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vermontsavant
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12 Dec 2014, 2:14 am

androbot01 wrote:
I think we will continue to be viewed as needing to modify ourselves to fit into society. Why would people spend time trying to understand and relate to us when autistic people probably won't exist in a hundred years. We're an endangered species and unless we can somehow prove that autism gives us special value, no one's going to want to bother preserving us.

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why would you think autism wont be around in a hundred years,it may mutate and change but likely wont change


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androbot01
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12 Dec 2014, 9:05 am

vermontsavant wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
We're an endangered species and unless we can somehow prove that autism gives us special value, no one's going to want to bother preserving us.
why would you think autism wont be around in a hundred years,it may mutate and change but likely wont change


link

^this is a link to the WP discussion of #MSSNG a new initiative launched jointly by google and Autism Speaks. They hope to find the gene causing autism and probably will. I think this will lead to people abort offspring with the gene.



kraftiekortie
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12 Dec 2014, 9:12 am

I believe it will be found that there is no one "autism gene."

Even if there is such a gene, it would be ridiculous to abort an autistic person, owing to the fact that the "autistic viewpoint" has lead to many inventions which "NT's" would never have thought of. We, quite possibly, would not be in the midst of this "computer revolution" without the essential assistance of the "autistic viewpoint."

We would become more stagnant as to technological innovations if we were to abort every autistic person.



androbot01
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12 Dec 2014, 10:16 am

NPR link

Quote:
...researchers at more than 50 laboratories said they had identified more than 100 genes that are mutated in children with autism, dozens more than were known before...

These are mutations that crop up spontaneously, not ones that parents pass down to their children. At least 30 percent of autism cases are caused by these spontaneous mutations, according to researchers at Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory.


I didn't know genes could spontaneously mutate.

But science is on the hunt and they will figure it out. Whether autism is to be preserved as a legitimate way of being or something that is to be cured will soon, I think, no longer be a theoretical question.



kraftiekortie
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12 Dec 2014, 10:21 am

I think, when all is said and done, that there will be "autisms," rather than just one "autism."

This fits in with the concept of a "Spectrum." This fits in with the term "autism spectrum disorders."



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12 Dec 2014, 10:53 am

I think that if they could find a single such gene anytime soon all degrees of autism will be ruthlessly stamped out by abortion, It would be a typical NT approach(kill the deviants when they are yet unable to protest.).

Even if it were a combination of genes I think that they would do it.

Curiously it could be a spontaneous recurring mutation much as haemophilia is. So it could persist until babies are genetically engineered. (see the movie Gattaca trailer at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZppWok6SX88)

I believe that the autism gene/genes persist because they impart an advantage much as the sickle cell gene persists because in spite of the harm it does imparts a resistance to malaria.

Politics alone should be an adequate demonstration that humans are not wise enough yet to decide what is good or bad for humans let alone the whole human race.


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kraftiekortie
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12 Dec 2014, 11:11 am

I don't think they'll ever be a point where they could delineate a single gene, or even a few genes. Autism is just too complex.



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12 Dec 2014, 11:33 am

These are some accommodations I would like to see from NT society. I don't think I'm asking a lot, considering that at least 1 in every 65 people is on the spectrum.

1 I'd like people to have a basic understanding of what autism is. People are familiar with the word, but there's still a lot of ignorance/misinformation about what it actually means. Which is worse, in a way, than not knowing about it at all.
2 I'd like NTs to be polite. If they don't want to befriend people with ASD, that's fine. But be civil.
3 I'd like for people with ASD not to be excluded from activities/clubs/jobs based solely on their diagnosis. No discrimination, in other words.

So that's it. Don't discriminate, be polite, and have a clue. Doesn't that seem reasonable?



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12 Dec 2014, 11:47 am

It certainly does sound reasonable--what you are saying.

Many NT's do become friends with autistic people, it should be remembered.

We should also be assertive, yet not aggressive, when educating people about autism. We should try not to be angry at ignorance--but, instead, attract the "ignorant" using honey rather than vinegar.



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12 Dec 2014, 11:52 am

They've already confirmed links to 27 different genes. There are almost 100 genes that they believe also are linked to autism.
That level of genetic change can't be explained by a single mutation, but by evolution (which is driven by mutations and natural selection.) The existence of Autism means that it's been around for tens of thousands of years at least and that it hasn't been naturally selected out.


