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Morgana
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09 Jun 2009, 5:26 pm

outlier wrote:
I think I can sense disrespect acutely now. There are multiple signs I've become aware of. I was never taught such skills growing up, nor anything about relationships (and a host of other life skills).


Yes, you´re right; it´s a shame we don´t learn these things! And we learn a host of other things that we don´t really need in life.


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starlighter
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10 Jun 2009, 8:47 am

outlier wrote:
My mother once told me she was worried I was going to hurt someone I was with! It was during my first encounter, and I was the one being hurt. Utterly clueless. I was the young, naive AS daughter; he was the several years older, experienced stranger!


Curious that my Nt mother also made a commentary or two to me about how difficult I would be ( I was teen by then ) for the guys to handle me or with me when grown up. I don't want to think about that like a disrespectful commentary but maybe cause as mothers they notice something 'different' in their daughters (aspies)
In the other hand my father (aspie), spent part of the time telling me when child not to accept candies from strangers, as a teen be careful with the guys, not letting me date until my eighteen, (opposite) .



MMEvans
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10 Jun 2009, 10:08 am

Morgana wrote:
All of life is a learning process.


I agree!



outlier
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10 Jun 2009, 10:59 am

starlighter wrote:
Curious that my Nt mother also made a commentary or two to me about how difficult I would be ( I was teen by then ) for the guys to handle me or with me when grown up. I don't want to think about that like a disrespectful commentary but maybe cause as mothers they notice something 'different' in their daughters (aspies)


I remember now what prompted my mother to say it. She believed I couldn't have such feelings for others (or care about their feelings.) She made this assumption because I found it impossible to tell her I could care about someone in such a way; i.e., she assumed my external appearance of being indifferent represented my internal state.

My parents tend to willfully ignore my relationships. One counsellor I told accused them of wishing to keep me in a childlike state by not acknowledging such an important milestone of adulthood. I have to admit there seems to be something to it. She said they have me exactly where they want me. If this is correct, I have no idea why it would be so. It is mainly my mother who seems to be this way. She reacted badly when I reached adolescence, as though disgusted by me, and this is when she abandoned me. Actually, one time when I was about 18, she overtly and directly expressed this disgust. We were away at the time and I was casually showing her a piece of more adult clothing I was trying on for fun. She screamed in horror, shouting how disgusting it was. Her reaction scared the heck out of me and I felt ashamed and hid in the bedroom for hours. It was completely unpredictable.

Another inexplicable event occurred in my mid-twenties. One of my brothers became physically abusive and started violently kicking me right before her eyes. I was trapped in my seat so had to just take it. I know she's not afraid of my brothers and usually intervenes when there's a fight. However, this time, she just stared silently and didn't look at me afterwards. I later overheard her on the phone telling someone how bad she'd felt. However, it wasn't a caring sort of expression, more like what you'd say when recalling you saw a disabled stranger getting mugged and didn't care enough to intervene. Her conversation conveyed a kind of squeamish pity. I think that's the right word: squeamish. I make her feel squeamish.



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10 Jun 2009, 12:28 pm

(below) .



Last edited by starlighter on 10 Jun 2009, 12:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

starlighter
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10 Jun 2009, 12:28 pm

(below) .



Last edited by starlighter on 10 Jun 2009, 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

starlighter
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10 Jun 2009, 12:29 pm

Another thing about relationships that puzzles me :

I made a facebook quizz (silly I know) and I'm the kind of sweet girl, that men don't take serious and play with. But there's something true about the quizz. I have experienced that this year. Two guys I met, they seemed to be both players, but first I only fixated in their other non-players side (the child-like, the caring one) and that's what I felt attracted, and kept going on relating with them. Now, I am like left aside somehow(by them), so I would have to be upset or regret almost, but I am not. Is like I know they are not' bad' (but they act like they act for other utterly internal reasons, etc..) and all I could see is someone who needed 'comprenhension', a little love, and I felt I was bornt to give, feel needed (mental, and physically) somehow, and they are not bad, just tormented souls, and I'm also not bad also a tormented soul. Usually Nt would think they would used me (like as*holes do) and I let myself being used like a silly. Because maybe in the end ,after lots of moths or relationship,the three of us would end separate, they would miss me and I would feel alone, but is like we all were playing a 'game' seen from the outside Nt world where we all liked each other but we needed to separate and became 'loners' again, well this time it was more them than me who got scared and left, and become loners like we were before, although I wouldn't like to end like this, cause I learned when to be separate and in company, like switching a button 'On' and 'off', but in this case it was them who were 'scared' maybe for not learning how to swithc On and Off, and just stay all time On or Off, pity ...

I feel like I am some sort of glass of water that I fullfilled myself with content for being emptied (of emotions I mean) for other persons needs, lilke the cow who need to be emptied of its milk, in benefit of both me for being emptied of my milk (too much is too much to handle)and them for drinking it, lol.. so is like they use me but I also use them, and the strange is that uses to happen to me with the ones who are also in the spectrum, (maybe is our way of relating, different than Nt ). ...



Morgana
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10 Jun 2009, 4:46 pm

Wow, outlier, that sounds pretty harsh! I´m sorry you had to go through those experiences.

starlighter: Interesting post! It´s good to hear your perspective.


