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Greentea
Goddess of Wisdom
Joined: Jun 15, 2007
Age: 47
Posts: 5500
Location: Middle East
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 Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:17 am Post subject: |
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I was fired today. I have no one to tell, so I'm sharing here. 
_________________
So-called white lies are like fake jewelry. Adorn yourself with them if you must, but expect to look cheap to a connoisseur. |
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Ichinin
Velociraptor
Joined: Apr 04, 2009
Posts: 405
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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Just a piece of legal advice:
If you do not have a diagnosis, do not go around and tell a potential employer that "i think i may have it".
Doing so could make the company close not hire you, and they can do so since "i think" is not a valid diagnosis, and not much to form a legal discrimination case upon.
And...even if they suspect you to have AS or HFA or something similar, they are not legally allowed to ask if you have something like that - not even if they have it themselves and want to "make a new WP-friend". This applies to (at least) Sweden and Usa, the latter i found out by reading a document by an US interviewer writing about his work experiences.
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And some useful links to some of my posts where i say some useful things:
Writing a CV, Interviews and getting help:
http://www.wrongplanet.net/posts20842-start75.html
Creating your own experpences:
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt95133.html
Tips about the job-ad and why you should examine the employer
http://www.wrongplanet.net/posts95133-start15.html
_________________
"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring" (Carl Sagan)
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one1ai
Toucan
Joined: Mar 04, 2005
Posts: 276
Location: Greece
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| Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 6:32 am Post subject: half philosophy |
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In the first thread 06xrs made a post which made me come up with something:
It's possible I don't have much self confidence, so thinking "I can't prove I will perform bad at work because I can't know" could help to think in a more positive way. |
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kosta_matt
Emu Egg
Joined: Jun 05, 2009
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 5:19 am Post subject: keeping not getting |
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i seem to have no problem getting jobs. i am very well qualifies in my specialist subject and talented at my profession.
it is keeping the job that is the problem. for example i have had my current job for 1 year. i am already facing disciplinary procedures..but for what? i have no idea and neither do they. regarding my actual duties i perform excellently. I was in my first disciplinary watched carefully by top staff and they reported I was good - outstanding.
So if it is not my duty - what I am actually employed for what is the problem...
well it is simply acting with my colleagues in a professional and agreeable way.
I have no way of dressing up what I say so it just comes out, regardless of whether another member of staff or the boss boss - i still speak the same. I don't have the ability to differentiate or be tactile apparently. I go around telling people how it is - and because of their lack of competency they complain about me instead of addressing their downfalls
this leads to weird disciplinary. i have a high level of praise and external acknowledgment of my talents and thank you from people who matter - i am good at my job - but i am still in front of the main boss on monday
and it is not a one off - it is a lifetime pattern. top of my class at school but expelled. liked by all but excluded from peer friendship groups because i don't get my peers. scholarships but disciplinary hearing, it has to stop. i would like to hear from anyone with similar probs. |
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Greentea
Goddess of Wisdom
Joined: Jun 15, 2007
Age: 47
Posts: 5500
Location: Middle East
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| Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:31 am Post subject: |
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Hi Kosta, welcome to WP.
That sounds very much like me. I can't take this anymore, so I'm trying to get social benefits and quit working.
_________________
So-called white lies are like fake jewelry. Adorn yourself with them if you must, but expect to look cheap to a connoisseur. |
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hannahcamille
Hummingbird
Joined: Jun 09, 2009
Posts: 23
Location: Midwest, United States
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| Posted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:46 am Post subject: AS and work |
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| AS_Interlocking wrote: | I interviewed two weeks ago for my dream job, and sent thank-you emails to the two interviewers who provided me business cards (and thus contact information to send a thank you to) immediately after returning from the interview. One of them sent me a reply thanking ME. I'm still waiting to hear back on the job.
Regarding AS, I'm very much a "not sure if I have it" but I know a lot of the AS tendencies fit me. I've also changed a LOT in college, and my AS traits are nowhere nearly as prevelant as they were just two years ago. The job I was interviewing for does work in my area of special interest, in a way that allows me to combine my major in college with my work/internship experience, in an environment where people do work individually following systems of rules. It definately plays up my strengths and minimizes my weaknesses! I just cross my fingers that I can get this job.
I really hope that some landmark legal action happens in the near future regarding AS in the workplace. It will be a great day when a company CANNOT fire, or not hire, or create an environment conducive to quitting, for someone who is actually the most qualified, best person at what they do, but doesn't make the people around him/her feel all warm and fuzzy inside. I should point out the employer for my dream job, from what I hear, is not known for such firings, I'm just making this comment in general because I know it has happened to so many people with AS, and is one of the reasons I don't want to find out for sure if I have it or not.
