And they call themselves "professionals"

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Through my own persistance I finally got my husband in see a therapist who diagnosed Aspergers.

I look back at letters I sent to my husband's original Psychologist and General Practitioner. This was before I even knew about the existence of AS or any of its symptoms. My letters explain the issues my husband has

"extremely difficult communicating with him as he veers off subject, interrupts me and takes things I say completely the wrong way"
"no friends and appears not to have any interest in pursuing friendships"
"dependent on me to sort out what needs to be done and tell him how to manage various issues"
"unable to forgive arguments from years ago and will bring them up over and over again and never happy with the answers or apologies that I give"
"obsessive compulsive symtoms"
"extremely anxious about sudden changes of plans or disruption to domestic arrangements"
"talking to himself"
"aggression, a 'what about me' attitude, threats, yelling and no consideration for the effect his behaviour is having on other family members"
"verbally abusing me because the cooker was accidently turned off or a gardening fork was put in the wrong place"
"persistently questions me about why I have not made things right for him in the past"
"irrational and frightening behaviour"
"we are separated but he still comes to the house to do his usual routines (eg: shower, cook etc) when I am not around"
"bouts of crying, depression, drinking alcohol to excess, threats of suicide"

The Pychologist eventually told me after 10 months, that she finds my husband very resistant to treatment and that he reverts all conversation back to his favourite topics.
The GP has seen my husband many, many times to treat his depression and anxiety. He has certainly been witness to the non-stop talking of my husband. Also when my husband takes our daughter to the doctor, it is my 10 year old daughter who speaks to the doctor whilst my husband weighs himself and checks his height (this is one of his obsessions).

So I look back at all of this and wonder why these so called "professionals" did not even consider Aspergers. Did they think I was just some interfering "wife" with my letters and comments? There were many other professionals that were involved over the years.
We have the diagnosis now of Aspergers, major depressive disorder and ocd. but it has taken 10 years. 10 years of trying to explain to people that "things are not right" and that this is not just a case of an "abusive type man".
At the moment my husband has lost his job, lost confidence, is terrified to try new things, and threatens suicide when he has one of his meltdowns. I wish I had known 10 years ago what I know today for the sake of all of us.

The description of your husband measures that exactly of my ex-husband. We were married for 23 years and I found many things bazzar but could not figure it out, we have been divorced 7 years. It was only in trying to figure out my sons issues that I realized he has AS and then realized it was me too as I had tried to explain to therapists my life long issues of not fitting in, but they never got it and tried to convince me that I would one day be normal. Then the penny dropped about my ex.

Perhaps this belongs in "The Haven" as your husband is not a child and you have not posed a question, so I must conclude you are "venting".

I fell compelled to make a few comments concerning your husband's behavior.

Your husband may very well have AS, but many of these traits are not characteristics of AS and are more likely to be a result of his upbringing or some personality disorder. For example, adults with AS aren't inherently needy with respect to needing to be told what to do. I find this is far more common in individuals who had very "caring" mothers and never really had a chance to tackle the world on their own. My father was like this until my parents divorced and he lived by himself for the first time in his life. People who are inherently followers, underachievers, or passive aggressive may also insist on being told what to do. I don't think people with AS are needy in such a way any more than the general population. In fact many people with AS do their best when people don't tell them what to do.

It seems there are some children with AS who are aggressive towards other people but this isn't so much a characteristic of AS, as it is a characteristic of a child who is stressed or feels threatened. I think adults with AS are more likely to be reserved in their anger and I don't think AS is an excuse or a reason for aggression into adulthood.

"Irrational and frightening behavior" is vague so I can't say much on it, but combined with the depression and drinking I really think there is probably more than AS and OCD going on here and I don't think that knowing he had AS would have solved much of anything. You should not have tolerated some of these behaviors either way.

Sounds a bit like bipolar to me...If he is sincere about all this. Could also be only to wind you up, and then I would go towards narcissist...Could be a mix, but it could also just be a very strong depression...
There might be traits of AS but I agree that that's not the only issue , well it's just my opinion and I'm not a doctor obviously.

