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hush6
Snowy Owl
Joined: Oct 16, 2009
Posts: 140
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 Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Electric_Kite wrote: | | hush6 wrote: |
I never claimed that anything I said has been based on facts. |
That being the case, will you please do things properly and stop making claims?
By the way, even Google will not help you prove things that are not based on facts. And it is perfectly normal for people to ask for you to give a citation when they want evidence, and not bother when they happen to believe you. Anyway, as I have said before, I did Google it, and then I ran it through pubMed and psychInfo and several other massive databases of medical findings, and what you say is, guess what, not there.
But look, here's Simon Baron-Cohen again, saying how the self-diagnosed are often right. Without any actual numbers, the bastard. http://www.iancommunity.org/cs/articles/very_late_diagnosis_of_asperger_syndrome
He's said it before in transcripts of lectures of his that I've read. Attwood has too. So has that ridicuous disgusting bint Maxine Aston, come to think of it.
Point of fact, cancer cells are really easy to recognise under a microscope. You don't really even need a picture, just a vague description and a certain amount of experience looking at normal cells. |
Um what claims? I'm not making claims, just expressing an opinion. Get over yourself!
And as for Baron-Cohen, yeh sweet as, that's just one doctor, and one opinion means nothing to me....and hey that's ok cause that's what everyone says about why they don't trust psychs...yet I'm supposed to believe everything this guy writes? Screw that!
And as for Attwood, well, that's the guy who diagnosed me. He is the biggest schmuck/turd/phony/joke of man I have ever met. I would burn anything he wrote before I read it. The fact that you put so much faith in what he says makes me think you are just a lame trend follower.
You know why Attwood supports SD? Cause it helps him get his name/face out there, the more people running around saying "ZOMG I'M A ASPIE WH00! !11!!!" the more he gets his face out there. Seriously, get a clue. |
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Electric_Kite
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Age: 34
Posts: 524
Location: crashing to the ground
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| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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I am glad you agree with me about Attwood, but you are, in fact, making claims. Making claims that I can 'google it' and find tonnes of evidence that self-diagnosed people are often wrong, and are somehow causing problems. That is an 'opinion' that anybody who knows how to leverage google can prove wrong. This means you are clinging to, and repeating, a falsehood. Get over yourself.
You didn't follow the link. There are three other expert's names on the top, and the article is about a diagnostic clinic set up to handle the loads of people who self-diagnosed since AS has become a trendy sort of thing to talk about, and come in seeking confirmation.
By the way, since you don't believe anything Attwood writes, why do you believe your own diagnosis more than you believe mine? |
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Laney2005
Raven
Joined: Oct 28, 2009
Age: 26
Posts: 108
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Who_Am_I wrote: |
Of course, if I'd been diagnosed as a child, my parents would have paid for it and arranged everything, but apparently if children are academically bright and not disrupting the classroom, there can't possibly be anything wrong with them. |
OK, so I read through this entire thread to this point without skipping to the last page and posting (this one hit, because minus the "not disrupting" part, that's me). I told myself that I had to read it all, that I had to get an idea of what was going on before I tossed my laptop across the room, went into hiding and never spoke to another human being again. Because, see, if you guys aren't able to accept each other, how in the world is anyone going to accept me? They are not.
I am not professionally diagnosed with an ASD. I refused to put myself down as "self diagnosed" on this forum. I put "not sure". That middle option. I know I'm not NT. I've known that for a long, long time, and I'm not 30 yet. What I do know is this-- I never considered AS as a diagnosis for myself until very recently (keyword: considered). I have a degree in psychology, I have worked extensively with other people with special needs, I have been to some shrinks who gave me a whole bunch of letters that were supposed to tell me who I was. But I never, never, never met anyone even remotely like me. I knew there was something else, I knew there was something more. As for what, I didn't know.
The idea first came to me after reading "The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time" for a class on language development. We had to write an essay about Christopher's use of pragmatic language (Christopher is the main character, he is likely autistic). I wrote a nice (or so I thought) paper about how I thought his pragmatics were just fine, thank you very much. I failed the assignment. Perhaps even epic failed it. And I still don't know why!
Then I was blessed to meet a person with AS. For the first time in my life, I met another human being who actually made sense to me. Someone with similar life issues. I talked to this person for a very long time and was just amazed. So I did some (OK, extensive) research, took some online tests and eventually ended up on this site. I lurked for about an hour, but after exclaiming, "I'm not the only one?!" for the 30th time, I decided to become a member. I have been posting for the last several days and reading even more.
Between meeting another person who makes sense and finding this forum, I have started to think that I might have found something that's right, that's real, that's me. Thank God I am not really alone. There are websites out there for people "like me". This is amazing! Then I started reading this thread. Then I started to cry.
I have spent my whole life thinking I was a mistake. I have always thought that I am wrong and broken, more than most people are. I have been nothing but alone and confused in a world that makes little sense to me. People talk to each other in ways that I do not understand. I am a freak. A burden. I will never succeed as anything.
