How to make my Brother Normal hasn't been outside in years

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CockneyRebel
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08 Jun 2013, 11:33 am

You can ask him if he wants to be normal and encourage him to do outside activities that he likes. Don't be surprised if he says he doesn't wish to be normal, but still encourage him to get out.


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jk1
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08 Jun 2013, 1:12 pm

I admire you for your caring about your brother. Although I don't think he needs to be "normal", I don't think the current state he is in will not be good for his own future. So I do believe he needs to change so that he can function and support himself in the future.

You might first want to talk to him about this issue and tell him that you are willing to help. He needs to be convinced first that he needs to change things. Then he and you can start making plans - ultimate goals and small steps to achieve that, including possible career options etc. You could even go and find out what kinds of help (for dealing with his conditions) and courses (for career development) are available.

Having said that, I think that putting too much pressure on him will overwhelm him and make him even more avoidant. So a small step at a time is the way to go.

Sorry but that's all I can think of right now.



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08 Jun 2013, 1:40 pm

A lot of the things you talk about don't really seem to be issues at all.

He doesn't shave, he likes movies and TV, he wears the same clothes all the time, he likes to stay in his room... these things aren't really issues. What is wrong with those things? Ultimately, they're his choice and he's happy with his choices. You might not like them, but frankly they're not really your concern. The exception is if he relies on you to prepare all his meals or something like that, maybe that's unreasonable of him.

Getting him to have more conversations with you is a toughy. As Callista says, maybe try IM. Also, he'll probably be more willing to speak if you talk to him about things he is interested in, like what film he's watching right now, and maybe try and move towards more conventional conversation over time.

The depression is probably the main reason that he should socialise more. If he ever complains of low mood, tell him that speaking to people and moving about are some of the best ways to overcome that.

Walking around the house naked is a big issue. I have no idea how you solve that other than making sure he has clothes he finds comfortable.



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08 Jun 2013, 3:13 pm

nessa238 wrote:
Wandering_Stranger wrote:
If u try to force him to do stuff, he'll be less likely to do it. If he's happy, why force him to change?


I'd initially be inclined to agree with this but if my Mother hadn't encouraged and supported me to maintain employment and to buy my own house, I wouldn't have anywhere secure to live, so I definitely needed outside input to motivate and encourage me.
If I'd had a choice as to whether to work or not I wouldn't have as it was very stressful.


Encouraging someone to go outside is different to forcing them to go outside.



AardvarkGoodSwimmer
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08 Jun 2013, 3:46 pm

Hi, does your brother participate in political forums or blogs?

Now, regardless of the content of his views, if he's able to engage in respectful dialogue with people who have other views, if he's able to get some interplay going between theory and practice, maybe even help to build up other people and be a coach from time to time, of course all this is a tall order, but if he's able to even partially do this, he is doing the work of democracy and that's a good thing. If he currently doesn't, well, that's okay, even a lot of neurotypical ('NT') people can't do all this.

So, yes, be open to different ways of helping your brother make progress on issues, but at the same time, also appreciate the good things he has going on.



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08 Jun 2013, 3:57 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
A lot of the things you talk about don't really seem to be issues at all.

He doesn't shave, he likes movies and TV, he wears the same clothes all the time, he likes to stay in his room... these things aren't really issues. What is wrong with those things?


My thought on that is that when someone never goes out, their vitamin D levels will be very low; the lack of exercise is also not healthy; at least walking somewhat is good for a person.

Also he isn't keeping up his hygiene or dental health. Dental health is important as it can impact your whole health. Some think the bacteria from a rotting tooth can cause other problems in the body. I don't want to scare anyone and I'm not a Dr. but this is what I've read. I will leave others to think about that one. (ETA: Maybe he would use natural things like baking soda and water to brush his teeth with, with a really soft toothbrush meant for infants. By now his teeth must be extremely sensitive. Also try to get him to eat and especially to drink less sugar as it is acidic, if he dotes on sugar. You can probably google natural ways to clean the teeth, and natural mouthwash mixes that aren't harmful if he panics and swallows some. A lot of mouthwashes are very strong; maybe as someone else suggested too, natural hygiene products, gentle and unscented, from a health food store, or home made.)

