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mikassyna
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18 Apr 2013, 9:33 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
And how do you get that and where in my listing imply enforcing modeling and shaping???!


I think maybe it was implied in this statement:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
if I had a boy and developed to an inadequate adult who's totally uninteresting, boring, weak and incapable to socialize, can't take responsibility and totally clueless how to court ladies (unless he's asexual and not interested) then I would be completely have failed my mission as a parent.


I think it is a parent's responsibility to try to teach those things. However, you can bring the horse to water but you can't make it drink. You can try many different tactics but there is never a guarantee that it will work. You can try 24/7 for years, and still not get the result you hope for. For example, you can't take a child who has Kanner's Autism and expect the result you describe--and you would not have failed as a parent because it would be unreasonable to expect the son with that condition to achieve those goals. Many parents with children who have ASDs are not Early Childhood Development specialists nor do they have PhDs in the Cognitive Sciences. They often struggle and are stressed out because the typical methods of discipline/childrearing DO NOT work on many kids on the spectrum. So, we listen to the professionals, but if we also have our own impediments we aren't always able to implement their instructions exactly as they instruct. Does it mean we fail as parents? No. We do the best we can. We aim high but don't turn ourselves into basket cases because we make mistakes. And we learn to love ourselves and accept that we are human and can be successful in our mission as parents regardless of what other people think. Because only we know the struggles of our day to day lives, and barring any outright abuse or major dysfunction, there is nobody out there who I deem perfect enough to have the authority to judge me, regardless of what they think of themselves.



BlueMax
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18 Apr 2013, 9:43 am

MjrMajorMajor wrote:
Children don't pop out as formless clay ready to be molded into the proper shape. Parenting does have a lot of influence on a child's development, but no matter how hard you badger your kid into being the popular football star or whatever it's not going to happen if the natural inclination isn't there. You just end up with a resentful kid.
With all this parenting advice being tossed around, I would guess the most zealous advice would be from people with no children.


An excellent, excellent post. Anyone who's had a kid (especially more than one) will tell you they're BORN with personalities and traits... They can be influenced some, but you'll never totally change someone without doing pretty severe damage!

Still, I want to be able to teach both of my two very different boys the coping mechanisms they'll need to survive & thrive in this crazy world. ;)



The_Face_of_Boo
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18 Apr 2013, 9:46 am

mikassyna wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
And how do you get that and where in my listing imply enforcing modeling and shaping???!


I think maybe it was implied in this statement:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
if I had a boy and developed to an inadequate adult who's totally uninteresting, boring, weak and incapable to socialize, can't take responsibility and totally clueless how to court ladies (unless he's asexual and not interested) then I would be completely have failed my mission as a parent.


I think it is a parent's responsibility to try to teach those things. However, you can bring the horse to water but you can't make it drink. You can try many different tactics but there is never a guarantee that it will work. You can try 24/7 for years, and still not get the result you hope for. For example, you can't take a child who has Kanner's Autism and expect the result you describe--and you would not have failed as a parent because it would be unreasonable to expect the son with that condition to achieve those goals. Many parents with children who have ASDs are not Early Childhood Development specialists nor do they have PhDs in the Cognitive Sciences. They often struggle and are stressed out because the typical methods of discipline/childrearing DO NOT work on many kids on the spectrum. So, we listen to the professionals, but if we also have our own impediments we aren't always able to implement their instructions exactly as they instruct. Does it mean we fail as parents? No. We do the best we can. We aim high but don't turn ourselves into basket cases because we make mistakes. And we learn to love ourselves and accept that we are human and can be successful in our mission as parents regardless of what other people think. Because only we know the struggles of our day to day lives, and barring any outright abuse or major dysfunction, there is nobody out there who I deem perfect enough to have the authority to judge me, regardless of what they think of themselves.


That's why I've asked you earlier what type of autism your boys have and you said both have it; however not mentioning their ages and from your description I couldn't tell how mild or severe have it based on the previous post.

Anyway, you've asked how to begin to teach them how to navigate the screwed up world of dating and I've replied accordingly, assuming they aren't severally autistic.

For both of you (you and MjrMajorMajor), my post is simply an advice, I am imposing nothing on you, just take it or leave it.



MjrMajorMajor
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18 Apr 2013, 12:11 pm

BlueMax wrote:
MjrMajorMajor wrote:
Children don't pop out as formless clay ready to be molded into the proper shape. Parenting does have a lot of influence on a child's development, but no matter how hard you badger your kid into being the popular football star or whatever it's not going to happen if the natural inclination isn't there. You just end up with a resentful kid.
With all this parenting advice being tossed around, I would guess the most zealous advice would be from people with no children.


An excellent, excellent post. Anyone who's had a kid (especially more than one) will tell you they're BORN with personalities and traits... They can be influenced some, but you'll never totally change someone without doing pretty severe damage!

Still, I want to be able to teach both of my two very different boys the coping mechanisms they'll need to survive & thrive in this crazy world. ;)

:) Thank you and agreed.

The_Face_of_Boo- My comment wasn't meant to be belittling. I'm sure you've heard references before about the idealization of how parenting will be vs the reality after a couple kids.

Spiderpig Perhaps I did. I know you weren't being dismissive of females, but you seemed to be making an argument about men having to fight their "reptilian brains" to treat them in an equal manner. Hence the evolution comment. I will reread, and I apologize if I did indeed misread your post.



MjrMajorMajor
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18 Apr 2013, 12:20 pm

mikassyna wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
And how do you get that and where in my listing imply enforcing modeling and shaping???!


I think maybe it was implied in this statement:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
if I had a boy and developed to an inadequate adult who's totally uninteresting, boring, weak and incapable to socialize, can't take responsibility and totally clueless how to court ladies (unless he's asexual and not interested) then I would be completely have failed my mission as a parent.


I think it is a parent's responsibility to try to teach those things. However, you can bring the horse to water but you can't make it drink.


Yes.



aspiemike
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18 Apr 2013, 12:50 pm

I'll reply directly to your post Boo on what I believe may have happened. I do know some girls like having their egos boosted so that they can feel desired by people other than who they are with or who they are interested in. Guys do it too. Everyone wants to feel desired at points and sometimes the respective partners aren't doing enough to give them that attention. Some may even go far enough to actually cheat because their might be an attraction for someone else. In the case of the third girl with the large headphones, she just wants to feel desirable. The first one is probably the most attracted to you. That is just my opinion.