Adults with Aspergers Seem 'Normal' to Me

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Halligeninseln
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21 Apr 2012, 11:16 am

Just to stir things up:

Prof. Dr. Dose, one of the top autism specialists in Germany claims that AS is being heavily overdiagnosed, and that only people who are OBVIOUSLY incapacitated by their symptoms should receive an AS diagnosis. I assume that would mean that if you can mask your symptoms you don't have AS, by definition. A "normal-seeming" aspie wouldn't be an aspie at all for him. His views are controversial but find a lot of acceptance.



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21 Apr 2012, 11:26 am

melanieeee wrote:
Externalising disorders are external in the sense that it is their behaviors that is the source of their dysfunction but yeah I'm not sure if it is commonly use but feel free to look it up.


I am not studying psychology but this statement is incorrect.
One example given for an externalizing disorder is ADHD. In ADHD it is NOT the behaviour causing the dysfunction.
It is also incorrect to say that an ASD is an externalizing disorder, because it is not. It is also no internalizing disorder, it is neither, because it does not fit in that classification system.


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21 Apr 2012, 11:50 am

Nobody seems normal to me.


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21 Apr 2012, 12:31 pm

Halligeninseln wrote:
Just to stir things up:

Prof. Dr. Dose, one of the top autism specialists in Germany claims that AS is being heavily overdiagnosed, and that only people who are OBVIOUSLY incapacitated by their symptoms should receive an AS diagnosis. I assume that would mean that if you can mask your symptoms you don't have AS, by definition. A "normal-seeming" aspie wouldn't be an aspie at all for him. His views are controversial but find a lot of acceptance.


Yeah but in Germany autism is still believed to be psychodynamic in origin ie if you talk about your relationship with your mother enough, you'll be cured. They do not accept that it has biological causes.



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21 Apr 2012, 12:32 pm

melanieeee wrote:
I have meet a few people with aspergers and I have watched numerous videos of adults with aspergers and they seem don't really seem 'abnormal' to me...


thanx! :lol:



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21 Apr 2012, 12:35 pm

Most adult aspies are good at covering up the disorder. People say that i look normal as well, but sooner or later, the other shoe drops and they notice that I'm not.



charlottez
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21 Apr 2012, 12:50 pm

I haven't read the whole thread, so I apologize if this example or point has been made already.

If you're having difficulty understanding how older Aspies can appear 'normal' and yet be considered disabled, think about a person with the inability to walk. They can get around in a wheelchair or on crutches, but that doesn't mean they are not disabled. The need for those things in deed proves their disability.

Processing time, sensory overload, inability to read others are all part of the disability. Practicing interactions, controlling exposure to environmental elements, and reading up on body language, social cues, and social norms function as the wheelchair or crutches. With many years and experiences those facilitate a normal appearance, but they are still necessary to function normally. The disability is still there. It's just being compensated for.

Hope this helps in creating an understanding.



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21 Apr 2012, 12:58 pm

Halligeninseln wrote:
Just to stir things up:

Prof. Dr. Dose, one of the top autism specialists in Germany claims that AS is being heavily overdiagnosed, and that only people who are OBVIOUSLY incapacitated by their symptoms should receive an AS diagnosis. I assume that would mean that if you can mask your symptoms you don't have AS, by definition. A "normal-seeming" aspie wouldn't be an aspie at all for him. His views are controversial but find a lot of acceptance.


There was once a newbie in my sports group. I was very happy that there was another woman in the group, so I started talking to her in the changing rooms. She had an unusual accent. Then my instructor told me to teach the newbie some basic exercises, and then all of us did the usual training together.

At the end of the training, while the newbie wasn't around, the instructor told us she was deaf, so we should look at her while talking to her. We looked at each other completely stunned, because nobody had realized it.

This person is deaf, however she (and I am pretty sure also many others) can "hide" it perfectly. I don't think her capability of doing so makes her any less deaf...


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21 Apr 2012, 1:42 pm

faerie_queene87 wrote:
At the end of the training, while the newbie wasn't around, the instructor told us she was deaf, so we should look at her while talking to her. We looked at each other completely stunned, because nobody had realized it.

This person is deaf, however she (and I am pretty sure also many others) can "hide" it perfectly. I don't think her capability of doing so makes her any less deaf...


Erm. The reason he told you to look at her when speaking, is so she can lip read you.


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21 Apr 2012, 1:45 pm

TechnoDog wrote:
faerie_queene87 wrote:
At the end of the training, while the newbie wasn't around, the instructor told us she was deaf, so we should look at her while talking to her. We looked at each other completely stunned, because nobody had realized it.

This person is deaf, however she (and I am pretty sure also many others) can "hide" it perfectly. I don't think her capability of doing so makes her any less deaf...


Erm. The reason he told you to look at her when speaking, is so she can lip read you.


We know. That's not the point of this example.
Everyone knows you're supposed to look directly at a deaf person's face. Why? Because then they can read your lips. Yet, none of these people knew she couldn't hear a thing, so they took no notice of this. That's quite impressive on the deaf chick's part, being able to camouflage such a deficiency, 'hiding it' in plain sight.



