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Orwell
Outer Party Member
Joined: Aug 09, 2007
Age: 19
Posts: 4276
Location: Room 101
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 Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| GodsGadfly wrote: | | all I had to do was call my cardiologist's office, and he'd prescribe me prophylactic antibiotics. |
Doctors like that should be drawn and quartered publicly in front of graduating medical students. That type of crap is responsible for so many problems we're facing today with things like XDR-TB and makes life a hell of lot harder for researchers who spend their lives developing these drugs that are then made worthless because clinical practitioners refuse to exercise any discretion or responsibility in prescribing them. Clinical medicine is grunt work, the idiots who do it should at least learn to follow the instructions they're given.
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LeKiwi
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Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2594
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:40 am Post subject: |
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| Orwell wrote: | | GodsGadfly wrote: | | all I had to do was call my cardiologist's office, and he'd prescribe me prophylactic antibiotics. |
Doctors like that should be drawn and quartered publicly in front of graduating medical students. That type of crap is responsible for so many problems we're facing today with things like XDR-TB and makes life a hell of lot harder for researchers who spend their lives developing these drugs that are then made worthless because clinical practitioners refuse to exercise any discretion or responsibility in prescribing them. Clinical medicine is grunt work, the idiots who do it should at least learn to follow the instructions they're given. |
Amen. If I had a pound for every un-filled prescription for antibiotics I've been given and subsequently thrown in the bin I would be one rich woman... 
"Ooh, you've got a virus, have some drugs to kill some bacteria!" 
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Orwell
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| Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:03 am Post subject: |
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| LeKiwi wrote: | | "Ooh, you've got a virus, have some drugs to kill some bacteria!" |
I sat in on a class at the University of Pennsylvania where the professor talked about using antibiotics against eukaryotic parasite infections (such as malaria). Now, I found out later the class was only for nursing students, but still, that's scary. This was an Ivy League school, and dangit, eukaryotes don't have cell walls for antibiotics to tear down! That's why we can take penicillin and other antibiotics without negative effects, it only kills bacteria.
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LeKiwi
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Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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You'd think they'd understand such basic science as that after however many years of med-school wouldn't you? I mean, sure, if you've got a virus and it's lowered your defences and you've ended up with a nasty secondary bacterial infection that's slowly eating away at your lung/eye/arm/whatever, and your body definitely needs help to get rid of the bacteria, then sure, go ahead. But if it's just for the initial viral (or parasitic, as you said) infection then what the hell is the point?! I was told once "It's just in case you get a secondary infection"... well, firstly, no point taking them if the bacteria aren't there to kill yet in the first place, and secondly, it's just going to kill all the good bacteria, and given that a good portion of the immune system's 'power house' is in the gut too, surely that's not such a good idea? "Hello candida, come inside, yes, infect this young lady, we'll even give you a helping hand...".
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lau
Quinquaginta Novem! Male Gee-knee-us + silly bits.
Joined: Jun 18, 2006
Age: 59
Posts: 7492
Location: Somerset UK
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| Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Orwell wrote: | | LeKiwi wrote: | | "Ooh, you've got a virus, have some drugs to kill some bacteria!" |
I sat in on a class at the University of Pennsylvania where the professor talked about using antibiotics against eukaryotic parasite infections (such as malaria). Now, I found out later the class was only for nursing students, but still, that's scary. This was an Ivy League school, and dangit, eukaryotes don't have cell walls for antibiotics to tear down! That's why we can take penicillin and other antibiotics without negative effects, it only kills bacteria. |
It would appear that you are misinterpreting the meaning of the word "antibiotic".
The drugs used to treat malaria (a protozoan) are also termed antibiotics, as are those used to treat fungal infections.
An antibiotic is any drug that is used to treat micro-organisms.
Now, using an antibiotic that is a broad spectrum bactericide to treat malaria would sound suspicious, but is that what your professor was saying?
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LeKiwi
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| Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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I've never heard them called antibiotics? They're always termed 'antifungals' or fungicides, or for malaria just 'antimalarials/antimalarial drugs' when I've come across them? (My uncle had malaria after a trip to Africa so I've seen this first-hand).
You're right though, the biotic part of antibiotic refers to 'life' rather than bacteria... (Makes them sound nice eh, 'against life').
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LoveableNerd
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Joined: Apr 24, 2008
Posts: 435
Location: Kentucky, USA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:18 am Post subject: |
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| beau99 wrote: | | LeKiwi wrote: | Beau, mercury accumulates in ALL our bodies; it's bioaccumulative. The body can get rid of tiny amounts of it, but if you add it up and add it up it becomes a toxic overload.
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Methylmercury does, yes.
But thimerosal doesn't contain methylmercury. |
It contains ethyl mercury, right?