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Saja
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11 Jun 2009, 3:31 am

Outlier, I have experienced a similar thing with my mother. Not quite as overt as what you describe in the passage about your brother violently kicking you, but my mother decided I was some kind of enemy sometime after I reached adulthood. I don't know exactly when it happened, just that I spent years explaining away some of the cruel things she did with me, because she was quite a wonderful mother when I was growing up. So I kept finding some place to put those behaviors of hers that didn't compute. Until eventually she betrayed me in a way I couldn't explain away, and then, suddenly, all the events of the past ten or more years made sense. Somewhere along the line, she decided she didn't like me, maybe even hated me.

I haven't had any contact with her for four years, since the big blowup event that opened my eyes. I'm okay with that, in the sense that we don't get to pick our parents, she did a good job when I was growing up, and I have a life that just doesn't intersect with hers anymore. But, of course, sometimes I'm incredibly sad about it, and I wonder what I did to "deserve" her hatred. I did nothing, of course; but sometimes I just sink into the sadness of being a little girl whose mommy doesn't love her. Even at 42.


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outlier
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11 Jun 2009, 9:35 am

I reckon my experiences could be more or less within the norm (wrt the frequency of the physical abuse.)

Saja, my mother too did quite a good job earlier in my life. Compared to most I saw, that is.

It can be particularly hard to conclude a parent hates you. The evidence, in my case, points to some kind of dislike. There will be displays of hatred on occasion, but then there will occasionally be displays of love. It's very confusing how someone can express dislike/hatred and completely neglect you for long periods of time, and then one day ask how you are, and say something like how much they love you and how gifted you are.

The relationship factor complicates everything, because my mother never really wants to know and I never really want to discuss it. When someone's squeamish and prudish about me in relation to such things, it makes me feel unclean and reluctant to raise the subject with them.



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11 Jun 2009, 12:45 pm

outlier wrote:
The relationship factor complicates everything, because my mother never really wants to know and I never really want to discuss it. When someone's squeamish and prudish about me in relation to such things, it makes me feel unclean and reluctant to raise the subject with them.

I can understand that. Is she the same way with your sibling(s) regarding relationships?


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outlier
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11 Jun 2009, 1:45 pm

She seems to be similar, but less odd about it. Only one of my brothers has had a relationship, and in many ways she didn't like it. Also, there's always this resistance to outsiders coming into the house, even close relatives. With my brother, there was some squeamishness about the relationship, but nowhere near the level it was with me. I do know that he now conducts his affairs very secretively as a result of her general attitude towards his dates or girlfriend.



Morgana
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11 Jun 2009, 2:09 pm

I was wondering if quite a lot of AS women have had problems with parents, especially mothers; in fact, I was thinking of starting a thread about it at some point. The reason being that it seems to be that quite a few women on Wrong Planet have mentioned stories about difficult family relationships, sometimes abuse, and often some kind of abandonment by a parent or family member. (I would be curious to know how common this is). I guess I´m really quite lucky in that my parents are quite caring. My biggest problems have been just sometimes that I felt they didn´t really "know" me or understand me, or sometimes when I was younger, I didn´t know what they wanted from me and thought they were being unfair. (However, I´m sure these kinds of thoughts are common anyway). All in all, I realize I´ve been lucky.


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millie
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12 Jun 2009, 2:27 pm

^ good idea.
My relationship with my mother now is excellent.
Growing up, it was hell.
I am fairly certain my mother has AS. SHe says of herself, "i have MANY traits."

growing up, it was all about her, her meltdowns, her resentment of us, her violence and her verbal abuses.
But then, she had 8 kids to bring up, on her own, and if she had many traits or an ASD and no friends......well...her life was hard.

Once her kids left home and she actually found a solitary routine to live with, that suited her, she became a different person.


She is not emotionally expressive. SHe is analytical, intellectual and very routined. i like her a lot now. :)



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13 Jun 2009, 2:03 am

Quote:
I was wondering if quite a lot of AS women have had problems with parents, especially mothers


hello again. Morgana I think this ithread needs to be discussed too.
My mum and i had a totally unconstructive relationship from my earliest memories. Its not because we didn't want to. She loved me I loved her, but we couldn't physically/personally be with each other except by indirect ways: she would feed everyone, the dining table was always welcoming and beautifully set, she managed the home so we were all totally comfortable. She was not there for anyone when we wanted to talk or figure social things out. I dissociated my self from her between 4yrs and 9 yrs because of physical abuse. I also went mute...even at school. It was my way of respecting her because i knew she had suffered a lot during DEPression and WWII and on migrating to a new country. Even at her time of death, we couldn't talk to each other, but she left me a wonderfully uplifting image of grace and beauty. When people have eroded my self esteem (workplace/relationships) I recall this image she gave me. I have only images to recall my life with her. .. the picture thinking that ASD does so well.

As a mother I have never been able to teach my chn social skills and things even though[b] i thought i taught myself this or that one quite well!
No, say my kids, I always end up too AS "formal, lecture -like, and off the mark according to them. The anxiety this produces in my daughter and me and our relationship is marked. We keep working on being open with each other . Now its my turn to wait until my chn desire to understand 'the parents' .I am "Not alarmed, just alert" , but slightly frightened.



Bonny
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13 Jun 2009, 2:48 am

oops...sorry for the heavy on Bold... I don't think it's subconscious symbolism...just me in a hurry!!?! :roll: