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techstepgenr8tion
cleveland audio assassin
Joined: Feb 07, 2005
Age: 29
Posts: 5688
Location: That's for me to know and for you to find out.
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 Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 12:39 am Post subject: |
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| Jainaday wrote: | I think "cure" vs. "functioning so well it doesn't matter" is a matter of semantics. . . and I think "AS" vs. "having the symptoms of AS, which many things besides neurological imbalance/difference could cause" is also semantic.
I think it's sad that he thinks AS neccessarily means he's broken, but if he wants to throw himself into being "cured," well, nothing wrong with that. . . only hope he does it wisely. |
I have to agree, just that lets say there is a 'cure' discovered; I think it would fundamentally have to be your second semantic argument "functioning so well it doesn't matter". To funnel all sorts of money into something that breaks someone down, forces them into therapy, causes them to have no idea who they are anymore (probably by necessity screwing with their intelligence) - that's the most impractical route; just because of the amount of rehab, psychotherapy, horrible press, and the fact that in a free market economy it relies on having the best and brightest.
In the end, if something was figured out on how to enable people to have more power over their own brain and nervous system just by free will - that in and of itself would take the lid off of a lot of people and, if it weren't as physical and neurological, there probably would be few if any aspies - just more to add in many if not most cases to the better and brighter half of NT society. Some NT's have synaesthesia, some have tactile hypersensitivity, its just the collection that really define us.
It would only mean freedom, freedom to just have as much grief as the average intelligent NT has - life isn't easy for them quite often either just because, intelligence itself tends to take people outside the box and restrict the things that they would or wouldn't do. I'm not just talking off the cuff, I actually did a lot of things - whether taking nootropics, trying LSD and mushrooms (as well as other things) and really tested my paradigm to really figure out what separated me from other people; can't back that with 100 person double blind with placebo test or anything from the APA but I think they've already stumbled upon enough proof of this in other ways and by their own ends.
Its not that we're abnormal, just in many cases just don't have the physical choice to be. Those who think that would steal the best of them have to remember that as their abilities expanded - they'd still have their same morals, same beliefs, and the only things that would change would be behavior and thought processes just based on new information that may have either been obscured or just processes that they may have been able to pull of with great effort but too much so to make practical use of them.
I'm agreeing though, there's no cure right now and we do have to soldier it. New research is being done into nanotech medicine, while that opens a whole can of worms with security it also, on the flip, could enable scientists to at least figure out what causes the impediments at least and reverse them on the cellular level. If the autistic community was somehow cured, I think Wrongplanet would exist for a long period of time - people cataloging what's happening, the emotional epiphanies, and yeah - we'd be functional but we'd still have a lot of common history that no one else could relate to, almost like war vets.
Sorry, hope I didn't ramble too much there... |
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Fred2670
Velociraptor
Joined: Mar 21, 2008
Posts: 419
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:04 am Post subject: |
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| Pandora wrote: |
Doctors and psychologists have years of university and medical school training, and Degrees and PhD's behind them, so yeah, I guess I'd put my faith in their diagnoses before someone just sitting in front of a computer keyboard. Do you have a medical degree, doctorate or PhD, Fred?
If not, I rest my case. |
People are individuals and ultimately deal with their problems as such. I believe mentally I have more control over my physiology than a whole host of doctors or therapists with their crackpot schemes and experimental medications. I am the way I am because I decide exactly that. I dont need to enlist the help of some "give me some money and I'll tell you whats wrong with you" type BMW driving, golf tee chewin, psuedo intellectual conformist who cant remember my name and would rather prescribe me the newest brand name pharmaceutical than ever cure me. To hell with that. Im better already.
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Pandora
Cat Lady
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Tell me you are 'cured' after your next meltdown in a shopping mall when the noise gets too loud, or when you have difficulty dealing with someone on the phone or when you can't get someone to understand your point of view. Then I might believe it. Sure, you are coping with your 'disability', but cured? It would be like trying to reach the moon in a paper plane.
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Fred2670
Velociraptor
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:57 am Post subject: |
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your brand of "reality" is something
I call "hopelessness", and that (in my
opinion) is something far worse than
any AS condition
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Pandora
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:05 am Post subject: |
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I would say that refusing to accept reality in the fact that a condition you are born with that cannot be cured is a sign of delusion. I have accepted the fact that I'm Aspie, why don't you accept the same? Or do you think that being so called NT is better and above the rest? I don't believe there should be any distinction, but you seem to like to draw the line in the sand.
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Break out you Western girls,
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Fred2670
Velociraptor
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:22 am Post subject: |
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This has nothing to do with labels or choosing a new identity, and everything to do with triumphant victory over a condition that will no longer complicate my life or hold me back. I am the same person, just one with greater confidence and the conviction necessary to maintain it. I have gained a better understanding of self, which allows me the stability to accomplish anything in life.
