Your thoughts on growing out of Aspergers

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richardbenson
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17 Mar 2013, 6:08 pm

Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.
So you don't believe Developmental skills can be developed any further? They are stuck that way for ever?


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17 Mar 2013, 6:18 pm

Dizzee wrote:
MjrMajorMajor wrote:
Dizzee wrote:
Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.

Arguable, aspergers is just a compilation of various symptoms, diagnosis is used to determine the causes of it. You can't really tell in one sentence what exactly AS is.

What about the numerous studies pointing to unique wiring in autistic brains? This is in addition to other differences that appear prevalent in autism studies...

They don't investigate every AS's brain during diagnosis do they? I really don't want to get too deep into this because I really don't know a thing about neuroscience and such, but what if this "brain-wiring" type isn't a constant state?

Of course ones brain can change, and so does a peace of paper. But you can only write over what you already have. You cannot erase something the water mark will always be there.

And make no mistake about it, if you actually have aspergers it will be detected with a brain scan.

I think it's very bothering concept to believe someone can outgrow being an aspie.

I'd considered the op to be a well adapted aspie.

It should be a end goal of anyone with aspergers.

And to be frank the idea that someone is incapable of adapting with autism is absurd.

Inability to developed isn't caused by aspergers and there is no science to back it up. Failure is caused by expecting a swan to act like a duck.



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17 Mar 2013, 7:29 pm

Growing out of Asperger's?

LOL. There's no such thing in my world. :lol:



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19 Mar 2013, 12:00 am

I feel one can out grow it. But not everyone can.

So yes I believe you can out grow it, but most don't.



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19 Mar 2013, 12:41 am

Well I can only speak from my own personal experiences. When I was young (under 16) I pretty much couldn't socialize. Like, at all. However nowadays, if you knew me then and now, you wouldn't even recognize me as the same person. Have I grown out of it? No, I still have a good deal of problems and a long ways to go. But, I have been able to greatly hone my socialization skills to the point where they no longer significantly hinder me in most areas of my life.



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19 Mar 2013, 1:34 am

Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.


No but you learn to compensate and cope, you learn to "blend in" and hide how you really are to fit in, inside you're still thinking the same way you always have but you mask it externally.



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19 Mar 2013, 1:43 am

No, I don't think that it's possible. I've grown to be better at socializing and stuff, but that doesn't mean that me being autistic disappears. It just means that you've grown as a person and you're learning to fit-in better with society. I don't think the symptoms will ever completely disappear, especially my sensory issues.



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19 Mar 2013, 2:35 am

Like some others have said, I don't know so much that one can grow out of AS as much as learning to work within its limitations.

My -- symptoms, traits, quirks -- are MUCH better now than they were years ago. There was a time when I could barely even raise my head to look at someone, let alone sit and have a spirited conversation with him/her. The idea of having a job where I had to interact with people was incomprehensible -- now it's mostly OK (I stress out about it sometimes). I now flirt shamelessly, something I would NEVER have done back in my younger days. And now I can pick up a telephone and make a call, whereas not so many years ago the idea was at best uncomfortable and at worst petrifying. So Yeah -- I'm definitely better. But outgrown Asperger's?

No way. I still rock back and forth when I"m agitated, I still have a tendency to zone out, I'm still cluelss when it comes to the social aspects of dating and relationships, I'm still very literal-minded and I'm so clumsy I almost can't walk and blink at the same time. So Asperger's is still part of my life. I've just learned to work with it, not against it.



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19 Mar 2013, 4:29 am

Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.


I'd tend to agree with this

It's a fundamental difference in the brain that's there from birth so how can it just vanish?

People can no doubt learn how to mask the outward effects of their autism better but I don't think
that's the same as growing out of it



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19 Mar 2013, 9:15 am

A psychologist said I probably have AS when I was 16, so my quirks had previously been considered signs of intelligence (the naiveity of parents . . . :lol:). My lack of social skills had been considered lack of experience. After my 'unofficial diagnosis', I decided I was going to work on this, considering I now knew what was wrong with me. I started facing my social fears and mixing with people more. My confidence grew slowly but surely.

I made a concerted effort to act normally, dress normally, and even think normally. I answered the 'Aspie Quiz' according to this 'new' version of myself, and it came up with 'you are very likely neurotypical'. Honestly, sometimes I felt as though I had managed to install NT software in my brain.

About a year after that fateful trip to the psychologist, I thought I had it made. I wasn't forming deep relationships with more people, but I could talk to just about anyone and had the confidence to do so.