It MIGHT be bipolar ALSO(Depression cauusing the anger, and thoughts of suicide), but that can ALSO be from problems from AS which TECHNICALLY wouldn't be chemical depression/

He DOES have some AS traits. And some, like:

"extremely difficult communicating with him as he veers off subject, interrupts me and takes things I say completely the wrong way"

may be because of YOU! Females often think and communicate in a different way, and males are left trying to translate. Apparently MOST males have that problem.

Things like:
"dependent on me to sort out what needs to be done and tell him how to manage various issues"

Maybe it is only important to YOU.

and:

"unable to forgive arguments from years ago and will bring them up over and over again and never happy with the answers or apologies that I give"

Hey, if YOU pushed them, or started them, how could you apologize now. Apologies are nice, if given without request or provocation, but they don't change things. Try to improve similar situations. If he notices, that is BETTER than a mere apology. If he doesn't, you still may never have the problem again.

as for:

"aggression, a 'what about me' attitude, threats, yelling and no consideration for the effect his behaviour is having on other family members"

How does he express the agression? Are the threats physical ones against you?

Hopefully, I have given you some things to consider.

And in all the time you have known him, has his height ever changed?

In my own experience, the "professionals" are simply not geared toward looking below the immediate co-morbid symptoms and seeing underlying autism in adults, and especially if/when the adult has seemed to function fairly well for a number of years.

I hope that things work out for your family and that your husband gets the help that he needs.

Your husband also sounds exactly like my ex in a lot of ways. I actually found AS trying to figure out what "his issue" was all those years ago in our relationship. Now that my son has been diagnosed, I have a completely different perspective regarding my ex husband's issues. Many of his issues are not AS-related, especially the pathological and psychotic bits which make him more narcissist than ASD.

For a long time, I thought of my ex whenever I thought of ASD. It caused me to avoid sincerely pushing for an ASD dx for my child because I equated ASD with that one guy's symptomology. Now that I am clearer and completely out of that relationship as per years, I see the ASD in myself as well. I am very much not that guy, but I have my own set of issues and problems when attempting romantic (or most other) relationships.

I agree with 2ukenkerl and Chronos in a lot of respects. It takes two people to have a troubled relationship, AS or no AS. Oftentimes the issues that one person can "manage" on their own become something beyond manageable in the "wrong" relationship.

Further, my ex is unable to care for himself in general and moved back in with his mother (he went from his mother to me and back to his mother even though he's in his late 30s now). I don't think that's because of AS, I think that's because he's not had to learn how to function on his own and/or hasn't been supported to do that, ever, in his life. I hate reading that HF-ASD and AS people are incapable of managing life, because it's (more often than not) untrue and it isn't a symptom of either spectrum disorder.

Most shrinks want to "fix" the issues that present themselves (as per leejosepho's comment) and often miss the underlying cause. ASD alone wouldn't cover all of your husband's issues or what it is about the relationship between the two of you that has become unmanageable.

What I always find bizarre about these threads is that you were married in the first place. Obviously, he couldn't have been like this when you married or you wouldn't have fallen in love with him. His AS didn't change, so what did? My guess it is just a particularly deep depression, which needs to be treated, and he needs to move on with his job. Then everything will probably be closer to how it was.

agree, probably should move this to ?

I'm "that" guy and have no faith in professionals ! or any one else who doesnt understand..I had to do it myself and figure it out.......even when I told them all of the signs

here's MY "aspie X" view.......in retrospect, keep in mind this is MY view,

"extremely difficult communicating with him as he veers off subject, interrupts me and takes things I say completely the wrong way"
>say what you mean,mean what you say,dont say it repeatedly over and over just worded differently trying to get your way, its a 2 way conversation isnt it? I need to say before I forget that...., get to the point,....aspie

"no friends and appears not to have any interest in pursuing friendships"
>just found too many bad traits in others, to most misunderstood anyway, would rather have one or two "real" friends than 200 people who dont really care, would rather persue intrests

"unable to forgive arguments from years ago and will bring them up over and over again and never happy with the answers or apologies that I give"
>sorry just doesnt cut it, what went wrong?, why? how can we avoid that from happening again?