For the last few days, I didn't feel that way. I know no one is perfect, but I thought that here I might be able to identify with some other people. I thought I wasn't alone.
Don't do this, guys. Don't fight with each other. Discuss, fine. But bring people up. Don't hurt each other. Whatever we are, something brought us all here. I think it might be what brought me here. I don't know. Empathy is not something that comes easy to me. Sympathy, yes. I am very sympathetic. But not empathetic.
I don't care if you are "officially diagnosed", "self-diagnosed", "not sure", "NT", "other" or whatever other options there are. I don't care if you are a freaking giraffe that knows how to type. I don't care if you are black, white, purple, orange or striped. AS, ASD, ADHD, PDD-NOS, SID, ODD, OCD, MDD, NT or just a human being! I don't care what language you speak or what country you live in.
The world hurts all of us enough. Why are we attacking each other? I don't know what brought each of us here. I hardly know what brought me here, besides some hope. Frankly, I don't really care what brought each of us here. I really don't. But not one of us is any better than any one of us. I'm not giving advice about AS, by the way (it appears some people don't like that since I'm not "really" AS). I'm giving advice about trying to treat each other with respect.
But I'm scared. I've been doing some research on the history of barbarism in America (mainly in the form of racism) and in a way, guys, this thread is beginning to sound like that. Labeling people by the "degree" they are or are not a certain way and then basing your treatment of them and their opinions as such, that sounds way too familiar. I'm not claiming to be any better, but I'm calling it like I see it (which being obsessed with baseball is figurative language I understand).
We face enough of this in the world as a whole. This is Wrong Planet, a place for people who feel like they have landed somewhere they don't really belong. But when I read this thread, it just sounds like... junior high school.
That's enough from me. |
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sinsboldly
Free Range Aspie
Joined: Nov 22, 2006
Age: 59
Posts: 13253
Location: Oregon, USA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Laney2005 wrote: | | Who_Am_I wrote: |
Of course, if I'd been diagnosed as a child, my parents would have paid for it and arranged everything, but apparently if children are academically bright and not disrupting the classroom, there can't possibly be anything wrong with them. |
OK, so I read through this entire thread to this point without skipping to the last page and posting (this one hit, because minus the "not disrupting" part, that's me). I told myself that I had to read it all, that I had to get an idea of what was going on before I tossed my laptop across the room, went into hiding and never spoke to another human being again. Because, see, if you guys aren't able to accept each other, how in the world is anyone going to accept me? They are not.
I am not professionally diagnosed with an ASD. I refused to put myself down as "self diagnosed" on this forum. I put "not sure". That middle option. I know I'm not NT. I've known that for a long, long time, and I'm not 30 yet. What I do know is this-- I never considered AS as a diagnosis for myself until very recently (keyword: considered). I have a degree in psychology, I have worked extensively with other people with special needs, I have been to some shrinks who gave me a whole bunch of letters that were supposed to tell me who I was. But I never, never, never met anyone even remotely like me. I knew there was something else, I knew there was something more. As for what, I didn't know.
The idea first came to me after reading "The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time" for a class on language development. We had to write an essay about Christopher's use of pragmatic language (Christopher is the main character, he is likely autistic). I wrote a nice (or so I thought) paper about how I thought his pragmatics were just fine, thank you very much. I failed the assignment. Perhaps even epic failed it. And I still don't know why!
Then I was blessed to meet a person with AS. For the first time in my life, I met another human being who actually made sense to me. Someone with similar life issues. I talked to this person for a very long time and was just amazed. So I did some (OK, extensive) research, took some online tests and eventually ended up on this site. I lurked for about an hour, but after exclaiming, "I'm not the only one?!" for the 30th time, I decided to become a member. I have been posting for the last several days and reading even more.
Between meeting another person who makes sense and finding this forum, I have started to think that I might have found something that's right, that's real, that's me. Thank God I am not really alone. There are websites out there for people "like me". This is amazing! Then I started reading this thread. Then I started to cry.
I have spent my whole life thinking I was a mistake. I have always thought that I am wrong and broken, more than most people are. I have been nothing but alone and confused in a world that makes little sense to me. People talk to each other in ways that I do not understand. I am a freak. A burden. I will never succeed as anything.
For the last few days, I didn't feel that way. I know no one is perfect, but I thought that here I might be able to identify with some other people. I thought I wasn't alone.
Don't do this, guys. Don't fight with each other. Discuss, fine. But bring people up. Don't hurt each other. Whatever we are, something brought us all here. I think it might be what brought me here. I don't know. Empathy is not something that comes easy to me. Sympathy, yes. I am very sympathetic. But not empathetic.
I don't care if you are "officially diagnosed", "self-diagnosed", "not sure", "NT", "other" or whatever other options there are. I don't care if you are a freaking giraffe that knows how to type. I don't care if you are black, white, purple, orange or striped. AS, ASD, ADHD, PDD-NOS, SID, ODD, OCD, MDD, NT or just a human being! I don't care what language you speak or what country you live in.