Then . . . I got stressed out because it was my last year of high school and it was exam season. My social confidence and social skills crashed right through the floor. I became paranoid and it made my hands shake and my heart race to be around people. I thought [eople were out to get me because I had failed to keep up being social. I felt like throwing up in the morning during breakfast, knowing that I would have to face people when I went to school. It has taken me eight months to get myself back in a relatively sociable, confident state of mind.

The moral of the story, I think, is that AS is something I will never 'grow out of' in the same way I grew out of my childhood lactose intolerance. But when I'm forty years old or so, I think I would've had it mostly under control. It's about managing your weaknesses, not pretending that they don't exist.



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19 Mar 2013, 9:31 am

Meridian191 wrote:
A psychologist said I probably have AS when I was 16, so my quirks had previously been considered signs of intelligence (the naiveity of parents . . . :lol:). My lack of social skills had been considered lack of experience. After my 'unofficial diagnosis', I decided I was going to work on this, considering I now knew what was wrong with me. I started facing my social fears and mixing with people more. My confidence grew slowly but surely.

I made a concerted effort to act normally, dress normally, and even think normally. I answered the 'Aspie Quiz' according to this 'new' version of myself, and it came up with 'you are very likely neurotypical'. Honestly, sometimes I felt as though I had managed to install NT software in my brain.

About a year after that fateful trip to the psychologist, I thought I had it made. I wasn't forming deep relationships with more people, but I could talk to just about anyone and had the confidence to do so.

Then . . . I got stressed out because it was my last year of high school and it was exam season. My social confidence and social skills crashed right through the floor. I became paranoid and it made my hands shake and my heart race to be around people. I thought [eople were out to get me because I had failed to keep up being social. I felt like throwing up in the morning during breakfast, knowing that I would have to face people when I went to school. It has taken me eight months to get myself back in a relatively sociable, confident state of mind.

The moral of the story, I think, is that AS is something I will never 'grow out of' in the same way I grew out of my childhood lactose intolerance. But when I'm forty years old or so, I think I would've had it mostly under control. It's about managing your weaknesses, not pretending that they don't exist.


You may have it pretty mildly. Also, I think just pretending to think differently is a form of self-deception and won't work. I've actually tried this many times before, and overuse may actually have contributed to my bipolar symptoms. Trying to think like an NT macho male leads to a rage episode that lasts a few weeks which eventually spirals down into depression. I think it's much more productive to change behavior (learn to hold a certain posture and facial expression or not to talk about certain things) but arrive at it in your own way rather than forcing yourself to take the same internal approach as NT's.



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19 Mar 2013, 10:01 am

nessa238 wrote:
Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.


I'd tend to agree with this

It's a fundamental difference in the brain that's there from birth so how can it just vanish?

People can no doubt learn how to mask the outward effects of their autism better but I don't think
that's the same as growing out of it


People are not socially maladjusted just because they were born that way. That makes no sense..I agree there is a difference in the brain, but basically most brains integrate information approximately the same (right brain, big bites---left brain small bites, and then there is some comprehensive connection made (from many different angles) between the two hemispheres which involves integration, so taking some kind of leap into understanding and ultimately into action. Different brains of all kinds of people work approximately the same, though with some variation, and tend to synchronize their activity..

The brain is very flexible and changes the way it works through learning. There are many reasons why a person may not be able to synchronize with other people.Try to think of some psychological reasons a person may not be doing so.



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19 Mar 2013, 10:08 am

My understanding of it:

People can adapt (beyond just masking) and their symptoms do change including for many getting more mild.

For some people, this includes pushing them into subclinical.

This does not mean that they are suddenly NT, it means that they have gone from showing enough symptoms to not showing enough symptoms, from being considered autistic to being considered BAP, to being considered no longer significantly impaired by their symptoms.

However, when this happens, these people can also become more autistic later in life again and could start showing symptoms again. This is why the DSM-5 people were talking about "in remission" being used.


However not everyone takes the path into becoming BAP from being autistic, only some do.



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19 Mar 2013, 10:08 am

littlebee wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.


I'd tend to agree with this

It's a fundamental difference in the brain that's there from birth so how can it just vanish?

