Can Aspies actually have clinical Social Anxiety?

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I am very sceptical as to whether someone on the autism spectrum can truly have a clinical social anxiety disorder.
Yes, both can lead to Avoidant Personality and reclusiveness, but logically it doesn't make sense that Aspies could actually have the capacity to have SAD.

Looking at the very symptoms of SAD, sufferers will go to great lengths to avoid being judged by others, which they look for by examining the tone of the other person's voice or their facial expressions/body language.
Given that the ability to understand social behaviour & non-verbal language is already defective in ASD (one of the key hallmarks), I find it difficult to believe someone on the spectrum would be able to develop such a disorder.

As one source put it:
''People with Asperger's might appear tactless and rude, be unable to take hints or understand humor, stand too close or talk too loud. They also have trouble understanding the meaning of gestures, tone of voice and facial expressions.

These characteristics are opposite of those displayed by the socially anxious; if you suffer with SAD your fear of embarrassment or humiliation most likely manifests in standing too far, talking too softly or being overly sensitive to the body language of others.''

Social anxiety can manifest itself as instinctive fear. If an Aspie has been teased and bullied in the past they are likely to experience social anxiety. I would assume that they can have clinical SAD because of this.

Though I am not diagnosed with SAD, I experience abnormal social anxiety, and I don't consciously worry about being judged, I just feel a permanence of worry, as if my inhibitions control me. I can't act naturally because my brain has experienced pain at the hands of others.

I can attempt to think it over logically, but my brain's intuitive response cannot be erased without exposure of my trueself, something which I have not yet achieved.

Last edited by Norny on 17 Dec 2014, 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

I think that's more a direct fear of getting hurt. Very different.

A. A persistent fear of one or more social or performance situations in which the person is exposed to unfamiliar people or to possible scrutiny by others. The individual fears that he or she will act in a way (or show anxiety symptoms) that will be embarrassing and humiliating.

B. Exposure to the feared situation almost invariably provokes anxiety, which may take the form of a situationally bound or situationally pre-disposed Panic Attack.

C. The person recognizes that this fear is unreasonable or excessive.

D. The feared situations are avoided or else are endured with intense anxiety and distress.

E. The avoidance, anxious anticipation, or distress in the feared social or performance situation(s) interferes significantly with the person's normal routine, occupational (academic) functioning, or social activities or relationships, or there is marked distress about having the phobia.

F. The fear, anxiety, or avoidance is persistent, typically lasting 6 or more months.

G. The fear or avoidance is not due to direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., drugs, medications) or a general medical condition not better accounted for by another mental disorder...

Arguably, the fear may be reasonable in the case of lacking social skills. But could be excessive in that they fear they will be rejected/struggle/teased by all others they encounter. Thus, there is no part of the diagnostic criteria that all people with ASD couldn't meet. Being able to correctly identify other's emotions isn't requirement (and indeed, people with SAD often mistakenly view other's behaviour as overly negative towards them).

Yes it is possible...

I have general anxiety disorder.

I have GAD, SAD and ASD, diagnosed by a psychiatrist.

Autistic people may not be as good as using the tools of socialization, like recognition of expressions and gestures, but that doesn't mean some of us don't try (and fail.)

Sorry. But I still find it hard to believe.

Don't know that I have clinical social anxiety per say, but I do have a lot of anxiety related to social situations and do worry about being judged. The trouble understanding body language just ends up making it more difficult because i might mis-perceive someone as being bothered/irritated with me and be worried about it when I just misunderstood. Or might say the wrong thing or get defensive due to that initial misunderstanding which then can piss people off just like I was afraid of.

Yes, they can.

Whole article here: http://www.asperger-training.com/autistic-spectrum-conditions-anxiety-disorders/

You seem to be making the assumption that people with Asperger's don't care about what others think of them, when that's really not true at all. Most do care. In fact most Aspies seem to want friends just as much as NTs do; it's just they don't have the social skills to make or keep many friends.

I probably had SAD when I was younger. I perhaps still do, but interact with people so little these days it doesn't get much opportunity to express itself. However, recently there have been a few times when I've beaten myself up mentally over social gaffes.

It seems some psychiatrists are actually too quick to diagnose ASD in place of SAD.

http://www.bmj.com/rapid-response/2011/ ... s-syndrome

No bias there then.

That's an 11-year-old reply to an equally old article about social anxiety disorder.

I suspect there are many more psychiatrists who diagnose SAD/GAD instead of ASD than vice versa.

It seems to me that the trend is towards less diagnosis of ASD's, owing to perceived over-diagnosis.

My fear or avoidance of social things is better accounted for by my autistic spectrum disorder, as far as I can tell. I don't suppose it's impossible to have both things going on in the same person, but I think it might say more about the imperfections of diagnostic pigeon-holes than the client.

I have anxiety sometimes, most of which comes from me having to do things I don't want to do. This often involves me interacting with people in ways I don't wish to. I don't really care what people think of me, but I do hate screwing up and social interaction in itself is stressful and tiring. I don't like doing things I'm not good at. I've always been completely fine with what people often consider stressful, but awful with what people consider ordinary. I've never had a meltdown or a panic attack from social interaction. With things like small talk, I get that people do it, but I don't get why they do it, and why they get so wound up about the bigger issues.

Of course autism can lead to social anxiety. If you get punished for doing something wrong and you fail to understand what you did wrong was then you body goes into the flight or fight response telling you to get out of your situation. Thus, your body will get use to this situation and it grow itno full social anxiety.