How long before you ask a girl out?

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My question applies primarily to online dating but also to meatspace. How do I know when a girl is ready to be asked out? I wanted to forget about the girl I was dating a few months ago so I went on OKCupid. Last night I was chatting to this girl. I worried if I didn't ask her out she would think I was a cold fish or a shy guy. I asked her out. She lol'd at me and said no thanks.

Fast forward to this morning. I'm chatting to this other girl. The girl from last night was a normal, average girl but the girl from this morning is a bombshell. She has amazingly good looks and she's very smart (and yet she says her profile that she's defective, I don't understand how someone so near to perfect can think they're defective)... anyway, when she comes online again she may start chatting with me again so my question is, how do I know when it's a good time to ask them out?

(Also how can I help ensure that I get to that point?)

Via online dating, that's easy! Step 1: If by chatting you mean using the site's IM feature, stop doing that. I don't think any good will come of it!

Step 2: I usually ask after exchanging ~4 "good" messages. By good, I mean messages that are at least 1-2 solid paragraphs and tell you something about who the other person is. I have a handful of questions that I try to ask before meeting to get a feel for what they're like and whether we'd be compatible. Once I reach that point, it's almost a guaranteed "yes", although there have been a few times where that's not the case.

Step 3: Read between the lines and make sure that you actually want to meet this person. You can tell A LOT about a person based on their profile and what they say in their messages...I'm hardly ever surprised when meeting someone in person.

I agree that there are ways I'd rather communicate with a girl than through IM. That's why I thought I'd try to move the exchange into meatspace as soon as possible (and yet I've busy for the next few evenings, so maybe that was a bad time to be browsing OKCupid). Apparently it was too soon for the first girl, so that's why I asked, how long should I wait before I ask a girl out.Would you tell me what your questions are?

What I meant by that was to send messages, rather than to IM. I think that women are more apt to respond, and it's easier to get to know someone that way. I see IM as being somewhat like texting...useful for short and quick communication, but terrible for having an actual in-depth conversation or getting to know someone.




Depends on the person, but nothing too special. How many siblings they have, where they're originally from, what they do for a living, what their hobbies are...that sort of thing. It's often less about their response, and more about how they respond.

Oh. I thought they were the same thing. I thought IM was just shorthand for message.I think I get it. How many siblings they have is a good get-to-know-them question but I don't judge their datability based on that criteria. What their hobbies are is a good question except that's usually listed in their profile. What they do for a living is a good question except that's usually listed in their profile. About half of the girls I talk to are university student. Their field of study is usually listed in their profile. A question about their job, field of study or more frequently their hobbies is often a good opener for me.

I wouldn't use these questions to determine if I want to date them. If I'm in contact with them I've already determined I want to date them (particularly this one girl I've been speaking with lately, she's perfect). What I'm trying to figure out is not whether or not I want to date them but whether or not they want to date me.

For some girls the fact that they're speaking with me at all is a good sign. Other girls wouldn't go out with me straight away, even if they've already decided to speak with me. Maybe it's not that they've made up their mind to dislike me but rather that they haven't yet made up their mind about me. Or maybe that's just wishful thinking and they make up their mind about me within the first few moments. Are first impressions everything?

So I've been talking to this perfect girl and this average girl and it's like a question of risk vs reward. The average girl is more keen on me. The perfect girl seems only somewhat keen on me. Not that she dislikes me but but her profile says she's "Looking for new friends" but the average girl says on her profile she's "ready for a relationship". I'm not sure if that means it will be harder to get into a relationship with the perfect girl. I'm not sure if she means it literally when she says she's looking for new friends.

IDK. I feel like in some ways it would be harder to be with the perfect girl. I would get distracted by how gorgeous she is. Like I would feel she's out of my league. I was looking over my chats with both of them and the perfect girl writes in a very intelligent way. The average girl writes in a dull way. If I was with a girl of mediocre intelligence I could impress her easily but I would be bored. If I was with a girl as smart as the perfect girl I would worry I'm not as smart as her.

I mean if I said something stupid in front of the perfect girl I'd feel paranoid about it because she's really smart. If I said something stupid instead of the average girl she'd either not notice or if she did notice I wouldn't care because she's not that smart anyway, therefor I would not feel she's in a position to judge me. Even though the perfect girl seems a little scarier, if I could get with her it would be a boon to me if I could be admired by one so admirable.

