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MrXxx
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18 Dec 2012, 6:39 am

namaste wrote:
MrXxx wrote:

Doesn't pass the test. Sorry.

What family friends say his mother said, is not confirmation. It's hearsay, and doesn't mean he was actually diagnosed with anything.

Not a confirmed report.

While she probably did tell them that, she may only have believed he had it.

I want confirmation of an actual diagnosis.


Did you ask for confirmation when it was said that Einstein, Bill Gates are diagnosed with aspergers???


I sure did.


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MrXxx
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18 Dec 2012, 6:52 am

bLueTaEl0nENiGMA wrote:
MrXxx wrote:
namaste wrote:
MrXxx wrote:
Can someone please point me to a reliable source that CONFIRMS that he had AS? I've not seen a single one thus far.

If we're going to point fingers at the media for irresponsible reporting, shouldn't we be as responsible as we expect them to be?

I'm really getting tired of seeing flat statements made that he had AS, when it may not be true at all.

This video does mention a family friend mentioning that he was home schooled due to aspergers

60 Minutes: Newtown
check out previous threads for the video


Doesn't pass the test. Sorry.

What family friends say his mother said, is not confirmation. It's hearsay, and doesn't mean he was actually diagnosed with anything.

Not a confirmed report.

While she probably did tell them that, she may only have believed he had it.

I want confirmation of an actual diagnosis.


there had been an interview with four of his mother's friends, and they basically were saying
to the interviewer what they had heard her say and what had transpired in her life that they
were aware of. further along in the coverage there was a watering hole she liked to frequent,
and one of the bartenders was talked to. if she was under the impression her son's behavior is
due to A.S. and that the diagnosis she was familiar with was accurate, then any doubts about it
would have been happening only recently and she did not really comprehend what could happen.


This is still not "confirmation."

Believing a person has AS is not the same as them actually having it.

Please don't misunderstand my posts as being just more of "those" that deny anyone who doesn't have a diagnosis has AS. I'm not one of "those."

I was self diagnosed for a long time. I KNEW I had AS. I don't condemn self diagnosis, because initial self diagnosis can lead to real diagnoses. Also, diagnosis isn't necessary for everyone. If one doesn't need services, and isn't interested in validation, there's no need for a diagnosis.

This situation however, is VASTLY different. If Joe Shmoe (or his family) says he has Asperger Syndrome, isn't anyone of note, hasn't done anything to put himself in the public eye, there's no harm in it.

In this case though, Adam Lanza is receiving world wide attention for one of the most extremely heinous crimes in recent history. In this case, I'm not about to accept that he really had Asperger's based only on the fact that his family believes he had it. I do want more.

I think it's only reasonable under these circumstances. I'm not going to accept rumors. :shrug:


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billybud21
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18 Dec 2012, 9:32 am

Having AS does not predispose a person to sociopathic behavior. The only documentation of the Lanza's AS that has been presented was in his parents' divorce papers -- no official diagnosis presented into the legal record, just a statement of seeming fact that is not backed up by a diagnosis, but only that what his parents said.

Small minds always look for an easy explanation to the unexplainable. People in the general population -- and within the aspie community unfortunately -- do not understand Asperger's. However, what they do understand is awkward behavior, shyness, lack of "empathy," intelligence and being outside of the "norm." He carried a briefcase, oh my. One word, "Asperger's" presents an easy explanation; it sounds technical and plausible; it fills the mouths of the uniformed and pundit alike; it fills blogs with more characters and take up a few desperate minutes of that 24 hour news cycle.

If Lanza was in fact officially diagnosed with Asperger’s or some other Spectrum Disorder, so be it. Nevertheless, people with Asperger's have nothing to hide no to be ashamed of! Be proud of what makes you – you! Be an ambassador for Asperger’s to the uniformed and ignorant and most importantly, speak for those who have Asperger’s who may not be able to speak for themselves.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/harold-s- ... 16848.html



Dillogic
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18 Dec 2012, 12:41 pm

Pretty much confirmed (the first one especially, who was a director of school security and had a meeting with Adam's mother):

Quote:
Richard Novia said Lanza had Asperger's syndrome, based on documents as well as conversations with Lanza's mother, who was killed shortly before the Sandy Hook massacre.

