Difference between male and female autism?

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Rebel_Nowe
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03 May 2012, 2:44 pm

VisInsita wrote:
So does that mean I have a male brain, albeit me being a female, since I’d say my interests are very similar to my male autism counterparts? Oh man, a female inserted with an extreme male brain (by Simon Baron-Cohen)…!

I personally don’t see how my “facts” about physics, tornadoes :oops: , music or so on differ from somebody else’s facts about horses, cooking or so on… The only difference is the cultural prestige automatically given to an area of life associated with males.

I think “the truth about the male and female brain” is...


just a cheap title to sell books.


As a guy who has profound special interests in psychology (and its related fields) and the arts and who gets along better with women, I wouldn't stress about it. =P It's more than a marketing tool, but not much more than a statistical analysis.



qwan
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03 May 2012, 2:50 pm

Rebel_Nowe wrote:
VisInsita wrote:
So does that mean I have a male brain, albeit me being a female, since I’d say my interests are very similar to my male autism counterparts? Oh man, a female inserted with an extreme male brain (by Simon Baron-Cohen)…!

I personally don’t see how my “facts” about physics, tornadoes :oops: , music or so on differ from somebody else’s facts about horses, cooking or so on… The only difference is the cultural prestige automatically given to an area of life associated with males.

I think “the truth about the male and female brain” is...


just a cheap title to sell books.


As a guy who has profound special interests in psychology (and its related fields) and the arts and who gets along better with women, I wouldn't stress about it. =P It's more than a marketing tool, but not much more than a statistical analysis.


Interests never made one more male than female. But I suppose what the book is aiming to show are general differences in males and females with autism that might be missed when one assumes it's 'normal for girls to like horses this much' but abnormal for her to like cars that much, and such a stupid generalisation would impact on her diagnosis. Instead this would be showing some commonly found differences in the same sort of traits, not the improved and more accurate criteria for all females.

But I'm assuming you knew that and were just making a joke.

When something aims to tackle possible gender stereotypes, it can easily project some more of its own.



League_Girl
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03 May 2012, 3:01 pm

I read that girls tend to get obsessed with topics than with objects and they tend to focus more on interests than with objects, they tend to be more social and have friends, they do pretend play like playing with dolls or toys using their imagination like normal kids do. I fit all this in my childhood. I also did role playing games with my Barbie dolls about real life and things that would go on in my life and things I would witness. My mother said it was my way of figuring things out and the first thing I would do first is act it out with my dolls before doing it for real so she always had to spy on me because I didn't tell her what things went on in my life so I would express them through my dolls so she had to spy on me and listen to me play and fortunately I talked out loud too as I would play.

I also like to be clean and I wear clothes I am comfortable with, I don't really care for fashion though I did go through a phase where I wanted to dress like an adult, now I prefer to wear that I am comfortable with than playing dress up. I also don't wear make up or bother doing my hair. I have always had difficulty with it in the past so now all I do it brush it, put it in a pony tail if it's long or put in a barrette to keep the bangs off my forehead when they get too long as well. I also hate getting my hair brushed due to I get so many knots in my hair and even conditioner doesn't seem to work. So I keep it cut short. That way brushing my hair isn't a problem. Plus I don't have patience for long hair. Plus I hate having thick hair so I also have it cut short for that reason too.

But yet I did play with make up as a child and my mother always hated it. Then I outgrew that pretend play.

I also read that female aspies tend to talk about their feelings, I have done that too even though my husband says I don't express myself well. I didn't even realize I had difficulty recognizing them until my shrink pointed it out and the feelings I had been expressing were thoughts. I dunno if I meet this female aspie trait.



OddDuckNash99
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03 May 2012, 3:12 pm

I've read the same female "differences" that others have posted. I mostly have heard Tony Atwood's differences. I personally don't fit any of the "female" criteria. I definitely don't have a female brain. I took that one gender test online. I think it was Baron-Cohen's research. Don't remember. My "brain gender" was exactly neutral, neither female nor male. I really find that accurate. I am sort of gender androgynous. I don't connect with normal females, but I don't consider myself like normal males, either. I feel comfortable as a female, but I have more male interests.


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Sweetleaf
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03 May 2012, 3:27 pm

Rebel_Nowe wrote:
There definitely is also a social aspect to it. At least down here in the south, a girl who is quiet and withdrawn will be assumed to be demure and sweet, where a boy will be assumed weak (or, by god the worst, in need of toughening up...) or weird by both their peers and adults.


Intresting...I guess things can vary. But yeah I was a quiet, withdrawn girl.....and I still got just as much crap from guys and girls, it was mostly more verbal stuff but I remember a few more physical incidents and there were even teachers in on some of it. From what I seem to have observed my experiance isen't exactly the most normal for a girl.....but I don't know.


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Rebel_Nowe
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03 May 2012, 4:05 pm

qwan wrote:
Interests never made one more male than female. But I suppose what the book is aiming to show are general differences in males and females with autism that might be missed when one assumes it's 'normal for girls to like horses this much' but abnormal for her to like cars that much, and such a stupid generalisation would impact on her diagnosis. Instead this would be showing some commonly found differences in the same sort of traits, not the improved and more accurate criteria for all females.

But I'm assuming you knew that and were just making a joke.

