any reasons why marijuana should still be illegal?



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Joker
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03 Jul 2012, 8:51 pm

Seriously how can we make something that grows. From the earth illgeal when it comes from. THE EARTH?



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03 Jul 2012, 10:30 pm

shrox wrote:
LeeRude wrote:
it might get popular and spread out to all levels of society if we legalize it


That would be a good thing, especially if it displaced alcohol use.
I was going to say...how is that a bad thing?


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03 Jul 2012, 10:44 pm

Well if we legalized pot we would then have to legalize more dangerous drugs, like tobacco or alcohol. The slope is too slippery, we can't risk it.


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03 Jul 2012, 10:45 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
Well if we legalized pot we would then have to legalize more dangerous drugs, like tobacco or alcohol. The slope is too slippery, we can't risk it.
:lmao: :lmao:


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03 Jul 2012, 10:45 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
Well if we legalized pot we would then have to legalize more dangerous drugs, like tobacco or alcohol. The slope is too slippery, we can't risk it.


:lol:



aghogday
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03 Jul 2012, 11:54 pm

Found this information below, while looking up information on excise taxes on cigarettes that support health insurance for the needy.

There is 50% public approval in 2011 measured by the gallup organization for the legalization, up about 10 percent in a little over the last decade, and the CDC reporting that more teens are smoking Marijuana than cigarettes for the first time in history, 23% as opposed to 18%.

The article below suggests it could be Obama's secret election weapon, but at this point that is probably a "pipe" dream. Eventually though, if cigarettes continue to go up in price, law enforcement is not going to be able to keep up with offenders. It's no wonder teens are smoking marijuana more, it is likely cheaper than cigarettes, in some cases, at least in New York City, where federal, state, and local excise taxes equal $6.85 a pack.

It is a huge source of potential government revenue, and jobs. And a potential reality, that if teens are any indication, it is the popular choice of the future.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jun/13/barack-obama-marijuana-legalisation-election

http://news.yahoo.com/cdc-more-us-teens-smoke-marijuana-cigarettes-220759702.html

A potential plan (B) to fund health care reform, if enough states opt out on medicaid expansion:
:)

Image

Extremely small chance of this happening in the next 4 years, and zero chance of it happening with Romney in office. But, since 50% of the country polled say they are for the legalization, and more teens are smoking marijuana than cigarettes, the handwriting is on the wall. The last three presidents have admitted in indulging in drugs ranging from marijuana to cocaine, but they all have marijuana in common in their young adulthood lifestyle.

There may eventually come a day and a time when a person can purchase a pack of government controlled "marijuana cigarettes" for $20 a pack, with close to 60% of the fee supporting health care, and other government programs for overall social welfare.

Decriminalization though, is already a steadily growing phenomenon, with Mayor Rahm Emmanuel, recently supporting decriminalization of marijuana possession in Chicago. A huge amount of money will be generated in the City, with fines ranging from $250 to $300 for less than 15 grams possession as compared to the over 18,000 arrests made in one year in that city for possession of less than 10 grams of marijuana, involving over 20,000 police man hours incarceration, as well as criminal records for individuals, that make it hard for them in almost every avenue of life.

http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2012/06/chicago_decriminalizes_marijuana_with_overwhelming.php



LeeRude
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04 Jul 2012, 11:13 am

I’m not willing to cut out beer... I sometimes like to have a nice cold one with my spliff - but I agree with you that alcohol is more dangerous and harmful to individual and society than any other substance.
I realize that my first avatar looks drunk - he is not - just dancing


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Last edited by LeeRude on 04 Jul 2012, 7:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

LeeRude
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04 Jul 2012, 11:24 am

[quote="Delphiki"][quote="shrox"][quote="LeeRude"]it might get popular and spread out to all levels of society if we legalize it[/quote]

That would be a good thing, especially if it displaced alcohol use.[/quote]I was going to say...how is that a bad thing?[/quote]

sorry, it was sarcasm to point out it is allready popular and widely spread in all layers of society. Criminalizing the users has no effect on this so called problem. It is very expensive and locate lawinforcement resourses away from real crimes.


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Last edited by LeeRude on 04 Jul 2012, 6:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ascagne
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01 Aug 2012, 7:23 pm

Quote:
Seriously how can we make something that grows. From the earth illgeal when it comes from. THE EARTH?


Strange natural argument, given the number of things that grow that are lethal, poison, etc. Hum... ?

Frankly, I don't get much those who are for legalization. Even though this is not the thing that bothers me the most - that would be the trivialization of drugs. It maddens me. Maybe for many people marijuana once in a while does no harm or not much, but I've a relative who tried once in a depression, and it has given him schizophrenia and it was devastating (I feel very sorry for him) for him and for his family... This trivialization of all kinds of drugs is a problem, much more maybe than the debates about legalization, even though that can contribute to it. My mother is a specialist in addictology, and she is not at all for legalization. By the way, specialists will tell you, as it is the case in all sciences and all research, not to believe for the word of God what the last little reportage from a TV news told you about the fact that "marijuana is not as problematic as we thought", or what the "latest discoveries" have found out (in most cases, it takes some time to the scientific community to discuss reevaluations like it).

