-face, which just amplified the whole I'm-superior-to-you-cuz-I'm-a-Mormon-and-I-think-you're-stupid look. It's very hard to explain, but people instinctively know when you're being disingenuous. It's like, part of you feels guilty for breathing the same air as this person since you aren't worthy, but on the other hand you're relieved because nobody else likes her, either. Once I figured out she didn't have any true friends because of the way she treated other people, I just wanted to pull her aside and tell her (right after drinking a large cup of coffee, of course) "Ma'am, I'm gonna pray for you."



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03 Feb 2012, 12:17 am

hmm the private school i went to is still the place where i feel most at home, (anual prices for 2012, 200$ for the first kid, 150$ for the second and everything beyond that is free, this is common due to state support, this also eliminates some of the class divisions (there are several kinds, ranging from full blown snobbish boarding schools to the freeschools))

also the only people i seem to be able to keep a serious contact with besides collegues and family.
then again that school is viewed as hippie central even in denmark.


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TeaEarlGreyHot
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03 Feb 2012, 12:25 am

AngelRho wrote:
TeaEarlGreyHot wrote:
AngelRho, I knew some churches did that but I really was curious why the no TV part. I don't own one myself, but it's a personal choice. I don't, as of right now, go to any church but was raised (and plan to go back as soon as I figure out logistics) in the LDS church.

I think one should always be careful what organized religion they choose to join, but obviously not everyone understands or sees the warning signs that indicate the religion may be a cult.

I've GOT to stop posting here tonight...

Anyway...

That's funny to me...I don't think I'd have ever pegged you as the LDS type!

Actually, what's also funny to me in a sad sort of way is that many if not most Protestant groups view LDS as a dangerous cult. I got to know a few LDS members in my area, and with one exception they were all really nice people. The part that really made it hard not to laugh was when a good LDS friend of mine commented on how many cults there are in this area. I wanted to ask whether she thought I was a cult member.

8O

The lady who was NOT so nice to me was one of those who just smiled all the time. I mean ALL the time. I can understand the need to appear cheerful all the time, especially if you feel blessed by God and today is the first day of the rest of your life. I do that, too. But just smilin'-cuz-God-luvz-you all the time doesn't do you a bit of good if you aren't genuinely happy. This particular person had a very condescending way of communicating, all behind that eat-$h!+-and-die happy-face, which just amplified the whole I'm-superior-to-you-cuz-I'm-a-Mormon-and-I-think-you're-stupid look. It's very hard to explain, but people instinctively know when you're being disingenuous. It's like, part of you feels guilty for breathing the same air as this person since you aren't worthy, but on the other hand you're relieved because nobody else likes her, either. Once I figured out she didn't have any true friends because of the way she treated other people, I just wanted to pull her aside and tell her (right after drinking a large cup of coffee, of course) "Ma'am, I'm gonna pray for you."


Yep, met a few of 'those' in my day. I used to take great pleasure in making them uncomfortable.

I get that a lot. "Not the church type". I'm not sure what it is about me that makes people think this.

Also, it's good you didn't ask your friend if she thought you were in a cult. She may not, but I've heard some whoppers before. Some Mormons honestly believe anything but the LDS church is a cult. :?


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AngelRho
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03 Feb 2012, 12:29 am

puddingmouse wrote:
^

I meant reverse sarcasm sammich! :lol:

I've found that you can't generalise too much about which type of schools are the most welcoming of 'different' students. Plus kids will be bar stewards everywhere. I've found that the status of a school has little relation to how seriously they deal with bullying.

lol Gotcha. There's SOME relation, though. In public schools, you're not really allowed to get rid of problem kids. You just have to deal with them, and most often there's no dealing. In private schools, sure the kids are really awful. But you can't get rid of them because their parents give a lot of money to the school. Then it's a matter of status. There are ways of taking down a bully in private schools. It just comes down to how much you're willing to sacrifice of yourself to make it happen. The Gandhi approach is HIGHLY effective, but only if you're willing to accept personal suffering in the process. Only here you have to pick your battles--public school kids in general won't be as relenting as private school kids.

I don't agree with all of what people call "bullying." Feeling alienated or shunned by others can be just humiliating as being actively bullied, and there is nothing ANYONE can do about that. You pick your poison--be left alone or be pummeled. I was beyond suicidal at one point, so what I'd do is I'd start physical fights with my worst abusers because I knew that's all it would take to get them in trouble. My reasoning was either someone will come to my rescue, I'll get a few days out of school while in the hospital, or I'll be dead and EVERYONE will be happy. I'd receive verbal threats up to a week or two afterwards, but the truth is nobody really wants to mess with the "crazy" dude.



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03 Feb 2012, 12:31 am

Gay marriage only effects the two people who are in it. Other people not liking it doesn't effect them in any way. I don't understand why some people just don't understand that.

As for homeschooling, well I know quite a few and most do it for religious reasons. They want their kids to be taught creationism only, to have Biblical influences in every subject (some even have the word problems in math using Biblical references), to have only some science, and most of all to "keep the children away from the influences of the enemy in the world, because the ruler of the world is the enemy" (the devil).

I have no problem at all with parents teaching their kids their own religious beliefs. The problem with those kinds of homeschoolers is that they are so rabid about every little detail of every little thing. If the public school teaches evolution and you don't believe in it, so what? Tell your kid "I don't really believe in that, I believe in creationism, here is why and here is the difference...." Learning something for school that conflicts with your religious beliefs doesn't mean that you have to believe it, it means you have to pass a test in it.

