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janicka
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29 Dec 2006, 11:08 am

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16389128/

I just posted this MSN article on the matter. However, I have been following number of different news outlets.

I've said this before, but I am saying it again - it sort of makes me ill to think that the U.S. invaded to set up "freedom and democracy" only to try and convict Saddam in a kangaroo court. I think it is an insult to the people serving over there and to the people who have died over there in the name of such "freedom". I don't think that Saddam is a good person by any means, so that's not really what I want to discuss. What I DO want to discuss is how these supposed legal proceedings and upcoming execution reflect on the U.S. and U.S. military.



doordoctor
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29 Dec 2006, 12:56 pm

breaking news, they are hanging him tomorrow!! ! www.cnn.com


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prism97
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29 Dec 2006, 1:03 pm

Hi! I also think Saddam is a major league fink. With all due respect to your country's soldiers, I don't think Bush & Rumsfeld sent the troops in there to promote freedom democracy & all that Americana. Frankly, the Iraqis are an ancient civilization. Much older than most. and if they wanted a democracy, they'd have one! This is about the elder Bush waltzing into Iraq after a lot of bragging & swaggering & then getting his ass handed to him. Now he has sent a boy to do a man's job. True to form, Jr. too is failing (not the troops, but the politicians!). America sometimes seems to have little understanding for ways of life, systems & cultures not its own. What we in the West call terrorism is actually a different form of warfare! What we call cowarice, many view as an act of bravery. We sometimes are able only to see through 'Western' eyes. The majority of the world sees things differently. If the US was so intent on 'spreading freedom & democracy' why not rescue the people of Darfur? Why didn't they rescue the Tutsis in Rwanda? Feed the Ethiopians? So many nations need rescuing. The Iraqis never attacked the US nor did their people invite the US in. The bulk of the 911 terrorists were Saudis (whom the Bush administration still sees as allies!?!). Saddam (although he is a bastard but no less or more than Kim Jong Il & a host of others) did not terrorize the US. The US has walked in and destroyed the country! How many Iraqi civilians have died? We never see these images like we did in the case of Vietnam. Your press has been censored!The US, with its melting pot mentality might see 'the Iraqis' as all one people, but THEY do not see it that way & it is important to understand & respect that. Look at the Irish in Belfast; same 'race', same appearance, same socio economic demographics & same Christianity-except one group is Catholic & the other is Protestant! Over this, they've been killing eachother for centuries. Are we so naive to think that we in North America can waltze in & change them with guns?!? This war in Iraq is un-winnable since both sides gauge 'victory' differently. Iraq never declared war; the US INVADED. As a Quebecoise, this scares the crap out of me. When will Bush decide I deserve to be freed from my 'terroristic' French government or the British monarchy (plus seize control of our land, government & natural resources while they're at it)? You are right; this is a kangaroo court & Saddam is being murdered. Not that I'll miss the ass-hole or plan to attend his funeral! It sends a message to any sovereign nation that possesses resources and refuses to do or think as the USA wants it to. How soon will we face trumped-up charges and false allegations (like we are secretly stockpiling weapons of mass destruction & the US can prove it!) and see our Prime Minister strapped to a gurney for a lethal injection & our Queen, may God save her, deposed?



janicka
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29 Dec 2006, 2:18 pm

Well said, Prism 97.

The biggest irony that I see in the matter is that Bush bans the use of stem cells to potentially save or improve millions of lives because it is disrespectful to life. Well WTF is war? That's pretty damned disrespectful to life. As far as I am concerned this whole Iraq debacle was supposed to be an ego trip for Jr (either that or he's in an alcoholic delerium state). If he cared so much about life, why in the hell isn't he doing anything about the "post partum abortions" occuring in Darfur? The starving Ethiopians and the Hututs vs. Tutsis are more or less in the past, though I agree that the U.S. should have stepped in with some sort of humanitarian aid. But right now, today, we should be in Darfur - not Iraq - if we care so damned much about the sanctity of human life. Oh wait, we just care about the sanctity of embryos, my bad. Nuke 'em after they're alive.

And WTF is it with the Saudi's. They are the worst of the worst. Their government won't do a damned thing about the rogue clerics that are cranking out suicidal plane hijakers of the future. And, as far as I can tell, Bush doesn't give a damn. Nor will he and his party give financial support for the development of alternative fuels so that we could at least try to distance ourselves.