Obama who says "I've taken marijuana" doesn't seem a very clever thing at all to say, in my opinion. In France, many people on the left side are more or less for legalization, which is by the way in accordance with their diverse philosophies, which I don't share (I'm a centrist). It's not a good signal. It's already hard to try to limit the negative effects of cigarettes and alcohol (arf, that one is so problematic, most notably because of trivialization too, and the fact some people - those who over consummate, so many teenagers and young, and some of those who sell it - are, hum, not very clever on this matter), so...
Not trivializing drugs, and educate, always educate, is what is good imho.
After that, I don't know. Maybe a world where marijuana is legalized, but where there is no longer trivialization about it (but it's kind of impossible) is preferable to a world where it's prohibited but where it's considered as not dangerous at all (while it can be)...



Last edited by Ascagne on 01 Aug 2012, 7:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

shrox
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01 Aug 2012, 7:38 pm

Ascagne wrote:
...but I've a relative who tried once in a depression, and it has given him schizophrenia and it was devastating (I feel very sorry for him) for him and for his family...


I'm sorry, but I have to call you on that. It is not true.



Ascagne
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01 Aug 2012, 7:46 pm

Yes, once is not appropriate. I rather mean that it didn't take long for him to fall (so not as if he had consumed it for years). By the way, I'm not saying it was only marijuana or that he would have taken it at an "appropriate dose". But what I can tell is that for people who are in bad times, it is sadly not surprising that it would lead to other drugs and lethal "cocktails" (and I don't think I'm wrong when I think that dealers don't give the same kind of products a legalized system would offer, no ?).

Understand : my concern is for the people that will not take this as the typical "I-want-to-try-it" will do. It's for the others. In the context of the legalization, it has some importance, even it is not at all the most solid argument, I know. But there are always risks, and lessening the barriers that separate from the drugs is not a very good idea - even though in this case, the difference (legalized or not) would surely have not had an impact. But as I said, the primary problem is the trivialization of drugs ; notwithstanding, the legalization itself has necessarily an impact on the question of the trivialization. Our experience with tobacco and alcohol are already problematic ; that's what we've to think about when we tackle the subject. After that, there is the question of "Where do we stop ?" because there are philosophical and societal questions behind this topic, which means there are necessarily biases or viewpoints in link with particular visions of the world / of life / of society to take into consideration.



Last edited by Ascagne on 01 Aug 2012, 7:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

shrox
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01 Aug 2012, 7:53 pm

Ascagne wrote:
Yes, once is not appropriate. I rather mean that it didn't take long for him to fall (so not as if he had consumed it for years). By the way, I'm not saying it was only marijuana or that he would have taken it at an "appropriate dose". But what I can tell is that for people who are in bad times, it is sadly not surprising that it would lead to other drugs and lethal "cocktails" (and I don't think I'm wrong when I think that dealers don't give the same kind of products a legalized system would offer, no ?)...


Well, then don't state something that is not true. I am a medical marihuana patient for Parkinson's, Dystonia, and Fibromyalga. Spreading false information about a very beneficial plant is just wrong. How do you know it wasn't lead from older gasoline or dioxin from a neighbor's pest control efforts that caused or contributed to his condition?



Ascagne
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01 Aug 2012, 7:57 pm

Shrox, I didn't speak of medical use of marijuana for the very simple reason that it is a very different question, which is not a problem (not at a general level anyway) :wink: . But understand that it feels a little awkward to read your message after what I wrote about my cousin... :? But I'm sure you hadn't at all in mind that when you wrote it :wink: .
Let's keep in mind the differences between the different kind of uses.



shrox
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01 Aug 2012, 8:18 pm

Ascagne wrote:
Shrox, I didn't speak of medical use of marijuana for the very simple reason that it is a very different question, which is not a problem (not at a general level anyway) :wink: . But understand that it feels a little awkward to read your message after what I wrote about my cousin... :? But I'm sure you hadn't at all in mind that when you wrote it :wink: .
Let's keep in mind the differences between the different kind of uses.


Did you know they had to add a bitter taste to Sterno to keep people from drinking it? People are odd in many ways...I've only used it to heat a can of beans and keep warm during a winter power outage.



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01 Aug 2012, 10:06 pm

Ascagne wrote:
Shrox, I didn't speak of medical use of marijuana for the very simple reason that it is a very different question, which is not a problem (not at a general level anyway) :wink: . But understand that it feels a little awkward to read your message after what I wrote about my cousin... :? But I'm sure you hadn't at all in mind that when you wrote it :wink: .
Let's keep in mind the differences between the different kind of uses.
So even though alcohol is worse for someone than marijuana we should keep it illegal?


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