People can no doubt learn how to mask the outward effects of their autism better but I don't think
that's the same as growing out of it


People are not socially maladjusted just because they were born that way. That makes no sense..I agree there is a difference in the brain, but basically most brains integrate information approximately the same (right brain, big bites---left brain small bites, and then there is some comprehensive connection made (from many different angles) between the two hemispheres which involves integration, so taking some kind of leap into understanding and ultimately into action. Different brains of all kinds of people work approximately the same, though with some variation, and tend to synchronize their activity..

The brain is very flexible and changes the way it works through learning. There are many reasons why a person may not be able to synchronize with other people.Try to think of some psychological reasons a person may not be doing so.


Er I think you'll find they are

Autism is a difference in the way the brain works which makes it not well-adapted to the social world

certain modules are wired differently or even missing, which explains why we are always on the back foot when it comes to social interaction, as we have to perform manually what NTs do automatically

I don't know what form of autism or condition you have but this is what's happening in my brain

How you can say everyone's brain works more or less the same I do not know

It's not a psychology thing at all - it's how the brain is wired

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/47193.php

http://www.salk.edu/ra/autism.html

"The researchers understand that some important brain responses are too small or missing in autism, and a new framework of analysis may help them to understand why. Using the band metaphor, Salk scientists believe that there's a good possibility that in autism the coherence of the band is missing. There is no reorganization, and the instruments continue to play their own tunes."



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19 Mar 2013, 10:35 am

nessa238 wrote:
Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If you grow out of Autism, you can't have it in the first place.


I'd tend to agree with this

It's a fundamental difference in the brain that's there from birth so how can it just vanish?

People can no doubt learn how to mask the outward effects of their autism better but I don't think
that's the same as growing out of it


I would agree with you if I hadn't gained a sense that I wasn't born with when I was 11. I was born without a sense of smell but it somehow developed later in life way past the time you would expect something like that to happen.

You would think that if you're born without a sense you'll always be missing it. It's supposed to develop at a certain time and if it doesn't the opportunity is missed. That wasn't the case for me.

There must have been a significant neurological change taking place for me to learn how to smell. If something as drastic as that can happen it's easier for me to believe that other extreme changes are possible. I don't know if they're likely but unexpected things can happen.



Meridian191
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19 Mar 2013, 10:35 am

Tyri0n wrote:
Meridian191 wrote:
A psychologist said I probably have AS when I was 16, so my quirks had previously been considered signs of intelligence (the naiveity of parents . . . :lol:). My lack of social skills had been considered lack of experience. After my 'unofficial diagnosis', I decided I was going to work on this, considering I now knew what was wrong with me. I started facing my social fears and mixing with people more. My confidence grew slowly but surely.

I made a concerted effort to act normally, dress normally, and even think normally. I answered the 'Aspie Quiz' according to this 'new' version of myself, and it came up with 'you are very likely neurotypical'. Honestly, sometimes I felt as though I had managed to install NT software in my brain.

About a year after that fateful trip to the psychologist, I thought I had it made. I wasn't forming deep relationships with more people, but I could talk to just about anyone and had the confidence to do so.

Then . . . I got stressed out because it was my last year of high school and it was exam season. My social confidence and social skills crashed right through the floor. I became paranoid and it made my hands shake and my heart race to be around people. I thought [eople were out to get me because I had failed to keep up being social. I felt like throwing up in the morning during breakfast, knowing that I would have to face people when I went to school. It has taken me eight months to get myself back in a relatively sociable, confident state of mind.

The moral of the story, I think, is that AS is something I will never 'grow out of' in the same way I grew out of my childhood lactose intolerance. But when I'm forty years old or so, I think I would've had it mostly under control. It's about managing your weaknesses, not pretending that they don't exist.


You may have it pretty mildly. Also, I think just pretending to think differently is a form of self-deception and won't work. I've actually tried this many times before, and overuse may actually have contributed to my bipolar symptoms. Trying to think like an NT macho male leads to a rage episode that lasts a few weeks which eventually spirals down into depression. I think it's much more productive to change behavior (learn to hold a certain posture and facial expression or not to talk about certain things) but arrive at it in your own way rather than forcing yourself to take the same internal approach as NT's.


You are probably right, considering that you're older than me. What precisely do you mean by 'rage episode'? I'm curious to see if I brought that on myself by accident. Anyway, I agree with what you say about behaviour. However, I do disagree slightly that taking an NT-like internal approach, in moderation, is not useful sometimes. My logic is that if you can't think like the people you are interacting with, you can't understand them. I'm curious to know your opinions on the relationship between bipolar symptoms and 'fighting' AS.