There aren't that many homeschoolers around here, because this whole town is very much fundamentalist evangelical protestant. The influence is even in the public schools. It doesn't bother me. They told my daughter that Catholics worship Mary. My daughter came home and told me that her teacher said that and she didn't know how to respond, because being baptised Catholic and going to Catholic school before moving here, she knew better. I told her don't worry about it, he's just an idiot and would try and tell you that you are lying because you want to convert people into your hellbound "cult of Rome" or something. And that's how they are here. They pass out bibles in this school. The teachers don't, but they have a visiting speaker to motivate the kids. It's a preacher. He talks for a minute about doing your work and succeeding in life, then he talks about how God wants you to do that, and even works it up into a mini altar call. No shinola. He visits each classroom. This is done in the spring every year. At all the schools in town. He then gives them each a little Gideon new testament. Theres not much of a need to homeschool around here.

Funny thing is, most of my kids friends are extremely tolerant of others. Which is not how they were taught to be. Very few of them even hold the religious beliefs they were taught, and when they do go to church they do it as a courtesy to their parents. These are teenagers mind you. Most of them are agnostic, but there are quite a few Baptists who do believe that it's true but they just aren't sure what to do about it and don't believe it's true exactly like they were taught. In my generation, I saw a lot of racism and homophobia when we were that age. It was what we were taught and what was expected. A lot of my generation figured out that racism and homophobia are stupid and they don't feel that way, but just as many didn't. These kids seem to have figured it out at an early age, and that's great.

Didn't mean to go off on a tangent. Been cleaning all day and trying to come down from a caffiene buzz, which is what has helped me do all the cleaning all day lol. Two pots of coffee and a pitcher of tea.

Anyway, thats my two cents.


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03 Feb 2012, 12:35 am

AngelRho wrote:
...but the truth is nobody really wants to mess with the "crazy" dude.


That was my defence mechanism too. People were afraid of me because I didn't mind the sight of my own blood, or other peoples.


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03 Feb 2012, 2:37 am

Umm... How about a pony?



Jacoby
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03 Feb 2012, 3:36 am

Vigilans wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
but public school is particularly friendly to children who don't fit the "norm"

Say WHAT??? Since WHEN???


I think he means that the administrations are lax in enforcing behavioral standards compared to a private school (which might be all boys/girls, or require uniforms, etc). Students themselves in public schools are certainly not friendly to those who don't fit the norm. I can vouch for that :lol: I'm sure many here can, unfortunately


It was a mistake and meant isn't. :oops: Maybe I should just roll with the person that said I was being sarcastic.

I do this a lot writing for whatever reason, a lot of times I write a sentence and go back and rephrase it differently and don't change the whole sentence so it changes the whole meaning. 'But ya, public school is not friendly to people who don't conform to the "norm" and having homeschooling is a valuable option for the parents of these kids.



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03 Feb 2012, 10:07 am

Hm. I doubt her parents are especially responsible. And, quite frankly, I think that other students are just as well not having to share a classroom with her. I had to deal with people like her growing up. Selfish. Closed-minded.



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03 Feb 2012, 3:09 pm

:shrug:


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AngelRho
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03 Feb 2012, 3:57 pm

OliveOilMom wrote:
Gay marriage only effects the two people who are in it.

Not true. It extends to infringing on religious rights. If, for example, a church opens facilities up to public use and a gay couple want to get married there, the church is put in a position to compromise its moral ground or face punitive action. If they say "no, we believe that is wrong," then they can get sued for civil rights violation or some such. There is also the potential for pastors to face lawsuits on discrimination grounds for refusing to perform marriage ceremonies. While this is certainly not in our present reality, it is nonetheless disturbing that it could be in the future. And those are only two examples of how some people might be (and perhaps may already be) negatively affected by gay marriage.

OliveOilMom wrote:
If the public school teaches evolution and you don't believe in it, so what? Tell your kid "I don't really believe in that, I believe in creationism, here is why and here is the difference...."

The problem is a little more nuanced than that. If you hold religious beliefs and you go to a public school where you are taught effectively that God did NOT create the universe, then you have the problem that schools are telling students what to believe in terms of faith, not merely what we've gained from naturalism. That's crossing lines between church and state.

I'm highly suspect of just regurgitating answers for the sake of passing a test. Giving an answer suggests you actually believe what you write, and writing down something you don't believe is a compromise of integrity. The solution, I think, is to balance the wording of the questions themselves. Something like, "according to Darwinian evolution theory, ___?" That puts the student in the position of demonstrating knowledge of the theory without requiring the student to pursue an unpleasant topic as fact.

BTW, I'm not entirely opposed to the evolution theory since it is an observable fact. I'm just disturbed by how it can be misused as a sort of replacement for God and as ammunition for making Christian students appear silly or unintelligent. There are ways we Christians can side-step the man-with-a-microphone bullet in the classroom without compromising our faith. But why we should feel intimidated into silence is beyond my comprehension.

My favorite college professors did not necessarily share my faith, but they did leave the door open for respectful disagreement. Never once did I feel uncomfortable in the classroom or even in debates with other students. As postmodernist thought marches on through high schools and universities, the trend of bullying believers seems partly in decline but is long, long away from being over. From what I hear going on in other places, I wonder if I just got lucky in my graduate studies.



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03 Feb 2012, 3:59 pm

Yes, because it always come down to gays being immoral and hating them is part of Christianity so accepting them is infringing on one's religion


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