Russ Hanoman, a friend of Lanza's mother, previously told CNN that Lanza had Asperger's syndrome and that he was "very withdrawn emotionally."



compiledkernel
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18 Dec 2012, 1:27 pm

No , Dill, that isnt a doctors response, nor a medical professional's opinion of the situation.

Its just going to continue to muddy the water over this situation until a doctor comes forward and says, yes, this was a valid diagnosis, and he was under my care.

These statements do nothing but bring negavitity to an already overly negative situation.

-- To Billybud's post,

Yes I concur with your assessment, narrow minded people with a lack of understanding things are quick and ready to blame things they do not or are able to understand. The media being too quick to assess this situation and use AS , and Autism for that matter, to drive their stories continues to enflame the situation drastically.

It causes all of us ( and those who support us ) to go into a defensive posture to try to deflect what the media is portraying.


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18 Dec 2012, 1:45 pm

compiledkernel wrote:
There is a distinct difference between being AS and being a Sociopath (or a psychopath). The indignant way that some people are associating AS and Autism with the possibility of being able to achieve such an heinous act is asinine. And uneducated.

Its more likely that the perpetrator in this case was probably a McDonald triad sufferer (at least in part). Following the path of the McDonald Triad -- being a Firebug, Animal Killer/Torturer, and Bet Wetter -- when they occur together, and with a high frequency in adolencency, are typical signs of a Sociopath.

Socoipathic behaviour does not equate to Autisitc behaviour, nor are they in anyway related to each other. And to suggest this to be the case is wrong on so many levels. A sociopath shows no remorse for their actions, nor believes their actions can be held accountable to themselves. Of which I firmly believe this Adam Lanza to have been a Sociopath.

Ive had it up to my head with hearing people tell me that a Lack of Empathy because of how Im wired means that I have the ability to harm others. Its getting really really REALLY old and at a tremendously high rate of speed.


Well if he had no remourse and thought he was not accountable for his actions why did he kill himself as well? At least I think that is what happened right I have been more or less avoiding too much exposure so I admit I might be fuzzy on the details. But yeah I have not heard any actual confirmation of any sociopathic behavior before the incident so I have my doubts about that as well.


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18 Dec 2012, 2:00 pm

compiledkernel wrote:
No , Dill, that isnt a doctors response, nor a medical professional's opinion of the situation.


One can conclude that his mother took medical documents to the individual responsible for school security ("documents"), just to let him know of the behavior he may exhibit (he seemed to suffer from the usual "shutdowns" of an ASD).

The full text on it:
Quote:
A former director of security for Newtown Public Schools shed new light Monday night about the gunman, Adam Lanza.

Richard Novia said Lanza had Asperger’s syndrome, based on documents as well as conversations with Lanza’s mother, who was killed shortly before the Sandy Hook massacre.

Novia said as part of his job, which he left in 2008, he would be informed of students who might pose problems to themselves or others for whatever reason.

He also said he received “intake information” — which he said “is common for any students troubled or impaired or with disabilities.” The idea was to keep track of and help students who may need it.

However, Novia said he never thought Lanza was a threat and certainly never thought he was capable of such violence.


(Not that Asperger's is responsible for this; it's just a fact to go along with it.)



asdmommie
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18 Dec 2012, 2:31 pm

Well it is confirmed that one of the victims had special needs.

Quote:
Dylan’s parents, Ian Thomas, who is British, and Nicole Marie (Moretti), both 42, had lived in England for 18 years before moving to a house on the same street as Nancy Lanza, the gunman's mother and first victim, in January, The Telegraph (U.K.) reported. They said they chose Newtown specifically for the tight-knit community and the Sandy Hook school.
“We do not and shall never regret this choice,” they said. “Our boys have flourished here and our family’s happiness has been limitless.”
The family also praised other staffers and teachers who died at Sandy Hook.
"We cannot speak highly enough of Dawn Hochsprung and Mary Sherlach, exceptional women who knew both our children and who specifically helped us navigate Dylan's special education needs," Dylan's family added. "Dylan's teacher, Vicki Soto, was warm and funny and Dylan loved her dearly."


Given several of the educators were special education, this confirms it. I am so saddened by this even more.

Interesting how the media puts out there about the shooter's profile having possibly Aspergers. Those poor babies. I am sick just finding this out.



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18 Dec 2012, 8:24 pm

Besides everyone here, the only other people I would tell about my Asperger's would be my two closest friends. No one else needs to know.