I think the Americans with Disabilities Act is a great start, but has not been used to the extent that it can be for people with AS. The "accommodations" will be different than for the more well-known disabilities--IMHO, instead of building a wheelchair ramp or jacking the work desk up a few inches to accommodate a wheelchair in an office, it would likely require a briefing for the immediate coworkers of the AS individual, letting them know in which ways their new colleague will be different, what types of things he/she may be sensitive to, what things he/she is very good at (their AS strengths), and what things they may not quite grasp, as well as an understanding of how this persons' interface with office politics may be very different than others. It may even require something like an IEP--an "Individual EMPLOYMENT Plan" that would specifically define acts which, if done willingly against the AS employee, would constitute harassment. Most of these things may even fall under existing harassment laws, but clarifying them and identifying the points at which people with AS become more susceptible to them would likely help curb problems in the workplace.
Any other thoughts on what the most likely "reasonable accommodation" would be, under ADA, for someone with AS? |
Unfortunately, as you probably know it's more common for people with disabilities to have unpaid or temporary jobs, which makes it very difficult to hold the supervsior accountable. Our types of LD issues are a particularly quandary since we're very talented but employers often prize extrovertedness above all else.
_________________
hannahcamille
http://nldthoughtsandfeelings.wordpress.com
(blog on living with spectrum conditions) |
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ww
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jun 26, 2009
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 1:46 am Post subject: Re: Finding and Keeping jobs - Tips and Advice |
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[q
[quote]RTF MAJORS/MINORS - THIS IS WORTH SAVING FOR FUTURE JOB SEARCHES
Here's another word that makes or breaks a job: "Please", as in "Please mail my check". I actually said this last week when fired for being three minutes late to work after my bus never showed up on time. Rather than yell and swear at the person who fired you, a 'please' has possibly gotten them to see how valuable a worker I am. Not to mention that I always show up at least 10-15 minutes early, except one time on this day when bus was late. BTW: I give career seminars with real-world advice on how asperger people can maintain employment. PM for details. |
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ww
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jun 26, 2009
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 2:29 am Post subject: |
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| Coctyle wrote: | I am more interested in finding a job that fits my personality. Despite having AS (self-diagnosed) I usualy do great at interviews. I'm not sure why, I think it can be so stressful that it is not stressful anymore, if that makes any sense. Usually interviews are easier than I think they will be before I go in. I don't have too much trouble talking about myself, and a lifetime of practice has made me a good (maybe cumpulsive) lier when necesary. I don't really lie, but I don't mention that I loath social interaction or anything like that. I also pretend to be ambitious and concerned about the stuff that people are supposed to be concernced about. I used to be in theatre in HS, so I kind of just pretend to be a fictional character that is like me, except normal.
So, in terms of finding a job that fits my personality, does anyone have any tips? When I was in college, I probably should have seen a career counseler, but I have always have had a tendency to not go to anyone for help. I don't know if there are career counselers for people who already are out of school and have a career, but want to find a new one. |
I so understand what you are writing! I am a great interviewer, hence, 46 job offers. Itis KEEPING the job that matters. Add to this the stress of feeling I want to pay parents money back for the loans and fin. support they have given for ten years, just imagine that on top of this. And them asking me for money telling me to get a job, etc etc. It is too much. Go with what you love to do. What do you do in your spare time? What type of work really excites you? Try to find something in that. Plan B: Always have a backup plan where you can take the most mindnumbing boring job out there. This way, you can do that while developing great ideas at the same time. Think of the job as temporary to keep sanity. PM me for details on the career coaching I give to people with aspergers. |
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ww
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jun 26, 2009
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 3:18 am Post subject: |
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| JWPhotoGraphics wrote: | | I'm interested in what can work. I usually send a thank you note, and I interview quite well. I always come in second place (it might as well be last place). The main affectation of my AS is my voice, and I feel I'm unable to win that "battle of the first impressions." |
I have been second choice too, which was insulting, but it turned out on several jobs that the first choice either quit or did not work out, and I was offered the job! So 2nd choice can be good. |
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ww
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jun 26, 2009
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Pete1051 wrote: | What about GETTING the interview?
My biggest obstacle is actually getting someone to actually talk to me. I've sent out coutless resumes and I don't get any thing back. I try to call these people and find out what's up. It's not like I'm just sitting there i persue it. But position are always filled as soon as I apply, or the don't actually have anything at the moment, they're just taking resumes for some mystery time in the future when the might hire someone. That person most likely will be a friend of family member of someone already working there. Any job I've gotten was like that. I don't think people actually get jobs cold, off the street.
I don't know anyone who knows anyone who might be hiring someone like me. My social network sucks.