It's just a problem of risk vs reward. The perfect girl would be better for me but the average girl seems to be more in to me. It may take me longer to get a date with the perfect girl but that length of time may be too slow for the average girl. If I wait to long I the average girl might lose interest and then I find out the perfect girl never wanted to date me. If I date the average girl too soon then I might end up with her and not the perfect girl when the perfect girl may potentially have been willing to date me.

It's like the prisoner's dilemma in game theory

I would just go for the average girl, from what you've said anyway. Not just sit around stalling because some 10/10 girl who looks like there only after friends might go on a date, which there profile doesn't say they want.

Either ask the perfect now and if nothing happens then ask the average girl, at the end of the day if she is this perfect girl, trust me your not the only guy who's messaging her.

If the average one seems dull from what they write that doesn't mean it's the case in person. But if you dont want to be with a dull person then remove her from the equation dont just have her as a backup.

I would only ask if I knew they felt the same way back.

Yeah, the perfect girl has stopped responding. I guess she wasn't into me. Funny how in own mind she's not perfect. On her profile she says she's defective and her nose is too big. I don't understand how even a really really pretty girl can be conscious about her appearance.You may be right. Both girls are in university so I guess the average girl can't be a total dullard. Though she's only studying to be a teacher. The perfect girl must be smarter since she's studying pharmacy. The reason why the average girl seems dull (aside from her lack of punctuation) is that she doesn't form opinions on things. It bugs me when people are too lazy to have their own opinions. I've seen that sort of thing before. I guess I shouldn't compare her to a girl I dated two years ago. She is a different person after all.

Yeah the opinion thing can get annoying, There's two ways i dont like it. The first is when you dont even get an opinion from some one, and the second is when they ALWAYS copy yours/somebody's opinion.

If your willing to find out i would say still try get a date with her, if you dont like her after then its no matter

Yes but it's hard to know how they feel about me. That's why I started this thread.

Some girls seem to be into me. I can ask them out soon and they agree to go out straight away. This one seems more phlegmatic. Like she talks, she asks about my career but she may not be into me. Her profile says "looking for friends" but also contains hints such as "people say I'm too skinny but no one has seen the real me yet <WINK>" and her profile name is Infatuation. Maybe I should just be bold and ask her out. The worst thing she can do is say no.

No need for the thread to continue after this post really. Solid advice.

It still doesn't explain everything. I don't know which dating site you and Stargazer43 use but for the ones I use have only one type of messaging (IM). I could write paragraphs about my interests and have them do the same but I've already got those paragraphs in my profile (most of the girls I speak to read my profile) and the girls already have paragraphs about their interests written on their profiles.

I already know whether or not I want to date them from having read their profiles. Whether or not I want to stay with them longer then that is something that I can only work out through dating. So for me it's not an issue of which question do I need to ask them to determine I their interests are compatible with mine, but how do I get them to the point where they trust me enough to meet me in person. Many of the women I've spoken too are fearful of meeting guys in public. They don't mean to insult me personally but for them I'm an unknown guy. Even when I point out that it would be in a public place they still don't trust me.

So my issue is to talk to them long enough to get them to the point where they trust me. I need to know not which questions will let me know them but which questions will let me build a social bond with them (questions from me work better than statements because statements don't require a response). The key to building trust and social bonds is talking. Chimps groom each other to build social bonds, we exchange (sometimes useless) information. We make small talk. That's what I need to get better at. I can talk all four legs off an Arcturian Megadonkey but that doesn't mean I can hold a girl's interest.

Too much talk and I bore them. Not enough talk and they don't trust me.

If you are having to point out that you will be meeting in a public place, there is probably already something being said that's not quite right.

I don't know how to advise on what to say because it would have to be your own style essentially, but if you post copies of some of your conversations I could point out some possibly errors or things that might be a turn-off to a woman. That's really the only way I would know how to help accurately.

OK then. The first girl is the one who was afraid to meet, even in public;

What are you doing right now?
I'm at a bar
With friends?
Yea
In the city?
Yup
Do you go there on weeknights too?
No
Which bar is it?
Enigma
Wanna meet me there next Saturday?
Lol no thanks
Have it your way.
Stranger danger
That's fair enough. But it's a public place after all.
Nah I'll pass
Thanks bro
No worries.