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vermontsavant
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12 Dec 2014, 6:02 pm

androbot01 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
We're an endangered species and unless we can somehow prove that autism gives us special value, no one's going to want to bother preserving us.
why would you think autism wont be around in a hundred years,it may mutate and change but likely wont change


link

^this is a link to the WP discussion of #MSSNG a new initiative launched jointly by google and Autism Speaks. They hope to find the gene causing autism and probably will. I think this will lead to people abort offspring with the gene.
those #mssg or as they say not missing is all over twitter.matter of fact I will be checking my twitter account in a minute and there will be about 50 #notmssng hash tag tweets


I have no clue what it means


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12 Dec 2014, 6:30 pm

androbot01 wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
We're an endangered species and unless we can somehow prove that autism gives us special value, no one's going to want to bother preserving us.
why would you think autism wont be around in a hundred years,it may mutate and change but likely wont change


link

^this is a link to the WP discussion of #MSSNG a new initiative launched jointly by google and Autism Speaks. They hope to find the gene causing autism and probably will. I think this will lead to people abort offspring with the gene.


I doubt they'll be able to narrow it down to a single gene...or even a single group of them, perhaps genes that point to it being more likely to be on the spectrum. Even so not sure all would be parents to abortion, that is a pretty difficult choice from what I understand and not so sure a pregnant woman is going to be that quick to just be 'oh it might be defective...abort' people like that probably should not be having children in the first place in my opinion.


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08 Feb 2015, 3:38 pm

I strongly support the notion that Autism is just a normal part of human diversity.

Scientists increasingly share that position.



Interesting scientific publication on Autism and neurodiversity :
Autism as a Natural Human Variation: Reflections on the Claims of the Neurodiversity Movement

Quote:
Conclusion

Some autism inside the narrow conception of neurodiversity can be seen as a natural variation
on par with for example homosexuality. (Lower-functioning autism is also part of natural
variation but may rightly be viewed as a disability.) Just as homosexuals in a homo-phobic
society, the conditions in which autists have to live in an autism-incompatible or even autism-
phobic society are unreasonable. Therefore, it is not fair to place the locus of the problem
solely on the autistic individual. What also is needed is a discourse about the detrimental
effects of an autism-incompatible and autism-phobic society on the well-being of autists.
Therefore, in the case of high-functioning autists, society should not stigmatize these persons
as being disabled, or as having a disorder or use some other deficit-based language to refer to
these people. It is much less morally problematic to refer to the particular vulnerability of
these autists. Also, group-specific rights for autists are needed to ensure that the autistic
culture is treated with genuine equality.
It is our conclusion that it is wrong to subsume all persons with Asperger’s
Syndrome and high-functioning autists into the wide diagnostic category of Autistic Disorder
(Autism Spectrum Disorder), as the work group of the American Psychiatric Association for
the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-V (DSM-V) proposes. Some of
these persons are not benefited with such a psychiatric defect-based diagnosis. In fact, some
of them are being harmed by it, because of the disrespect the diagnosis displays for their
natural way of being, which is of course contradictory to the Hippocratic principle of ‘primum
non nocere’. However, we think that it is still reasonable to include other categories of autism
in the psychiatric diagnostics. The narrow conception of the neurodiversity claim should be
accepted but the broader claim should not.


Interesting scientific publication on Autism and neurodiversity :
The Cerebral Subject and the Challenge of Neurodiversity

Quote:
Abstract
The neurodiversity movement has so far been dominated by autistic people who believe their
condition is not a disease to be treated and, if possible, cured, but rather a human specificity (like
sex or race) that must be equally respected. Autistic self-advocates largely oppose groups of parents
of autistic children and professionals searching for a cure for autism. This article discusses the positions
of the pro-cure and anti-cure groups. It also addresses the emergence of autistic cultures and
various issues concerning autistic identities. It shows how identity issues are frequently linked to
a ‘neurological self-awareness’ and a rejection of psychological interpretations. It argues that
the preference for cerebral explanations cannot be reduced to an aversion to psychoanalysis
or psychological culture. Instead, such preference must be understood within the context of the diffusion
of neuroscientific claims beyond the laboratory and their penetration in different domains of
life in contemporary biomedicalized societies. Within this framework, neuroscientific theories, practices,
technologies and therapies are influencing the ways we think about ourselves and relate to
others, favoring forms of neurological or cerebral subjectivation. The article shows how neuroscientific
claims are taken up in the formation of identities, as well as social and community networks.



emax10000
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08 Feb 2015, 7:06 pm

BuyerBeware wrote:
I don't want the world to change to accommodate me in the absence of any attempt on my part to adapt.

I'd just like it to meet me halfway.

