The Rules of the Friendzone

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I've just been thinking about how absurdly complex the rules of being in the friendzone of a female is nowadays. I remember having a really hard time with girls because, apparently, the friendzone had a significantly fewer number of rules in the 1980s than now. For instance, hanging out with a girl you're just friends with seems to be only allowed in the following very specific scenarios: an activity at school or work, events with minimal social interaction (i.e. football games), and that's all I can think about on the top of my head. I wish I knew what the other exceptions are, but I've never observed them firsthand.

When it comes to physical affection, there seems to be an obvious cap on how many hugs you are allowed in the friendzone. The majority of girls I know seem to put their cap at one or two per LIFETIME. They mainly come before it's time to say goodbye forever. Apparently, this restriction isn't lifted on my birthday or when I'm grieving the death of a loved one. I wish I knew the other scenarios when I'm allowed a hug in the friendzone, but I've never encountered a scenario when a girl initiates a hug with me or says yes when I ask for a hug.

There are other notable restrictions dealing with gift giving, phone calls, and lots of other stuff too. It would probably take 1000 pages to detail the rules of the friendzone and the exceptions to them. I wish to know if I'm missing something in my observations and when I'm allowed to hang out, hug a girl, give her a gift, call her, or whatever if we're just friends. I just feel jealous that the 1980s still had restrictions, but they weren't as ridiculously strict as now.

So according to you the "hookup culture" of the present day is total BS?

I never heard the term "friendzone" until I came on this site.

This reminds me of high school, really, all these "restrictions." A friend could go anywhere with a friend of the opposite sex (common sense dictates, though, that you don't go to a nudie bar with a girl!)

The rule is the same as with any friends--whether male or female. You don't try to have sex with your male friend, right? Same thing with a girl/woman who is your friend.

It really depends upon the CULTURE of the person. If one is of southern European descent (Italian), they are usually more physically demonstrative than people of northern European descent (English, Scandinavian). As far as African-Americans are concerned, it varies, frankly. You have to watch how they interact with other people. West Indian people tend to like hugs better than their non West Indian counterparts; they're old-fashioned, in the sense that they have faith that men and women will "behave" properly. There usually is more "social control" in West Indian countries than there is in "first-world" countries.

The hookup culture is pretty exclusive to ridiculously attractive people. As to the idea that friends of the opposite sex can hang out anywhere, that doesn't seem to be the case where I live. I tried the "invite a girl to eat at the local bar/burger joint while inviting a guy to prove it's not a date" tactic and that never works. If the reason girls never hang out with me is not because of the friendzone, what else could it be? They say really nice things to me, just refuse to hang out with me. Also, looking at my friends, male and female, on facebook, I notice that their hangouts are EXCLUSIVELY sausage fests and clam bakes. I'm wondering if guys can hang out with girls in the friendzone, why have I never seen such a phenomenon with my own eyes?

As I mentioned, hanging out in the friendzone was common in the Reagan era, but this is 2014. Those born in the early 1990s seem to live under the current rules of the friendzone. If I still can hang out with girls in the friendzone, why does it never happen with me or anybody else I know my age for the matter?

I am 15, so I can't really comment on how the rules have changed since the 80s or any other decade. But here are the rules I go by with guys who are just friends:

We have appropriate conversations, no sexual jokes or references. I only hang out with them occasionally, so it isn't like we are in a relationship. I usually go to food places, the mall or other local 'teen' hangouts. Sometimes I have another friend with me when we hang out. Non-sexual physical contact(high fives, pat on the back, handshake, occasional hugging etc...) No kissing or hand holding. Once someone is in the 'friendzone' they are off-limits for dating to the other person.

I've been thinking about 20 something rules, not necessarily teen rules. I know the rules for hugs and hanging out in the friendzone were somewhat more lax back when I was a teen. It took me 3 years to get my first hug from a girl in college and 4 to have a girl sit by me and hang out with me (at a school-sponsored event). I wish I knew why the rules tighten considerably in college.

There isn't a friendzone.

A girl doesn't "put you in the friendzone". She doesn't want a romantic relationship with you, that's all. But she hasn't done anything to or with you by not wanting that.

The rules for being friends depends on the people who are friends. If you go around trying to write a handbook for yourself you're going to make yourself crazy and come across weird. Cultural norms for physical contact vary place to place, but the question is what your friend is comfortable with. If in doubt, don't. Or ask. If a girl's not hugging you on your birthday, it's because she doesn't want to, not because there's a rule against hugging a friend on his birthday. Or it could be because she senses you're absolutely champing at the bit to "get out of the friendzone" and she doesn't want to encourage or deal with this. I will say that people are far more physical, warm, and friendly with those they don't sense are a threat in some fashion, or a bit creepy.

Let me put it this way: if a guy came at me insistently wanting to know "is it okay if I hug you in this situation? in that?" I'd be so crept out by his fixation on when he was allowed to hug me (or give gifts, or whatever) that the answer would be "never".

I have no friendzone, have never had one, don't even know what one is like. No guys have been "friendzoned" by me.

freindzone is unequalted love.
guy loves girl, girl doesn't' love guy, guy is now in friendzone.
women get friendzoned too I imagine. to say it doesn't exist is silly.

suppose it would be the best option to just end said friendship, though loving a person makes that hard. seems good enough to at least be close while always secrettly loving them and hoping it might happen. certianly never is easy, but perhaps the first is the best.