Last edited by Blueberrypie on 21 Apr 2012, 2:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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21 Apr 2012, 2:00 pm

There's really no such thing as "normal." Nobody's "normal." There are people who have problems besides Asperger's. And even NTs don't always have it easy. They have problems, too. "Neurotypical" only means someone who doesn't have Asperger's, that's all. Since Asperger's isn't obvious, like a wheelchair or a hearing aid, there's no way to "tell" who has it. Plus, most of the time, we're just acting "normal." I read that people with Asperger's are good at acting and mimicing others, so we can fit in. But I am also tired of hearing, "there's nothing wrong with you. You're fine." Just because people can't see our Asperger's, it doesn't mean it isn't there. It's like the tree falling in the woods. If it falls and no one hears it, does it make a sound? Or like debating the existence of Santa Claus. Does he not exist, just because we can't see him? Maybe we should do like the Whos in Whoville did in Horton Hears a Who? and shout out, "WE ARE HERE!! ! WE ARE HERE!! ! WE ARE HERE!! !" :D



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21 Apr 2012, 2:05 pm

Mostly, this is because after years of torment, we learned how to "act" normal in public. Most people would not suspect me of being autistic on first meeting me. However, those who have known me for years, or even just for a few weeks, realize thast I am not REALLY like them. No matter how hard I try to fit in.
Superficially, I have had decades of experience with dealing with NTs, so I pretend to look at their eyes when speaking, etc. However, problems still exist for me in relationships, narrow interests, repetitive movements.
Society & very harsh parenting in my case gives me the ability to play act, but that is all it is mostly. I know other people do not experience bright light(s)/shrill sounds near my level of pain. To choose just one obvious example.

Sincerely,
Matthew



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21 Apr 2012, 2:06 pm

Princess78 wrote:
There's really no such thing as "normal." Nobody's "normal." There are people who have problems besides Asperger's. And even NTs don't always have it easy. They have problems, too. "Neurotypical" only means someone who doesn't have Asperger's, that's all. Since Asperger's isn't obvious, like a wheelchair or a hearing aid, there's no way to "tell" who has it. Plus, most of the time, we're just acting "normal." I read that people with Asperger's are good at acting and mimicing others, so we can fit in. But I am also tired of hearing, "there's nothing wrong with you. You're fine." Just because people can't see our Asperger's, it doesn't mean it isn't there. It's like the tree falling in the woods. If it falls and no one hears it, does it make a sound? Or like debating the existence of Santa Claus. Does he not exist, just because we can't see him? Maybe we should do like the Whos in Whoville did in Horton Hears a Who? and shout out, "WE ARE HERE!! ! WE ARE HERE!! ! WE ARE HERE!! !" :D


People with aspergers are not the only ones with neurological differences, so I find that definition a bit faulty...If I say neurotypical I mean neurotypical not anyone without aspergers syndrome.

Also one might not be able to tell if someone has aspergers or not, but they can certainly tell if you're a bit different...not to mention I don't typically act normal, I don't know how and I am pretty horrid at acting and mimicing others and have never fit in. But many people with aspergers do I guess.


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21 Apr 2012, 2:13 pm

Blueberrypie wrote:
TechnoDog wrote:
faerie_queene87 wrote:
At the end of the training, while the newbie wasn't around, the instructor told us she was deaf, so we should look at her while talking to her. We looked at each other completely stunned, because nobody had realized it.

This person is deaf, however she (and I am pretty sure also many others) can "hide" it perfectly. I don't think her capability of doing so makes her any less deaf...


Erm. The reason he told you to look at her when speaking, is so she can lip read you.


We know. That's not the point of this example.
Everyone knows you're supposed to look directly at a deaf person's face. Why? Because then they can read your lips. Yet, none of these people knew she couldn't hear a thing, so they took no notice of this. That's quite impressive on the deaf chick's part, being able to camouflage such a deficiency, 'hiding it' in plain sight.


If your hiding your deaf, how is the other person supposed to know. That is just silly, that just is causing a huge problem for yourself.


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21 Apr 2012, 2:22 pm

Point of fact:

I am very good at hiding both physical ills (unless I tell someone, no one ever knows I have Crohn's disease unless they catch me at a very bad spot) as well as emotional/psychic pain.
There is a part of your brain that tells you to hide weaknesses. It has been buried deep by society, but nonetheless. There was a time Sick=eaten by predator.

It is not unusual for Aspies to cover-up their problems. I do it, in regards to my CD & being on the spectrum.

Because being different=bullied. Very similar to above, just not as permanent!!

All you are seeing is people who have learned to pretend/playact being like you. If you spent 6 months with any adult person with Asperger's you would realize they were not what they usually pretended at..

Something can exist, even if you do not see it (most of the Universe, in fact! LOL)!

Matthew



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21 Apr 2012, 2:26 pm

TechnoDog wrote:
If your hiding your deaf, how is the other person supposed to know. That is just silly, that just is causing a huge problem for yourself.


The answer is self-evident and fairly obvious:
Humiliation. Social-anathema. Discrimination. Treated with pity. The list goes on, but people with deficiences have realized that humans are superficial, judgemental and prone to disregard/avoid others outside of the norm. Why? Because it's a lot easier to live life with friends and loved ones that isn't pinned down by debilitating situations and or syndromes.

The weak are left behind as the flock moves on.

I am exaggerating to make a point. Still, the chick told the instructor of her impariment, whom relayed it to the other participants in the class. No big deal.

[Edited - Grammar]



Last edited by Blueberrypie on 21 Apr 2012, 2:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.