I'd like to be able to wear a set of noise-cancelling headphones to an assembly at my kids' school, or come in with my brood at the last minute and sit down on the floor in back, without being automatically tagged as a freak that must be watched.

I'd like to not be followed by security as I make my way through WalMart muttering to myself about what I need to do next in order to successfully complete the activity known as "shopping at WalMart."

I'd like to not be labelled a crackhead because I rub the end of my nose while listening/thinking...

...and I'd like to not be thankful that they thought "crackhead" before they thought "ret*d."

I'd like to be able to say, "I'm a high-functioning autistic, and I just got more than a little overwhelmed back there. I'll be OK in ten or fifteen minutes. Thanks for asking" as I'm leaning against my car smoking a cigarette with silent tears running down my face. Instead of having to jump in my car and race home, where I can cry without having the police get involved (and feel bad, once again, about the fact that my ret*d ass is still not dead yet).

I don't want a free SSDI check and a total pass.

I just want "autism" to not mean "freak who absolutely cannot cope with anything ever and is going to be the next Adam Lanza."

This pretty much sums up my opinion perfectly.

I mean, it is unfortunate that there is a new phenomenon of often self diagnosed Aspies and Autistics who interpret Non NT pride as demanding that the rest of their community walk on eggshells around them and give them a pass even when they are going out of their way to be cruel and hostile. I am sure the near unanimous consensus around here is that those of us who are severely struggling with this do NOT ever want to be lumped in with them.

That said, we will always have to walk the line between advocating for ourselves and not using it as a crutch. For those of us who are doing everything in their power to be normal, I hardly see the harm in advocating fro our rights the same way other minorities do.

We accept the fact that GLBTQs, women, ethnic minorities and others cannot simply change on a whim to fit in. Many of us who tried simply forcing ourselves to be normal and pretending nothing was fundamentally problematic found it ended in at best major challenges and complete disaster at worst.



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10 Feb 2015, 10:24 am

Quote:
I'd like to not be followed by security as I make my way through WalMart muttering to myself about what I need to do next in order to successfully complete the activity known as "shopping at WalMart."


AMEN.
I was at Toys-R-Us the other day, and this associate came whipping around a corner to ask if she could "help me". The way she came at me, it was clear she'd been sent over and wasn't just wandering by. Someone in a security room had obviously been watching me and decided I was a crook. F*&% you, Toys-R-Us. :lol:



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10 Feb 2015, 2:51 pm

emax10000 wrote:
BuyerBeware wrote:
I don't want the world to change to accommodate me in the absence of any attempt on my part to adapt.

I'd just like it to meet me halfway.

I'd like to be able to wear a set of noise-cancelling headphones to an assembly at my kids' school, or come in with my brood at the last minute and sit down on the floor in back, without being automatically tagged as a freak that must be watched.

I'd like to not be followed by security as I make my way through WalMart muttering to myself about what I need to do next in order to successfully complete the activity known as "shopping at WalMart."

I'd like to not be labelled a crackhead because I rub the end of my nose while listening/thinking...

...and I'd like to not be thankful that they thought "crackhead" before they thought "ret*d."

I'd like to be able to say, "I'm a high-functioning autistic, and I just got more than a little overwhelmed back there. I'll be OK in ten or fifteen minutes. Thanks for asking" as I'm leaning against my car smoking a cigarette with silent tears running down my face. Instead of having to jump in my car and race home, where I can cry without having the police get involved (and feel bad, once again, about the fact that my ret*d ass is still not dead yet).

I don't want a free SSDI check and a total pass.

I just want "autism" to not mean "freak who absolutely cannot cope with anything ever and is going to be the next Adam Lanza."

This pretty much sums up my opinion perfectly.

I mean, it is unfortunate that there is a new phenomenon of often self diagnosed Aspies and Autistics who interpret Non NT pride as demanding that the rest of their community walk on eggshells around them and give them a pass even when they are going out of their way to be cruel and hostile. I am sure the near unanimous consensus around here is that those of us who are severely struggling with this do NOT ever want to be lumped in with them.

That said, we will always have to walk the line between advocating for ourselves and not using it as a crutch. For those of us who are doing everything in their power to be normal, I hardly see the harm in advocating fro our rights the same way other minorities do.

We accept the fact that GLBTQs, women, ethnic minorities and others cannot simply change on a whim to fit in. Many of us who tried simply forcing ourselves to be normal and pretending nothing was fundamentally problematic found it ended in at best major challenges and complete disaster at worst.


I don't do everything in my power to be normal....but I still think advocacy is important, does that mean it does harm if I advocate for rights/accommodations for autistics because I am not doing everything in my power to fit in?


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