"obsessive compulsive symtoms"
>ummmmm yep, like things a certain way....for a reason....


"extremely anxious about sudden changes of plans or disruption to domestic arrangements"
>No I didnt want her guy friend(who happened to be obsesses with her) his wife(of the same name) and their three brats moving into my house.didnt even ask...?.or maxing out credit cards to pay his child support, we had plans...now someone else has changed them for me

"talking to himself"
> thinking out loud, sorting it out, so what,.. anyone listening care....

"aggression, a 'what about me' attitude, threats, yelling and no consideration for the effect his behaviour is having on other family members"
> I have feelings, intense feelings, no concideration for how family members were effecting his behavior, what if I did that to someone......."your embarassing me"...your embarrased.....I'm having a melt down, and you caused it

"verbally abusing me because the cooker was accidently turned off or a gardening fork was put in the wrong place"
>why was it put in the wrong place, I did leave it here , didnt I , if the cooker was accidentally"oh accidents dont happen by the way its a series of neglected moments that had gone unchecked or dismissed as not important) and now I have to worry about the cooker being left on. is it verbal abuse to explain why that would be bad,

"persistently questions me about why I have not made things right for him in the past"
> I understand , He doesnt know why...

"irrational and frightening behaviour"
> you mean irrational for a na or a meltdown, or frustration

"we are separated but he still comes to the house to do his usual routines (eg: shower, cook etc) when I am not around"
> usual routines,,under the radar

"bouts of crying, depression, drinking alcohol to excess, threats of suicide"
>again..intense feelings, I dont drink..I know its a depresant and how it effects me, which leads to depression, which leads...

Professionals , no I have no faith in them ,Or anyone who doesnt understand . Why didnt anyone see ALL the signs

I'm so much better that she isnt pressing all the wrong buttons and poking me with that stick. Just wish everyone else would stop

Really>I came home from work to find my dining room table, that seats 6 and has matching chairs, was a rectangle is now a square..?? She decided,without asking, it would be better. Now it seats just 4 and can only get 2 chairs under its sides. so now I mention these facts, No I didnt freak out, just told her, and wondered her thinking. How is this better? And she is po'd at me !
I didnt ruin a table, that was a gift... from her dad.

If she did use any tool it was probably for the wrong purpose and is now damaged, and missing.

If I asked that left overs from diner be saved so I can take them to work. I would prefer that you put them away and not leave them on the stove for 5 hours while your on the computer And only do so just before I return from work? because I was getting sick a little too often to be normal. ....

....whose the inconciderate one with no empathy?...
And yes I'm even nervous right now putting these feelings into text, let alone trying to be heard and understood

FYI, IMO Argentina did the right thing ! Just no one else did.

Ever hear the saying "love is blind"? It is. All of us, NT or AS, overlook heaps when we meet a person. Even if we don't ignore "red flags", sometimes those little niggling things about a person can finally get to you after x number of years. It happens with friends and it happens with lovers.

I married my ex because nobody had ever paid so much attention to me in my whole life. I thought it was a positive thing until I'd spent three months without even being able to shower by myself.

As an AS person, I used to obsess about relationships. I think the way I was raised (get a man) taught me that there was only one path to success for most women (get a man) and after so many years of having it ingrained in my psyche (get a man), I turned my personal focus and vision into the Cinderella business (get a man) and I would hazard a guess that a lot of other AS and AC people do that as well. I don't think our society equips us to enter into any romantic relationships in a rational or logical way.

To suggest someone "couldn't have been like this when you married" is condescending and troubling. Sure they could have. Maybe they weren't. We don't know what they were like. If they were difficult prior to marriage it is easy to not see that when you're in love or telling yourself that "red flag" meant nothing or you're creating problems where they don't exist. Relationships aren't simple.

AS didn't 'exist' (it did, but it didn't..) until quite recently. Even these days, it's a 1 hour lecture and possibly an encounter during a 3 month psychiatry rotation in med school. For most doctors, that's it, unless they choose to specialise in psych.