When something aims to tackle possible gender stereotypes, it can easily project some more of its own.

Yeah, I always assumed that it had something to do with my earliest development. I was raised in a single parent household by my mother until I was 5 or so. The other people who primarily cared for me during that time were my grandmother and my two aunts. I was also very close to my two cousins, one of whom was a girl.

Sweetleaf wrote:
Intresting...I guess things can vary. But yeah I was a quiet, withdrawn girl.....and I still got just as much crap from guys and girls, it was mostly more verbal stuff but I remember a few more physical incidents and there were even teachers in on some of it. From what I seem to have observed my experiance isen't exactly the most normal for a girl.....but I don't know.

Yeah, it's weird. Some areas of southern culture have a complex about not being sexist the same way they do about not being racist. It's a double edged sword that causes a lot of erratic parenting. =/



EstherJ
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03 May 2012, 4:06 pm

Oh wow. The empathizer/systemizer.
I am female, and on the test (in the other post on here) for empathizing/systemizing, I got a fantastic empathizing score of 8. I believe the highest possible is 100?

I don't think the lines can be clearly drawn here...there are men who are empathizers and women who are systematizers, like myself.
I just don't fit the stereotyped model for the way my culture thinks girls should talk/dress/act/work/be. Don't get it wrong - I'm very secure in the fact that I'm female and NOT male, but I don't fit the stereotype. I FEEL more neutral.



Rebel_Nowe
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03 May 2012, 4:11 pm

EstherJ wrote:
I FEEL more neutral.

I'm actually curious how many of us agree with this as much as I do.



Orr
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03 May 2012, 5:15 pm

I recall somebody posting a chart detailing female AS traits, that I associated with. I am male.

Article relevant to thread:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3113855/


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03 May 2012, 5:52 pm

Nothing other than the differences between males and females.

Meaning, males might be more aggressive during "meltdowns", and females might be more social (superficially). Exceptions to it all though.



houla
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03 May 2012, 6:21 pm

Quote:
So I've read that many females fail to get diagnosed due to the criteria leaning towards the more male symptoms and that females display symptoms of autism/aspergers differently.


I'm female and I was diagnosed very young and there's never been any doubt that I'm autistic 8O

I know I'm a little/loy clueless but I don't understand how my symptoms would display differently if I was male? Would my sensory issues be different? Would my speech delay have been different? Would my tendency to take everything literally be different? Would my lack of interest in people by different? Would my cluelessness around interacting be different? Would my overwhelming need to be completely absorbed and undisturbed when I'm focused on something be different? And the list goes on...What does my gender have to do with my autism?

I guess I need to read some of these books.

For the record. My empathy quotient was 10 and my systematizing was 33.


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edgewaters
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03 May 2012, 7:02 pm

EstherJ wrote:
I just don't fit the stereotyped model for the way my culture thinks girls should talk/dress/act/work/be. Don't get it wrong - I'm very secure in the fact that I'm female and NOT male, but I don't fit the stereotype. I FEEL more neutral.


Male here but I get exactly the same feeling. I don't care if I don't fit the stereotype, I don't fight against it but I don't try to conform to it either. It seems childish to do either of those things. I also find that I'm repelled by very exaggerated expressions of masculinity/femininity.



SpiritBlooms
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03 May 2012, 7:10 pm

There's a list of female Asperger traits here:

help4aspergers.com

It appears the second link on that page is a list of differences.



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03 May 2012, 7:48 pm

OddDuckNash99 wrote:
I've read the same female "differences" that others have posted. I mostly have heard Tony Atwood's differences. I personally don't fit any of the "female" criteria. I definitely don't have a female brain. I took that one gender test online. I think it was Baron-Cohen's research. Don't remember. My "brain gender" was exactly neutral, neither female nor male. I really find that accurate. I am sort of gender androgynous. I don't connect with normal females, but I don't consider myself like normal males, either. I feel comfortable as a female, but I have more male interests.


Not specifically a direct response to you, but a more general comment your post reminded me of:

I don't get why some interests are "male" and some are "female", or maybe those should be masculine and feminine. It seems downright bizarre to me the way so many men online seem to think they have a claim of ownership over "video gaming" for example.

It's ridiculous, people should be able to do what they want without having their interests or hobbies judged as being intended for a different gender.



edgewaters
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03 May 2012, 8:20 pm

Verdandi wrote:
I don't get why some interests are "male" and some are "female", or maybe those should be masculine and feminine. It seems downright bizarre to me the way so many men online seem to think they have a claim of ownership over "video gaming" for example.

It's ridiculous, people should be able to do what they want without having their interests or hobbies judged as being intended for a different gender.


Totally agree. If it has to be forced on people, and if almost everyone has to work at overcoming their nature to conform to it, then there's nothing in the least bit natural about it. It's either just made up nonsense, or some particular group with these characteristics shoving them down everyone else's throat. Either way, total rubbish.

It really annoys the living hell out of me. Why would anyone in their right mind want the genders to have different interests? Are they trying to make it harder for people to find people they like?



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03 May 2012, 10:59 pm

Verdandi wrote:
It seems downright bizarre to me the way so many men online seem to think they have a claim of ownership over "video gaming" for example.



Oh all right, you can have video games. But the grill is off limits.