He isn't learning things that can support him financially in case his family one day cannot. That leaves him at risk of huge changes (in residence and roommates i.e. a group home or something) he would have no control over at all. Control is important to him but, imagine no control at all. That is much worse than being asked to go to a dentist sometimes or to bathe, or to get clothes that are not falling off him with wear.

His bedsprings are poking out. That could potentially injure him.

His family are understandably worried since his parents won't be there forever and his siblings may or may not be able to take that role one day (or be willing to in some families.) Also he isn't really happy it doesn't sound like to me; he lives in a state of hypervigilance and fear. He is distracting himself with sensory stimulation (stimming) with computer and Tv. That's how it sounds to me.

He isn't living a balanced life. No one says he has to become Mr Gregarious and shake hands and have a million friends but, even physically, he is not living a life that's going to bring him health and stability in future.

I had a relative who did similar things with his life and he ended up with a host of physical problems, (diabetes, depression, loss of teeth, and more), which now have left him with even fewer life choices. If this guy likes control he will want as many choices as he can have. Being in a physical wreck of a body is not the way to go. Also, if he does get some health conditions from living in squalor and never going outdoors, he will have to go to doctor appointments regularly and that seems to be what he dreads. So even if he wants to be in all the time there is a smart way to do it.



neilson_wheels
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08 Jun 2013, 4:16 pm

Fully support your statement Popsicle.



Popsicle
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08 Jun 2013, 4:17 pm

Thank you neilson_wheels. Much appreciated.



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08 Jun 2013, 5:06 pm

Noetic wrote:
Take it slowly, and don't expect big results.

Also, stop enabling his self enforced exile. He reminds me a lot of an uncle I had who sat at home for his last two decades and got fatter and damaged his liver because he drank too much.

Thing is, someone was over all those years enabling him to sit on his ar*e all day and drink himself into oblivion, because he wasn't leaving the house to buy the booze himself. Someone was bringing him food and drink, and paying for this "lifestyle". Over time he became incapable of looking after himself, because his wife and a family friend were doing all the day to day work for him and paying for his habits.

There may well be some depression or agoraphobia going on with your brother as well, so perhaps you can find a doctor who makes house visits can who can come and see him and give you advice?


Yeah great point, why is he been given everything to live his existence. Like he should be going out to buy food and stuff.

Also on getting him to change. He will resist change because he probably can't see a problem with it. Make sure you tell him that you have a problem with it and the reasons for the problems, so that give him a logical reason to change.


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paddy26
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08 Jun 2013, 5:23 pm

Maybe you would be better seeking advice from a doctor/GP familiar with aspergers, My advice would be to ask your brother to help with the food shopping maybe once or twice a week and gradually start planning other activities like going to the cinema again. As for the clothes thing you could try asking your brother to shop online for new clothes, that way he can pick what he likes without the stress of going to a busy store.



Noetic
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09 Jun 2013, 4:58 am

What Popsicle said



chickenhawked
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09 Jun 2013, 6:44 am

"we should have all forced him to be social anyway.."

Just wanted to pop in and point out that for a lot of autistic people, that's BS.

My parents forced me to be social. I forced myself to be social. I went to college for five years and was as outgoing as possible. I joined clubs, I made a lot of friends--and I f*****g hated every moment of it.

Some people with autism are high-functioning enough that they can enjoy a social life. Some people with autism want a social life. Some people with autism, however, are exhausted by being social. When I was going to college I used to come home and fall asleep immediately. I'd wake up and it would be time for school again. I was physically and mentally exhausted by having to pretend to be normal at school.

If your brother has never tried to be social, then fine, encourage him. But if he does not want to be social, then leave him alone. Every time my mom or dad comes over and tells me, "You should get out more. Don't you want to make friends?", it makes me FEEL LIKE s**t. Some people just don't understand that some autistic people DO NOT want to form relationships. Some of us just don't! Please leave us alone! No, I don't want a girlfriend/boyfriend! I know that it's absolutely shocking that different people with different thoughts and priorities exist, but it's true! Not all of us require friends or significant others to be content or fulfilled.