But at this point I don't want to work for someone else anymore. I want to start my own thing. I've got 2 things kinda started. But starting a business is confusing and overwhelming. But I think if I wholheartedly believe in a product I can sell it. And I believe in my own stuff, I take awesome photos, and I have some pretty good ideas for software in my head.
But logic dictates that I may reach points at which I must survive and take a "9-5" to make ends meet. I think part of my problem is that I really dont give a hoot about my boss or whatever he's so stressed about, that's his problem. If he can't give me just compensation for relieving some of the stress off his back, then he's on his own.
Having been laid off 4 times in a row, I've become kinda jaded against employers, I got the message that I, as an employee was completely expendable, and to be discarded when no longer cost effective according to the accounting people. Some of those I understand, they were small businesses, and It can be tough to keep going. I see it as no personal fault but the nature of employment in general. It is not a stable thing. And keeping a regular 9-5 job is as much work as running your own business, except somebody else reaps the profits.
But getting investment for a business is like a hardcore job interview TIMES 1000!! it's all the same weither it's a boss or a customer handing you the check.
I reference to the advice above:
Even as a business, I meet with a potential client for a web site or something. It is ESSENTIAL, that I thank them for their time and consideration. If you want some money out of someone, you gotta brownnose a little.
Pete |
I HAVE BEEN HIRED AS AN ASSISTANT MANAGER FOR A FAST FOOD PLACE. NO ONE IS LINING UP TO WORK HERE! WHY DO I HAVE TO TAKE HELLISH JOBS OVER AND OVER AGAIN THAT I AM NOT GOOD AT DOING?? Because I keep trying. I don't consider it 'browning' to really sincerely thank someone for their time, because I am grateful for their time! NO hours are guaranteed at any job, I discovered in the past two years. CAN YOU TELL ME HOW SO MANY PEOPLE BOUGHT HOUSES AND KEPT HOUSES FOR 20 TO 30 YRS IF NO HOURS OR JOB CAN BE GUARANTEED?? |
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Robert312
Blue Jay
Joined: Aug 15, 2009
Age: 47
Posts: 79
Location: Birmingham
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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I seem to have the opposite problem from most of the other posters. I have a hard time getting a job but can easily keep them. The only jobs I've had a hard time keeping are the ones I liked.
I was diagnosed as a high functioning autistic, not an aspie. Maybe there is a big difference because I don't have a lot of the problems other people here have. I am very good at school, and getting degrees, but ending up in low paying jobs that don't require a degree.
Having worked in retail for over ten years I am really surprised at some of the experiences people have described here. The biggest problem in retail is keeping people. Most places I have worked you have to literally work hard to get fired. If you show up on time, do good work, that is almost all that is required. Getting along with people helps, but I have never seen quiet people as being a problem.
It can be hard to get an initial job and break in. I did yard work for a small construction company, the guy was a friend of my Mom's. He had someone who owed him one, who took me then then gave me a hard time. I took everything he threw at me without complaining, and left when I chose to leave.
That gave me enough experience that I could get work later after my career choice failed.
You can volunteer for nonprofits, to get experience. You can go to fast food or grocery stores and be willing to take undesirable jobs. You have a better chance with odd shifts, like an AM shift. After you get a hideous job under your belt you can move on to better jobs. You have to be willing to work, and willing to take work that is beneath you.
I always get along with everyone. I must not be as Aspie. I have to make an effort not to talk above people heads but that's about it. Everyone likes me, I'm none as a quiet one and a witty person. I even make a few friends.
Supervisors say they can tell me what to do, and I'll do it, and they don't have to keep checking on me. The problem is I'm so good get pigeon holed. I lack the social skills to seek promotion and my oddness might make me not be seen as worthy.
I have such good standing at the store where I work that I think I could move up if I chose that option. I'll see what happens with the state agency I will meet with soon. I really have been laboring under a handicap. Even though I entered some volatile type jobs; Journalism, commercial photography, it seems my oddness was definitely a factor as to why things didn't work out.
I didn't nean to go on so long and I;m not sure what I started out to say, but one last bit of advice. Attitude is important. When you go to apply for a job have a good attitude, and be persistent. |
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Ladarzak
Toucan
Joined: Mar 10, 2007
Posts: 252
Location: Vancouver, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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There are a few tips in this thread. Maybe about half the posts? A lot of people posted here to complain about their situation. My tip for them is read more carefully, follow instructions and respond in the appropriate context. We aspies often suck at looking at the context or big picture. It's something I am starting to work on and practise doing, as it's a weak point for me, too. You'll drive a potential employer nuts if you don't do this, and they will get rid of you, I suspect. I've had several work conflicts that could have been avoided with that orientation.
