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Wombat
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 08, 2006
Posts: 629
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 Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:49 am Post subject: A college education |
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In America people seem hell bent on getting a "college education" as a ticket to the "middle class".
So they rack up $60,000 in debt to get a degree that isn't worth a damn.
This is so recent. The idea of the "company man" only appeared in the 1950's.
If you read books from 100 years ago the term "hired man" was an insult.
Only a weakling or loser would work for another man.
A "real man" would get his own farm or set up as a blacksmith or shopkeeper or fur trapper or whatever. Only losers would work for wages.
So you have a degree? So what? The local plumber or pizza shop owner probably makes more money than you and he doesn't have to kiss anyone's ass.
In Germany they have the right idea. They say that everyone should get further training after high school but that doesn't necessarily mean "college".
It might mean training as a plumber or electrician or bus driver or pastry cook or pilot or fisherman or surveyor or whatever.
Skills that will get you a real job or allow you to work for yourself. |
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Zsazsa
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 20, 2007
Posts: 975
Location: Upstate New York, USA
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:27 am Post subject: |
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Education is a business like any other. Stripping it of all its "romance" and all its political consideration, is this business truly profitable these days? Considering the resources invested in an education, this question is not inappropriate. Yet, how does one truly measure productivity in this area?
When a student leaves an educational institution, how should we evaluate the "product" of this business? At the national level,
the "product" is human capital, and its quantity and quality will determine the pace of economic development. "Bad" students can
become exceptional entrepreneurs...take Bill Gates for example. He dropped out of Harvard. But, on average, this is not the case.
The market recognizes the probable relation between scholastic acheievement and economic effectiveness, as starting
salaries are largely based on diplomas optained. The premium on education continues to grow in the U.S. along with the economy's dependence on "gray matter."
However, with the national results for graduating college students falling, this is not an erosion of intelligence in the population but instead, of a drop of the productivity in the educational system. The system is broken...and it is up to the educational bureacrats to propose reforms of the "business" of education to improve its productivity.
The more an economy is based on the quality of human capital, the more its future also, depends on this quality. This is why educational decline in the U.S. is a source of national concern. |
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zer0netgain
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 03, 2009
Posts: 1350
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:59 am Post subject: |
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Education is like any other resource or investment. It's value depends on what it can do for you after you obtain it.
It's overpriced and undervalued in the marketplace right now. |
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utherdoul
Tufted Titmouse
Joined: Oct 15, 2009
Age: 22
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| zer0netgain wrote: | Education is like any other resource or investment. It's value depends on what it can do for you after you obtain it.
It's overpriced and undervalued in the marketplace right now. |
Ultimately it all depends on the student. If you major in a field which has a shortage of skilled people the debt you wrack up can usually be paid off quickly. If you major in something not in demand (such as eastern religions, or art history of the 14th century) your employment opportunities are much more limited and the debt you accumulate is much harder to pay off.
What people need to do is look at what they really want to do, see what kind of return you'll get on your education investment and decide its worth it. If you really want to major in Eastern Religions or Philosophy and can accept that your employment opportunities will be more limited then go for it because the education will be worth it to you. People sometimes jump into degree programs without a thought of what they'll do after they complete whatever level of education they can/will pay for. A girl I knew majored in acting in college spent a ton of money on it and then ended up having to move back in with her parents taking a retail job making slightly less than I did even though she was older and had more education. |
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asplint
Butterfly
Joined: Oct 18, 2009
Posts: 15
Location: Washington, DC metro area
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Hello Wombat,
I know the feeling. Corporate politics can be ugly. That's why I have my own business (see below).
That said, Wombat, have you run your own business?
It involves much longer hours, waiting months if not years for a significant income, being a jack of all trades (you can't just work your specialty, you also have to advertise, market yourself and bring in and then service customers), imagination, creativity, flexibility...
...and a good deal of kissing up. Just this time, the kissing up is for the clients and prospective clients themselves instead of a boss. If you work for someone and you offend a customer, the boss may only glare at you or give you a warning as long as it is not too frequent.
When you're the owner, any client you tick off means that much less money in your pocket (and even less money when you consider that a ticked-off person will probably tell several other people to pass you by).
Whether you have a blue-collar or a white-collar specialty, the trade-off is the same. A plumber, electrician or carpenter, for example, can work for a firm or can hire himself out. (In fact, my father worked as a union electrician and also ran his own alarm system business on the side.)
Education may indeed prepare people better to work for companies than to work for themselves (or rather, directly for clients). There are exceptions, of course.
To digress a bit, speaking as an Ivy League graduate with a doctorate in Economics I think education is substantially overrated in picking good employees. Beyond certain jobs where a given degree level is absolutely, positively required (eg, lawyers or doctors) and a few industries where in some firms prestigious schools are emphasized (consulting, investment banking and tutoring come to mind), education - degree level/name of school/GPA/etc - counts most for your first job or two.
After that, employers basically care about your experience: what did you accomplish, how much money did you make/save for the company, who can speak well of you, what do your boss and colleagues think of you, etc.
Education is meant to give you a start, not to carry you along throughout your career.
NB: School ties can be very good for networking purposes. If you want to get in touch with, say, a manager at a firm you want to work for and you and she went to, say, University of the State of Confusion - that's a conversation point right there. (If you both were there at the same time, that's a bonus.)
What do you think?
_________________
Jeff Deutsch
Life Coach & Presenter
A SPLINT - ASPies LInking with NTs
http://www.asplint.com |
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david_42
Sea Gull
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
Posts: 211
Location: PNW, USA
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | If you read books from 100 years ago the term "hired man" was an insult. |
Meaningless reference. 100 years ago most people were either farm workers or house help. Less than 5% of the population were in professional categories that required education above the grade school level. |
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blackomen
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Sep 09, 2009
Posts: 70
Location: San Jose, USA
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| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| And in places where the supply of educated persons vastly dominates demand, like China, even many workers out in the fields have 4 year degrees or higher.. |
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