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| Are you pro-choice? |
| Yes |
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75% |
[ 114 ] |
| No |
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25% |
[ 38 ] |
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| Total Votes : 152 |
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| Author |
Message |
Chibi_Neko
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 24, 2007
Age: 26
Posts: 844
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
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 Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| IdahoRose wrote: | I'm pro-life.
It makes me really sad that Obama is pro-choice, because he's the one I want to vote for due to his plans that could potentially revolutionize the way autistic people live. |
I think both Obama and Clinton are pro-choice.
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Liopleurodon
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jan 17, 2008
Age: 27
Posts: 175
Location: The Tethys Sea
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 11:36 am Post subject: |
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I didn't really feel that either of the options summed up my position, which is more complicated than a yes/no answer. I don't think that I could have an abortion (though since I'm both in a same sex relationship and on contraception for medical reasons, it's not a situation I'm likely to find myself in!). I think that a lot of abortions that happen are wrong. I don't think that most of the women who have abortions are morally justified in having them, but I do absolutely believe that they have a right to choose that outcome.
I think that the entire abortion argument hangs on whether one considers the foetus to be a human person or not - that is pretty much the only issue at stake. If you consider it to be a human person then it's murder. If it's not, then it's no big deal. Other arguments are secondary to this. My gut feeling is that that status comes at some point in pregnancy, but that it's impossible to define - a bit like the difference between a child and an adult. I don't believe that a ball of cells is a human person. Ultimately, the moments which are easiest to define are fertilisation, implantation and birth, but none of these is really satisfactory. At fertilisation it's just a cell, which the body may well decide to expell of its own accord without the woman even noticing. It's not much more than that at implantation. And yet by the time of birth it has clearly been a baby for a while - it's just in a different environment now. I think where I draw the line is probably this: at what point does it start to have a real experience of life? There isn't a straightforward answer to that, which is the issue I have. This is why I personally would prefer to err on the side of caution, and not take the risk of getting it wrong.
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2154
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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| IdahoRose wrote: | I'm pro-life.
It makes me really sad that Obama is pro-choice, because he's the one I want to vote for due to his plans that could potentially revolutionize the way autistic people live. |
I cannot believe how many Americans base their votes on whether or not someone believes people should have the right to decide what happens to their own bodies or not, and throw all other issues and beliefs out the window because of it. They may as well not have any debates or declare their thoughts on anything else - why not just save the time and effort and have them all sit round a table and go "I'm against women having any say in what happens to their body", "I think women should have their own choice, as is only right - after all, if they don't believe in abortion they won't have one", "I really don't care", and then people can watch and vote for the person they like and away you go.
Certainly helps explain how you get the people you get leading...
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Chibi_Neko
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 24, 2007
Age: 26
Posts: 844
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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| LeKiwi wrote: | | IdahoRose wrote: | I'm pro-life.
It makes me really sad that Obama is pro-choice, because he's the one I want to vote for due to his plans that could potentially revolutionize the way autistic people live. |
I cannot believe how many Americans base their votes on whether or not someone believes people should have the right to decide what happens to their own bodies or not, and throw all other issues and beliefs out the window because of it. They may as well not have any debates or declare their thoughts on anything else - why not just save the time and effort and have them all sit round a table and go "I'm against women having any say in what happens to their body", "I think women should have their own choice, as is only right - after all, if they don't believe in abortion they won't have one", "I really don't care", and then people can watch and vote for the person they like and away you go.
Certainly helps explain how you get the people you get leading... |
I agree, a vote should not be based on whether or not someone believes people should have the right to decide what happens to their own bodies or not and then ignore other issues. It's someone elses body, not yours so why are you so concerned? Pro-choice is also the choice to keep it.
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ebec11
Missing In Action: Innocence
Joined: Jan 18, 2008
Posts: 5251
Location: A Bubble in the Ocean
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 12:17 am Post subject: |
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I just wrote a piece about pro life (even though I'm pro choice), and I do get both sides, I just agree with pro choice more. I think everybody who makes a conserval opinion should look at both sides.
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2154
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Well, if you're anti-abortion then you won't have one anyway, so all it comes down to is people pushing their views on the rest of the population and forcing millions to suffer as a result.
I refuse to use the term 'pro-life' as it's simply another example of manipulative language to further an agenda. I think just about everyone in the world is pro-life, but not everyone is anti-abortion.