The world hurts all of us enough. Why are we attacking each other? I don't know what brought each of us here. I hardly know what brought me here, besides some hope. Frankly, I don't really care what brought each of us here. I really don't. But not one of us is any better than any one of us. I'm not giving advice about AS, by the way (it appears some people don't like that since I'm not "really" AS). I'm giving advice about trying to treat each other with respect.
But I'm scared. I've been doing some research on the history of barbarism in America (mainly in the form of racism) and in a way, guys, this thread is beginning to sound like that. Labeling people by the "degree" they are or are not a certain way and then basing your treatment of them and their opinions as such, that sounds way too familiar. I'm not claiming to be any better, but I'm calling it like I see it (which being obsessed with baseball is figurative language I understand).
We face enough of this in the world as a whole. This is Wrong Planet, a place for people who feel like they have landed somewhere they don't really belong. But when I read this thread, it just sounds like... junior high school.
That's enough from me. |
Amen, sister!  I made myself read it to the end! and glad I did.
Merle
_________________
where sin abounds, grace abounds the more;
Non omnis moriar |
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veiledexpressions
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Oct 24, 2009
Age: 26
Posts: 69
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 1:40 am Post subject: |
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I must say, this one poster doth protest too much, methinks.
As for the poster with the long message:I agree with sin. I'm glad I read to the end! |
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hush6
Snowy Owl
Joined: Oct 16, 2009
Posts: 140
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| Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| Electric_Kite wrote: | I am glad you agree with me about Attwood, but you are, in fact, making claims. Making claims that I can 'google it' and find tonnes of evidence that self-diagnosed people are often wrong, and are somehow causing problems. That is an 'opinion' that anybody who knows how to leverage google can prove wrong. This means you are clinging to, and repeating, a falsehood. Get over yourself.
You didn't follow the link. There are three other expert's names on the top, and the article is about a diagnostic clinic set up to handle the loads of people who self-diagnosed since AS has become a trendy sort of thing to talk about, and come in seeking confirmation.
By the way, since you don't believe anything Attwood writes, why do you believe your own diagnosis more than you believe mine? |
Hey just wanna say I wanna try and leave this thread after this because of that long post that person made up there. It reminded me of my video games and in the game they would respect a speech like that, so I shall too.
The reason I'm saying to google is because is the best I can offer, I do not know any other way to help people find the same information that I have gotten. The information I have I did not read on the internet so I can not link to it. I get alot of my information from doctors, autism groups, events. More word of mouth, but not from just random people, from people actually doing research in the field. I can't summon these people to post here for you as I don't personally know many of them, and the ones I do know, I don't think they would want to come here just to satiate people that don't believe what they have told me. I'm thinking from now on if I read something offline that I think might come up here I may need to copy it and scan it in so I can show people, which is very annoying, but it seems I am considered a liar otherswise, even though people on the other side of the fence don't seem to need to back up what they say.
But just to clarify, I did follow the link, but thought since you only mentioned Baron-Cohen I would only mention him too. I figured he was the main authority. He was wasn't he?
Also, if you share my opinion on Attwood, why bring his research to the table. And I didn't trust my diagnosis from Attwood at all, which is why I chose to be reassessed by 2 other people after. I could not settle for his opinion knowing his motives. |
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Electric_Kite
Phoenix
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
Age: 34
Posts: 524
Location: crashing to the ground
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| Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:22 am Post subject: |
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At the very least you could google it yourself and offer a link. If it's not online, the very least of a citation would be to state the name of one of these researchers you are talking about. Otherwise, you are blowing smoke and appear to be relying on the poor precision of Google to cover up the fact that what you're claiming to have found on it isn't actually there.
| Quote: | | people on the other side of the fence don't seem to need to back up what they say. |
I did.
| Quote: |
But just to clarify, I did follow the link, but thought since you only mentioned Baron-Cohen I would only mention him too. I figured he was the main authority. He was wasn't he? |
I suppose he was, but it's hardly the point. I was backing up the statement that autism experts say that self-diagnosis is often correct. All of those people count as experts qualified to make such a statement. And really, the fact that there's this clinic just to confirm people's self-diagnosis ought to mean something. They've got to get funding somewhere, and that means they've got to prove a need. Who is going to fund a clinic that pays MDs and PhDs to sit around saying, "You are not autistic, go home." People do complain about the National Health service in Britain, but is it that bad?
If you look at the site for the National Autism Society you'll find stuff like this which is quite heavy on the implication that if you suspect yourself of having AS you're probably right. They link that to an article explaining why you should bother to get a diagnosis, too. Including many reasons that I note are not relevant in the US.
| Quote: |
Also, if you share my opinion on Attwood, why bring his research to the table. And I didn't trust my diagnosis from Attwood at all, which is why I chose to be reassessed by 2 other people after. I could not settle for his opinion knowing his motives. |
Because you appear to take the opinions of those with the 'proper' credentials to diagnose autism as sacrosanct, regardless of character, and Attwood has those credentials.
Anyway, I hope you'll keep that 'speech' in mind. Give us a break. |
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