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18 Dec 2012, 8:58 pm

Sanjay Gupta from CNN says there is no link between violence and aspegers syndrome and in the few cases of aspergian violence they were spontanious not planned.CT state police are sure this was planned because of rifle range records


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19 Dec 2012, 2:54 am

namaste wrote:
So its all over the news that Adam Lanza suffered from Asperger Syndrom

I guess the whole outlook of people against Asperger Syndrome will change now
they will look at us with rage, hatred and despise

What with i told my managers and supervisors that i suffer from aspergers.....i am sure they
will look down at me now and probably ask me to leave and sit at home


My heart goes out to you. Through a lot of struggle, I've figured out how to blend in with neurotypicals- but I haven't forgotten what it was like to be teased and harassed for your "disability." I will never forget.

My heart also goes out to the families of the victims. It's hard to imagine being in a worse place than at the crossroads of grief and politics. But that is where they are now. I'm an atheist, but I will be praying for them nonetheless, in my own way.



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19 Dec 2012, 5:36 am

Headbanger999999 wrote:

My heart goes out to you. Through a lot of struggle, I've figured out how to blend in with neurotypicals- but I haven't forgotten what it was like to be teased and harassed for your "disability." I will never forget.

.

the rage, hatred comes out someday or other....
for how long a person would tolerate being ostracised, isolated, condemned by society someday
they will vent their frustration definitely.
Either in form of drunk driving,
drugs, excessive drinking, or just getting voilent


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compiledkernel
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19 Dec 2012, 12:52 pm

namaste wrote:
Headbanger999999 wrote:

My heart goes out to you. Through a lot of struggle, I've figured out how to blend in with neurotypicals- but I haven't forgotten what it was like to be teased and harassed for your "disability." I will never forget.

.

the rage, hatred comes out someday or other....
for how long a person would tolerate being ostracised, isolated, condemned by society someday
they will vent their frustration definitely.
Either in form of drunk driving,
drugs, excessive drinking, or just getting voilent


Long term social ostracism will affect even NTs in adverse ways when made over long periods of time. The affects of this kind of behaviour, affects any person in a negative manner regardless of their circumstance. Ted Kaczinski, Noah Rondeau, and Robert Harrill might be examples of this condition.


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19 Dec 2012, 7:30 pm

From link posted in the OP:

Quote:
that the 20 year old man suffered from Asperger Syndrome, a high-functioning form of autism (two conditions which are being merged in the upcoming update of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM-5) manual of mental disorders), which has been traditionally associated with social communication difficulties, including flat affect, and one which in some clinical studies has been shown to have a causal link to violence.


What link to violence?



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19 Dec 2012, 9:52 pm

December 18, 2012, 12:19 pm65 Comments
Our Sons Are Not Future Killers
By EMILY WILLINGHAM

The Asperger’s stereotype before the shootings in Newtown, Conn., was relatively harmless if inaccurate – that of a quirky, brilliant male unable to read subtle social cues or navigate the world of non-autistic people. Think Sheldon on “The Big Bang Theory” or Abed on “Community.”

The reality, like any reality disconnected from network television, is quite different. People with Asperger’s have a highly variable set of skills and capacities, most of them unrelated to brilliance or prepossessing eccentricities. Average intelligence, very real struggles with social navigation, and joblessness are far more prevalent among those with Asperger’s than cute personality quirks like wearing unmatched socks or exhibiting an endless fascination with trains.

But when it comes to ideas about the label my 11-year-old son carries, I’ll take misconceptions about quirkiness and genius over an inaccurate association with mass murder any day. Thanks to the way too many in the media have embraced the Asperger’s label as offering some kind of explanation for the inexplicable, the specter of “Asperger’s boy as future killer” now shadows both those with Asperger’s and their worried families. (Asperger’s syndrome is diagnosed four times more often in boys than in girls.) Adding to that growing darkness is a wildly viral post in which a mother describes her 13-year-old son as violent and emotionally manipulative (not a typical autism trait) and mentions that one diagnosis clinicians have considered for him is autism. She then identifies herself in the post — which uses her real name and a picture of her boy — with the mothers of other mass murderers in our country’s recent history.