I still love her and miss her, but it might be better in the long run that I have lost contact. talking to her was depressing and hurtful at times.

personally I don't hang out with women friends. super akward. women are limited to being my gf or text friends. I hang out with men though that doesn't even happen often. I can attest to the rules for this reason.
I have noticed guys hug randomly without asking, such a thing would be akward for me with a woman as hugging or close contact would cause : erection, horniness, and emotional feelings. plus while I can connect emotional and mentally better with females. I find we have nothing in which to do together in person. aside from movies, but even that apparenlty is challenging. women i've met have different tastes in movies and don't speak up . I pick the wrong ones it seems as she told me months later.

could go deeper but basically friendzone exists, but if you are the person doing the friendzoning you wouldn't know.

....because you aren't actually doing anything. In fact you're specifically not doing something: you're not reciprocating an affection you never asked for in the first place. When you don't buy a product, you haven't put the manufacturer in the "windowshopping zone". You just don't want it.

The problem with the locution is the sense (and the belief too many guys seem to have) that the woman has *done something to* him. And that he's now engaged in a sporting, or unsporting, battle of wills or something with this woman, with the goal being "get out of her friendzone". This turns her into a target, and is altogether kind of nuts and disrespectful. Much more honest, if difficult for these guys to accept: "She's just not interested in me that way."

there is no getting out of the friendzone. therfore there is no the stuff you said.

its just the new term for unequated love. or similar. as most who have unequated love are considered stalkers.

i don't see it as she purposely did something but did somthing she did. she examined you both looks and personalty and decided you are not bf meterial to her. guys do it to. I have meet women who I wouldn't want to date and might be ok being friends. I friendzoned her. I don't see the problem other then it sucks to be the one friendzoned.

you are saying I know you love me, but I don't love you no thanks but we can be friends.

so if a girl rejects a guy and says they can stil be friends how is she not doing anything?

if there is a GF/BF zone then there is a friendzone. what it means depends on the person.

if one of your friend loves you and you don't love him the same way let them free.

don't say well I didn't cause this or do this so its not my fault. why yes you didn't set out for it to happen it happen it exists, you can either deal with it or cut them off. being the person who loves somone and they drag you along is painful. essepcially when they give you ideas of it might happen.

if the person never tells you about the feelings then its not on you. they have to deal with it. I will never again be friends with women I feel in love with.

Okay, so there is no universal rule of what you can and can't do if your just friends (supposedly). The fact that all ten of the female friends I've had throughout my lifetime don't hang out with me and only hug me before we part ways forever is pure coincidence. For that matter, why is it that all my male friends only hang out with other male friends and their attempts to hang out with their female friends fails just as much as me? If it's a coincidence, it's sure a freaky coincidence.

It isn't a coincidence. It's just that the girls want to make it clear that "just friends" is all the relationship will ever be. They don't want to do anything that could be interpreted as "more" than a friend. If they hugged you at random intervals, you might get the wrong impression that they wanted to be more than just friends. If they only hug when saying goodbye, then it is clear that it is a goodbye hug and not a "let's date" hug.

You say that the 80's (my time) had fewer "rules of the friendzone" than there are now. If this is true, it's because there was no such thing as "friendzone". There was dating, there was opposite sex friends hanging out, there was unrequited love. But there was no cultural concept of "friendzone" and thus no attempt to "get out of the friendzone". It's those two concepts which have caused this increased policing of the boundaries. Unrequited love is a very old concept. Male and female friends is a much newer concept but it existed in my parents' lifetime. But this idea that there is a "friendzone" that you can "get out of" apparently happened after I got married. I pity young women who have to police their boundaries far more fiercely than I did in the 80's.

I first thought it was just the new term for unrequited love. But the more I hear about it, the less that seems so. It's unrequited, sure. That I agree with. But what seems new is this idea that there is a "zone" that a person can move in or out of depending on their actions.

Back in my time (and earlier, according to my Mom) unrequited love was a common and unavoidable side effect of male and female socialising together. You wanted somebody. They didn't want you. Or vice versa. End of story. But now there seems to be this idea that if you don't do things just right, you will get "friendzoned" which is somewhat different than being rejected because they aren't attracted. It gets framed as a game where you get placed inside or outside a zone depending on how well you have mastered a set of rules. There is the idea that a certain person would be dating you if only you had "played" differently. With unrequited love, they simply rejected you because they aren't interested. And you pined until you didn't. But there was no idea that you didn't follow a set of rules properly.

Maybe it's the influence of video games. In my day, they were a novelty- found in an arcade and played for quarters or found in very primitive form (compared to now) in somebody's living room attached to the TV. But they weren't a cultural force. So the idea of points and levels and finally getting the prize just didn't exist in it's modern form. There were games. But basketball (outside) and Monopoly (inside)- or any of the other field or board games- just didn't frame things that way.

The specific thing that is different between the 80s and now is that like you said, guys and girls hung out in the 80s. Nowdays, hangouts are exclusively male or female. My male friends' video game get-togethers or eating outs are always exclusively male and any females we invite refuse to come. Conversely, judging by my female friends' facebook photos, their hangouts are exclusively female. I've rarely experience a mixed-gender hangout directly or heard of one secondhand. The question is, why are mixed-gendered hangouts an endangered species? Is it because my female friends incorrectly believe I'm trying to date them even though I invite my male friends to a potential get-together to prove it isn't a date?