Comparison of Blood and Brain Mercury Levels in Infant Monkeys Exposed to Methylmercury or Vaccines Containing Thimerosal.
Environmental Health Perspectives, Aug 2005.
Thomas Burbacher, PhD [University of Washington].
This study demonstrates clearly and unequivocally that ethyl mercury, the kind of mercury found in vaccines, not only ends up in the brain, but leaves double the amount of inorganic mercury as methyl mercury, the kind of mercury found in fish. This work is groundbreaking because little is known about ethyl mercury, and many health authorities have asserted that the mercury found in vaccines is the "safe kind." This study also delivers a strong rebuke of the Institute of Medicine's recommendation in 2004 to no longer pursue the mercury-autism connection. Excerpt:
"A recently published IOM review (IOM 2004) appears to have abandoned the earlier recommendation [of studying mercury and autism] as well as back away from the American Academy of Pediatrics goal [of removing mercury from vaccines]. This approach is difficult to understand, given our current limited knowledge of the toxicokinetics and developmental neurotoxicity of thimerosal, a compound that has been (and will continue to be) injected in millions of newborns and infants."
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lau
Quinquaginta Novem! Male Gee-knee-us + silly bits.
Joined: Jun 18, 2006
Age: 59
Posts: 7492
Location: Somerset UK
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| Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| LoveableNerd wrote: | | beau99 wrote: | | LeKiwi wrote: | Beau, mercury accumulates in ALL our bodies; it's bioaccumulative. The body can get rid of tiny amounts of it, but if you add it up and add it up it becomes a toxic overload.
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Methylmercury does, yes.
But thimerosal doesn't contain methylmercury. |
It contains ethyl mercury, right? |
No. It metabolises to produce ethyl mercury.
A simpler link, to the lead researcher, and thence to the actual article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Burbacher
generationrescue.org have drawn conclusions from the report that are not present in the report.
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Pandora
Cat Lady
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Age: 47
Posts: 4684
Location: Townsville
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:47 am Post subject: |
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I doubt you could take seriously anything that generationrescue has to say.
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LeKiwi
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Joined: Nov 27, 2007
Posts: 2594
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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Who are generation rescue? Sounds sort of... cult-like...
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Sora
Love all, trust a few
Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Age: 20
Posts: 2884
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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Children here develop 'normally' at first, then manifest symptoms in a way that gets them a diagnosis of classical autism and they don't get flu shots. So, how important can that flu shot be in ASD research?
Do they test groups of non-autistic children for mercury levels nowadays?
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LeKiwi
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Posts: 2594
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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I know a couple of naturopathic doctors who test all children for heavy metal levels, which includes mercury. But unless it's friend's children going in for a general check-up, or for any other problem, they won't usually see the kids so it's certainly not all. And obviously only those who go to those particular naturopaths.
As I've said though, I don't think mercury alone is responsible for those kids who 'regress' and follow that pattern of 'autism' (which I'm pretty sure isn't the usual hereditary born-with-it autism most of us have). I also just don't think the flu shots are any good and have any point. 
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Sora
Love all, trust a few
Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Age: 20
Posts: 2884
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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That's interesting LeKiwi, thank you.
I believe here where I live autistic children don't get tested for heavy metals or anything.
I'd get tested for pretty much everything including genetic testing otherwise. Just because I'm totally curious.
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The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. Terry Pratchett |
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LeKiwi
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Posts: 2594
Location: The murky waters of my mind...
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| Posted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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If I asked my doctor about it she'd look at me like I'd just sprouted another head or something! She's so closed-minded, she didn't even know what Rescue Remedy was, and when I explained what it was and said how it helps me with anxiety she said "Oh it's rubbish, it doesn't do anything, it's placebo" etc. Like two minutes ago you'd never heard of the stuff, how do you know it doesn't work?! I mean, yeah, sure, it doesn't, which is why it's helped me with my anxiety disorder for so long. 
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roche12
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Jun 10, 2008
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:14 am Post subject: |
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I dont waste my time going to see MDs. I know what they are going to do, they repeat what I tell them is wrong and hand me an antibiotic for something that will not kill me nor cause any life long damage.
The chicken pox shot is top of my stupid list. Most people get it when they are young and are safe for life, never have to worry that it failed to work. Now for children that are high risk of death and adults that never got it I understand why they should have it but the avg kid doesnt need it.
Here in the US they love to scream about alcohol and cigarettes killing you and leave out the huge list of chemicals they feed people. I rather enjoy that a former maker of agent orange is the current owner of aspartame and that same company is also a leader in the genetically altered seed market. Its so nice to know that they had corn deemed unsafe for human consumption they fed to cows with the purpose of feeding them to us.... |
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