Here’s the thing about mass murderers: They are vanishingly rare in the general population. Even when you divvy up the world neurobiologically under labels like schizophrenia, bipolar disorder and antisocial personality disorders, mass murderers are still extremely rare in each one. Indeed, rather than falling into categories of diagnoses, most mass murderers fall into categories of mental derailments: the psychopath, the delusionally insane and the suicidally depressed.

As Priscilla Gilman wrote in the Opinion section, autism shouldn’t be blamed for Newtown. Yet in spite of zero evidence suggesting that planned violence is symptomatic of autism or Asperger’s (which is an autism spectrum disorder), many news stories covering the Connecticut tragedy have nevertheless made the stretch. Indeed, they reached, grabbing for talking heads who referred to those with Asperger’s as lacking emotional empathy (they do not), as missing something in their brains that’s key to being human, as “defective.” (The Times’s Public Editor, Margaret Sullivan, has said she plans to explore the paper’s coverage of Adam Lanza’s possible Asperger’s or autism disorders.)

The result? I know of worried parents who have called local autism organizations, eyeing their sons with Asperger’s or autistic disorders, wondering if they are looking at future killers. Many more of us are worried that others are wondering the same thing about their sons. That last is a legitimate concern. In the comments to many articles on the shootings, you’ll find otherwise sensible-sounding people writing, for example, that they know 13-year-olds with Asperger’s and anger issues who could themselves become Adam Lanzas when they grow up.

“Anger issues” aren’t the same as “inclined to mass murder.” Autistic people are people, just like everyone else. Personalities accompany their neurobiology. Some express themselves with aggression, just like some non-autistic people do. But autistic people “almost never” use weapons or planned violence when being aggressive, and their aggression rarely involves anyone outside of their immediate circle, Catherine Lord, director of the Center for Autism and the Developing Brain at New York Presbyterian Hospital, told The Lede blog in The Times as the paper addressed the growing concern that people with autism might be stigmatized by media coverage of the Newtown shootings. In fact, the features of the Connecticut case are more common in non-autistic populations than among autistics.

In spite of these correctives, autistic people and their families are now forced to do two things: mourn the horror in Connecticut and defend autistics against these misrepresentations. The parenting talk on this blog and elsewhere has been about how to engage with children about unspeakable tragedy. I talked to my oldest, autistic son about Connecticut the day it happened and chronicled his empathetic response of deep sadness at the loss and a desire to shield his first-grade brother from it. What my oldest son does not yet know is that I’m shielding him, too. He’s unaware of these stories linking Asperger’s and mass murder. It’s a conversation I’m not quite sure how to have with him, and it’s one we shouldn’t have to have.

According to his parents’ divorce mediator, the shooter in the Newtown massacre received a diagnosis of Asperger’s. That’s as close as anyone has gotten to a real confirmation of that label. It’s slightly better than the “high-school student familiar with Asperger’s” sources and considerably better than speculation based on his loner status, shyness or nervousness. These days, whenever acquaintances describe a person in those terms, the go-to label then becomes Asperger’s or autism. But not all autistic people are loners, and not all loners are autistic. Loners come from all sorts of neurobiological backgrounds. Like most people, loners also rarely become killers.

Asperger’s has carried some heavy baggage in its time. The uninformed see it as a “diagnosis du jour,” as a lame label for children who are just weird, or as a shorthand for harmless, quirky genius. The reality for those with the syndrome is none of the above. But the reality is also not the sensationalist characterization of a cold, unempathetic loner capable of waking up one day and killing dozens of strangers as part of a calculated, vicious plan.

Emily Willingham is science editor at the Thinking Person’s Guide to Autism, manages the Double X Science blog, and blogs at Forbes.



namaste
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19 Dec 2012, 10:58 pm

compiledkernel wrote:

Long term social ostracism will affect even NTs in adverse ways when made over long periods of time. The affects of this kind of behaviour, affects any person in a negative manner regardless of their circumstance. Ted Kaczinski, Noah Rondeau, and Robert Harrill might be examples of this condition.

i read about them in wikipedia the first story really stirred me a child prodigy, gifted, talented person leaves everything behind just because he couldnt fit in
and ultimately becomes a bomber thats what is expected if the society doesnt accept the gift in the person rather they look at the person as different, separate and odd.

In men's case they turn towards voilence but incase of women they turn towards suicide as is the case of Virginia Wolf, Jane Austen or J.K. Rowling and many of them ultimately become sucessful in attempting suicide.


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