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M02
Raven
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 103
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:47 am Post subject: |
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my opinion is never going to stop anyone from having an abortion. I am not going to support their children but they CAN get a court order for child support from the father.
The morning after pill is easy to get and I don't know why people don't use it.
Some homeless women get pregnant on purpose because then they know they will be offered better housing options.
Unwanted/unplanned children can be given up for adoption. People only seem to be told that if they do that, the government will take away the other children they have or future children. I don't know if that is true. |
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2154
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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Contraception doesn't always work, no matter how safe you are and how many methods you use. And if you don't know anything's gone wrong, then you aren't going to take the morning after pill, are you?
Sadly I'm speaking from experience here...
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M02
Raven
Joined: Dec 04, 2006
Posts: 103
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 10:15 am Post subject: |
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| I have heard that from a few people. They didn't take their pill at exactly the same time everyday or they were travelling and somehow they didn't get it right with the time zone or just forgot. |
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LeKiwi
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2154
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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Not just that, I have a friend with a daughter now thanks to condoms and fertility monitoring (neither of which failed, so how she came about is a mystery - my friend only found out she was pregnant at 18 weeks, at which point she felt it was too late to abort, even though she wanted to). She loves her daughter, but it was certainly a wake-up call. I also have friends who've had abortions thanks to the pill and condoms, again neither of which failed (no skipping pills, no taking them late, no illness, no travel etc).
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Tori-kun
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Jun 09, 2008
Posts: 48
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| Jainaday wrote: |
I wish, instead of going on about whether abortion should be legal, that we would focus on the more humanitarian measures that would cause it to happen less; improving birth control options, adoption options, and support for parenting. |
I agree with this. abortion wouldn't be an issue if there was more respect towards women. Having an abortion isn't necessarily "punishing the innocent unborn child" but I don't like to see it used as a constant birth control either.
Also, i find it inappropriate when people claim they are "Pro-life" and bomb abortion clinics, killing people inside, thinking it will get their point across. I also find it inapropriate when "Pro-life" people, are too busy trying to save frozen fetuses, and what not for in-vitro fertilization, because they are trying to defend the stem cells "Sacred right to life" when they do nothing to help the children in Uganda, darfur, China, and other places in the world who are starving, forced to become soldiers, or are enslaved in the sex trade. If someone says they are pro-life, why not try to save their lives as well? |
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LKL
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 22, 2007
Age: 32
Posts: 645
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| Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| There's a joke amongst pro-choice circles that "pro-lifers" seem to think that life ends at birth. The senators who vote most consistently for pro-life causes also vote the most consistently against any kind of family-planning help, against any kind of parenting help, and against any kind of child-help, whether it be health care or education. |
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Chibi_Neko
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 24, 2007
Age: 26
Posts: 844
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| LKL wrote: | | There's a joke amongst pro-choice circles that "pro-lifers" seem to think that life ends at birth. |
That relates to my biggest complaint against the pro-lifers, is concern for the fetus seems to end after is it born, they don't care about the conditions that a unwanted baby may have to grow up in.
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poopylungstuffing
Bohemian Cave dweller
Joined: Mar 09, 2007
Age: 33
Posts: 3610
Location: not otherwise specified
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| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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I am pro-choice for many reasons.
As has been pointed out in previous posts, people would go on having abortions whether or not it is legal. The legality of abortions means that there will be less women butchered under unsanitary conditions...Less children brought into negative situations in an already overpopulated world...and so on and so forth.
I had an abortion when I was 16....a very emotionally immature 16.
I am glad I had an abortion.
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DevonB
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Mar 14, 2008
Age: 39
Posts: 198
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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Speaking as a victim of rape, I think that anyone who has not been raped has NO voice in this. What a disgusting and foul concept you have raised. THERAPY? Are you KIDDING?
You're right, the "baby" isn't at fault. However, the idea that ANY of me (genetic or otherwise) has mingled with my rapist's makes me want to vomit. Having to carry that result would undoubtedly be so traumatic that a person may not recover.
Some moron said something about a surrogate mother carrying it...are you of substandard intelligence? Do you even know what a surrogate mother is?
It's my choice whether I want to carry a child or not. Your religious views don't even come to bear. If you are a man, keep out of it. Thousands of children are treated poorly every day. Millions starve to death every year, or die from treatable diseases. You're telling me that the suffering of these children is worth it and okay?
When you solve ALL of these problems, it still is up to a woman to make her own decision. |
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