And now Chimpus Khan (Bush) is talking about a troop surge and occupying the Persian Gulf. With what army? He's already occupied the army with this ego trip of his. Personally, I am anticipating a draft. Especially now that the Iraqi's will likely go on a rampage after their leader is hung. And why else would Bush want to wait until after the holidays to unveil his great new plan for Iraq. It's gonna be a draft, and he doesn't want to announce it during the holidays because it would make his situation even worse than what will make it. Hopefully the Congress will reign him in, but he is already on his own with this and doesn't seem to care. Cheney and the other warmongers seem to have disappeared. Anyway, I hope that he, Cheney, and Gonzales get impeached. That would be a good start. Then we can pull out of Iraq and let the country begin to heal.



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29 Dec 2006, 3:09 pm

Man, if he does a draft I wish you yanks well. Nothing like some as*hole at the top of the chain with borderline 'mental retardation' telling you what to do



TheMachine1
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29 Dec 2006, 5:11 pm

Free Sadam! Free Sadam! He's the only guy that can stablize Iraq(thats the real reason they want him dead).



dimensionaltraveler
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29 Dec 2006, 5:34 pm

I think that it is great that Saddam Hussein will hang for his crimes against humanity but it will not change the situation there. Things have gotten out of control there. Iraq is in a low grade civil war and its getting ready to explode into a much wider civil war that threatens the entire region.



janicka
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29 Dec 2006, 5:41 pm

I wouldn't necessarily mind him hanging for crimes against humanity. I am questioning whether or not he received a fair trial for said crimes.



dimensionaltraveler
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29 Dec 2006, 5:54 pm

janicka wrote:
I wouldn't necessarily mind him hanging for crimes against humanity. I am questioning whether or not he received a fair trial for said crimes.


Saddam Hussein deserves to die. He used nerve agent on his own people. Hussein raped and murdered his own people for decades sometimes for his own personal pleasure. Thousands of Kurds died and were maimed of being exposed to nerve gas.His cronies videotaped victims while they were being killed for his personal viewing. Lastly, you cannot forget what he did to Kuwait in 1990. He try to plunder all of the Kuwaiti oil fields and massacred many of its citizens.Saddam Hussein ranks up there with Joseph Stalin and Adolf Hitler as the criminal leaders of the 20th century.



Corvus
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29 Dec 2006, 9:36 pm

dimensionaltraveler wrote:
I think that it is great that Saddam Hussein will hang for his crimes against humanity but it will not change the situation there. Things have gotten out of control there. Iraq is in a low grade civil war and its getting ready to explode into a much wider civil war that threatens the entire region.


Ya, I think it would be great. The thing my logical brain is mentally screwing up on when processing the information was WHY WASN'T HE TRIED IN 1988 WHEN THE CRIME ACTUALLY HAPPENED? WHY ALMOST 15-20 YEARS LATER?



dimensionaltraveler
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29 Dec 2006, 9:56 pm

Quote:
WHY WASN'T HE TRIED IN 1988 WHEN THE CRIME ACTUALLY HAPPENED? WHY ALMOST 15-20 YEARS LATER?


The reason he was not tried in 1988 because he was fighting a war with Iran and he was still allied to the West.



headphase
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29 Dec 2006, 9:58 pm

dimensionaltraveler wrote:
Quote:
WHY WASN'T HE TRIED IN 1988 WHEN THE CRIME ACTUALLY HAPPENED? WHY ALMOST 15-20 YEARS LATER?


The reason he was not tried in 1988 because he was fighting a war with Iran and he was still allied to the West.

O RLY?



dimensionaltraveler
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29 Dec 2006, 10:16 pm

headphase wrote:
dimensionaltraveler wrote:
Quote:
WHY WASN'T HE TRIED IN 1988 WHEN THE CRIME ACTUALLY HAPPENED? WHY ALMOST 15-20 YEARS LATER?


The reason he was not tried in 1988 because he was fighting a war with Iran and he was still allied to the West.

O RLY?


You bet. He fell off the list when he invaded Kuwait.



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29 Dec 2006, 10:57 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6218485.stm

It's been done, Saddam has been executed. So brace for hell in Iraq, because I have a feeling this will make all the tension explode now.


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Tequila
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29 Dec 2006, 11:06 pm

I won't be mourning his death but I do hope they aren't deluding themselves into thinking that this will do any measure of good for Iraq. The country is still in the midst of a full-scale sectarian war.



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29 Dec 2006, 11:06 pm

woohoo! he's dead! now, if you don't mind...*hides in bomb shelter*


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