My tip is this: know yourself and be able to present your strengths, but also address your weaknesses where possible. A great resource I have found for organizing and elucidating this process of self analysis and development is a book called "Asperger syndrome employment workbook," by Roger N. Meyer. It came up in a google search and I've used the readable selections. I think I'll order myself a copy of it. Goes into the kind of detail that my career exploration course doesn't because the course is designed for NT people just like most of the world. Another good one is How to Find Work That Works for People with Asperger Syndrome, by Gail Hawkins, which I am also tempted to get. |
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Boomshika
Raven
Joined: Oct 10, 2009
Age: 26
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: Some "unofficial" job tips |
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| thx1138 wrote: | I posted this on another board, I thought it might come in handy here. Enjoy!
1.) Make a note of who introduces themsevles to you when you first start. I can tell you for a fact that the first seemingly super friendly coworkers who want to be the first to get to know you are also, sadly, often the first to stab you in the back and can be the meanest if you do not measure up to their often unrealistic social expectations of you.
2.) Treat everyone like they are your friend, even if you hate their guts (i.e., keep your friends close and your enemies closer).
3.) Don't trust anyone. It seems over protective, but it is a good rule of thumb. I have had people I could have sworn would keep a secret spill the beans (often in front of as many people as possible).
4.) Filter your emails. One thing about emails is that they are basically written in stone, they can be sent to anyone. So when sending a email, be as non-offensive and as bland as possible. I even sent a personal email to someone who didn't work at my company complaining about my boss. Somehow, the boss was able to obtain a copy.
5.) Try to avoid office conversations. With aspies (myself included) we are not experts at social interaction in the office. I have found that being polite and terminating a conversation as soon as possible has saved me a number of times. Basically, just pretend you are listing to what they are saying, look like your interested and then say something like "Can I go for a quick second. My lunch is in the microwave". Saying quick second is great because they take it as your going to come back (they are so interested in their own words they won't notice if you return or not), so you can use it as an easy exit.
6.) Be an actor. The non-aspie person prides themselves on how shallow they can be (i.e., why do you think Paris Hilton is a role model for so many of them). It really works, I tend to be really outgoing at work because I put myself in the mental role of "people person". In fact, most people at work I really don't like, but they think I like them. |
i'm starting at a new job tomorrow, so i'm totally gonna apply these to the fullest! these tips are priceless and i'm sure will help tons of aspies keep their jobs. thanks thx! 
_________________
Oscar wasn't a grouch... He was just an aspie. |
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tim10101
Emu Egg
Joined: Oct 18, 2009
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sun Oct 18, 2009 10:17 pm Post subject: I hear your frustrations |
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I hear and share your frustrations everyone. For me personally it has got to the point where I have motivational issues just to apply over and over again trying to find anyone who will pay me.
I read some books in college and the book is called "Good to Great". Basically someone studies companies that grow and they figure out what it takes and why they are successful long term.
Basically you have to love work, money, and your skills and kiss butt and be absolutely thrilled about work. Self help books focus on these qualities as well. These are the successful employees companies want and those that HR screens for.
One book I have is titled "Stop whining and go get a life". Basically if you do not love your job you wont keep it.
What does this have to do with aspergers and keeping a job? If you love your job and what you do you will not badmouth procedures, employees, or your job. I have been fired before and feel your pain and here are my steps:
1. If something is wrong never ever say anything about it unless in clear privacy in your bosses office. I got fired before for hating the way my previous employer did things. Since he felt I was badmouthing him he fired me and figured I didn't love my job. He is correct because I complained. Whining is complaining.
2. Never ask people out at work. If you are socially awkward this can be viewed as sexual harrasment.
3. Love what you do.
4. If a procedure is messed up its your bosses problem. You wont be fired. He or she will if you confront them privately and nothing happens.
5. The customer/boss is always right. We are literal but work is not. You need to kiss up sometimes and yes people are wrong.
6. If politics and small talk go around work do not comment or get involved.
7. Learn to love not being unemployed or hating the capitalist system.
8. If you hate work after a few years and nothing listed above works go get another job. Remember not to quit because we are in a recession but look while you have a job.
Follow these things and you will secure a job and keep it. At least it worked for me. For those who say they want to live off social security I have to say it wont be around forever and it wont pay for a median $400,000 home.
NT's have it tough too and its called work for a reason. It may not what everyone wants to hear but roughing yourself up is important because your parents wont live forever and the world is a cruel place. Compete in it and be part of it and not fight it. If people did not work so hard for us we would not eat or have anything. Dont we owe the world the same by working? |
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WyoKnott
Emu Egg
Joined: Oct 18, 2009
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Fri Oct 23, 2009 2:10 pm Post subject: Should I admit my condition? |
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| I am unemployed and looking for a job. My last three jobs were lost due to problems I now know relate to AS. Will it help me or hurt me to inform prospective employers about my condition and explain how it affects my work? |
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