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Pandora
Cat Lady
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:26 am Post subject: |
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So does that mean I don't have to expect any more hysterical replies from you to any of my comments? If so, I will believe you've overcome any limitations imposed by AS.
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Break out you Western girls,
Hold your heads up high.
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Fred2670
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:02 am Post subject: |
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who knows
is there a tip in it for me?
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Pandora
Cat Lady
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:24 am Post subject: |
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Here's a tip - Don't expect things that are unattainable, and live with what you have, for life is short and death is but an eternity.
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Break out you Western girls,
Someday soon you're gonna rule the world.
Break out you Western girls,
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greenblue
¸.·´´¯`··.¸.·´
Joined: Mar 26, 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Fred2670 wrote: | | .....psuedo intellectual conformist who cant remember my name and would rather prescribe me the newest brand name pharmaceutical than ever cure me. To hell with that. Im better already. |
| Quote: | | I am the same person, just one with greater confidence and the conviction necessary to maintain it. I have gained a better understanding of self, which allows me the stability to accomplish anything in life. |
Well, from what I can see here is that that might have worked for YOU, or at least you think so, which it wouldn't mean you are actually cured, I assume you are diagnosed, right? well, some things and coping mechanisms depend on the level of AS, there are different levels of severity on AS you know, so we have to be careful here, just because something appears to have worked for you, it doesn't mean it will for other aspies, that is a common fallacy I have noticed lots of people do, there are different type of impediments for different people, so it would be entirely incorrect if you expect every aspie to deal with their own issues the same way you do and expect them to do.
Also, you did not provide an explanation to Pandora's point about Sensory issues, how can you be cured about that with just self determinism, without professional help?
| Quote: | | "give me some money and I'll tell you whats wrong with you" |
Hmm, I wonder if that is a valid reason for not going to see a psychiatrist, no matter what the problem is and how severe it is, especially when it becomes seriously threatening.
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Pandora
Cat Lady
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:30 am Post subject: |
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On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being the highest level of severity, I would say sensory issues is about are 6-7 for me. Social issues are probably around 5-6. In other areas, I can probably function close to or even better in a few areas than most NTs. If there were a cure for the sensory issues, I would be tempted if it were within my financial means, because that's the downside I find in having AS.
But even after that, I would be still AS and that would be fine with me. The social issues would improve if the sensory issues were less because I wouldn't be so likely to avoid places that are likely to be noisy and crowded.
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Break out you Western girls,
Someday soon you're gonna rule the world.
Break out you Western girls,
Hold your heads up high.
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Last edited by Pandora on Thu Jun 12, 2008 5:42 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Jainaday
in uncertain taste
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| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:48 am Post subject: |
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| greenblue wrote: |
| Quote: | | "give me some money and I'll tell you whats wrong with you" |
Hmm, I wonder if that is a valid reason for not going to see a psychiatrist, no matter what the problem is and how severe it is, especially when it becomes seriously threatening. |
Also, don't forget that's how MD's work too.  |
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makuranososhi
Purple Monkey Dishwasher
Joined: May 13, 2008
Posts: 2261
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| Jainaday wrote: | | greenblue wrote: |
| Quote: | | "give me some money and I'll tell you whats wrong with you" |
Hmm, I wonder if that is a valid reason for not going to see a psychiatrist, no matter what the problem is and how severe it is, especially when it becomes seriously threatening. |
Also, don't forget that's how MD's work too. |
Lawyers as well; one generally sees a lawyer about their need for a lawyer, which is simply an invitation for abuse.
M.
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slowmutant
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Age: 29
Posts: 8734
Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| That's why it's always best to represent yourself in court. |
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Vexcalibur
Phoenix
Joined: Jan 18, 2008
Posts: 627
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| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| Fred2670 wrote: | | greenblue wrote: |
What some autistics have been able to do is to to learn social skills with help, in order to be able to function in society or so the goal would be it for them, but that doesn't mean they are cured.. |
I disagree
If the symtoms are alleviated and the ability to function in society is enhanced and maintained to the degree that it would be considered normal, as far as Im concerned, that is a cure and no doctor, no therapist, no professional keyboarder will ever convince me otherwise. |
The whole thing they say when describing AS, is that it makes it difficult to socialize, but it is possible, "An AS person can learn to be social just like a normal person can learn to play the piano" . The sympton says that it is difficult, not impossible, so if you finally get social skills at 35 years old, you are not cured from AS, since you do follow the description...
Anyways, there are tons of diagnosed aspies that were able to get social and marry, etc. So I think it is uninformed to use AS as an excuse for social ineptitude, if anything AS is a reason to try harder. Just like dyslexia is not an excuse to leave school.
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