Sorry for being ranty, but this is such a huge enormous misconception, and I don't see it ever going away. If your brother is happy as is, leave him alone.

EDIT: All that said, you do need to force him to become social enough to be independent if he is capable of being independent. Exhaustion/not wanting to socialize is no excuse for him to rely on someone else his entire life if he can do it himself.



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09 Jun 2013, 12:30 pm

Yeah, Chickenhawked totally has a point. Your brother's probably an introvert and his social quota may be filled up just talking to people on the Internet and interacting with his family. If you're an extrovert, you might never have thought about the differences, and just put it down to autism, but introversion is actually a healthy difference, not something to worry about. Some people are just not social butterflies, and if your brother's happy that way, forcing him to "go out and have fun" will NOT be fun for him. The sort of socializing he likes will probably include things like quiet conversation over coffee, an IM on a lazy Saturday, or a forum exchange about a favorite topic.

Your brother is an adult. He should make his own choices. Forcing him isn't ethical. That doesn't mean you can't say, "I notice you have trouble with these things; do you want me to teach you?" Or, "I really enjoy doing Thing X; why don't you join me?" Being forced out of one's comfort zone is not a good thing. Being invited to step just a little way out of it, though, is empowering.

Do remember that there's a chance that your brother truly doesn't have the ability to live totally independently. AS can create so many logistical challenges that a person can find that they could theoretically do, say, their own shopping and cooking... except that it would end up taking up all of their time and effort, and they'd have no time to do things that are more useful. Sometimes, just theoretically being able to do something isn't good enough reason to be forced to do it. It's like how people will use a wheelchair even if they can walk, if walking is so tiring that they wouldn't have the energy to do anything useful. Sometimes people with AS just need help. The important factor is that they control what kind of help they get. People with AS are almost always capable of running their own lives--whether or not they need help with the specifics. Think of it like this: Most of us aren't able to fix our own cars, and we don't consider it an impingement on our independence when we pay someone to do it for us. Someone with AS may need someone to do shopping or cooking for him, and that should be seen as very similar to needing someone to fix your car for you. It shouldn't make you less of a person.


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The_Walrus
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09 Jun 2013, 2:42 pm

Popsicle wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
A lot of the things you talk about don't really seem to be issues at all.

He doesn't shave, he likes movies and TV, he wears the same clothes all the time, he likes to stay in his room... these things aren't really issues. What is wrong with those things?


My thought on that is that when someone never goes out, their vitamin D levels will be very low; the lack of exercise is also not healthy; at least walking somewhat is good for a person.

He isn't learning things that can support him financially in case his family one day cannot. That leaves him at risk of huge changes (in residence and roommates i.e. a group home or something) he would have no control over at all. Control is important to him but, imagine no control at all. That is much worse than being asked to go to a dentist sometimes or to bathe, or to get clothes that are not falling off him with wear.

Vitamin D can be accessed from the diet. Exercise can, if necessary, be gained by walking inside the house.

The financial support is a potential issue in the long term. I imagine he qualifies for disability now, that could be used towards his (very low) living costs and the rest could be saved. But yes, long term he'll need a job so he can potentially buy the house from his parents (if they need to sell up) or from his brother (if his parents die), or else he'll need to be settled somewhere else (like sheltered accommodation).



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09 Jun 2013, 2:55 pm

Maybe start by giving him a reason to go into the yard more. Maybe take a walk around the neighborhood later.


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09 Jun 2013, 3:31 pm

Callista is right in saying you can't make him normal. If you have that as a goal, you're setting him up for misery and yourself for frustration.

It does sound like he might also be suffering from depression, though. It can be a vicious cycle, as depression saps your will to get out, exercise, make changes in your life and these things in turn worsen the depression. Small changes like a little exercise, time outdoors, and better nutrition if there's a deficiency can start things in a more positive direction. Will he leave the house if you go somewhere with him? Would it be possible to take him out on a regular basis so it becomes a habit for him and enlarges his comfort zone a bit? I'm not talking about socializing so much as a change of scenery, sunshine and exercise.