I imagine your GP probably graduated well before it became more well known. I'm not sure why your psychiatrist didn't consider it at least, but even if he had, there is a chance he thought it was more likely something else. For every possible psychiatric dx, there's nearly always at least 2 more just as likely...

Anyway, sorry you've had so much difficulty. I hope it gets better from here on..

As someone with HFA I think this statement is incredibly niave and shows very little understanding of the sensory issues involved in autism. Sure I could do many things, but not without literally killing myself. Sensory issues which are extreme, mean that I struggle to stand on the street and I sure as hell cannot turn on a vacuum, even with ear plugs. I cannot handle the smells of many cleaning products, cannot handle any raw foods, even with gloves, and I have not been able to learn to peel and chop up a carrot or patato for instance with a knife and fork, when they are rare, let alone be able to pick them off the shelf in the store.

As for the help I now recieve it took me 20 years after I became an adult to get that help and I have no family and no support. I was living on one or two foods and they spent 10 years trying to teach me every day what to do and not succeeding. I can assure you it would have been much easier to give up than put up with the torment they put me through, and I was told the whole time that I would never ever get any assistance with anything as I could learn to do it all. Given that I now get a whole 4 hours a week I hardly find that a huge amount given the amounts of troubles that I have. I cannot go out alone to public places as I become so overwhelmed, with sites and sounds, smells and the like that I space out and become totally disoriented.

Just becuase I am not intellecutally disabled, does not mean I am not profoundly autisitc, and I am so so so sick of being told that I can just cure myself and learn to look after myself. I would love not to have the problems that I have, and I would love to be able to be "normal". Please explain to me how it is that I am supposed to cure myself of autism, just because I am not intellectually disabled. Telling me to cure myself of autism and that I should just be able to do things is akin to telling someone in a wheelchair you know how to do it, so just make yourself do it, Just because I have an intellectualy comprehension of something, does not mean I can do it, and it is people like you that makes the lives of people like me all the more diffiuclt. The reality is that a thousand interventions could be put in place to support me to be part of the community, to have some form of part time work or the like, but because I am not intellectually disabled, I am just supposed to "fix" myself.

I apologise if I offended you. If you read back over my other posts you might be surprised. I most assuredly never suggested that you cure yourself of autism or that anyone should. As you said, it took you over 20 years to get assistance. I think that sucks. My son is also not intellectually disabled (nor am I) and we experience on a daily basis the suggestion that autism isn't a disabling condition. In fact, in our country, we're not eligible for a number of services for my son because he isn't intellectually disabled.

What I said in this quote is exactly what I meant. HF-ASD and AS do not include "incapable of managing life" as part of the diagnosis. The OP suggested on her list that "dependent on me to sort out what needs to be done and tell him how to manage various issues" was something that was "overlooked" when they didn't get an AS diagnosis at first. Many of us ARE capable even if we need help that is specific to our own individual needs and requirements. I hope that clarifies my position.

I'm sorry you were dismissed and didn't get assistance for so long and that you continue to be dismissed. I am very aware of the sensory issues around autism. My son has them and so do I. I was forced into "dealing" with them from childhood and didn't do such a great job at that for many of my adult years. I have to make a lot of concessions in daily life to deal with them to date. It is crap that you are still struggling and aren't getting the assistance you need. It is crap that my son isn't eligible for any services at all and the only way I can help him is to stay at home and be his therapist, his OT, his teacher, his mother, his dad, etc., and deal with the "real world" on top of that all because it "looks" like I'm "coping."

I hope that one day if enough people speak out the intellectual disability issue will no longer be an issue. I am sorry you are struggling so much and apologise sincerely if my response touched a nerve and you felt that I was being dismissive of the struggles you are facing.

Thank you for the clarification. Autism has only been considered a disability in its own right for 2 years here, but that has not yet meant that anyone has recieved help on the basis of it, that is known by the states autism associations. The help I get is from aged care services and is pathetic in and of itself. What I had before that was mental health services, that kept trying to fix me, and I was not legally entitled to anything else. The aged care services happened because of a glitch in the legislation that allows some younger people to slip through and the fact that the manager of the services in my area has a child with autism and gets it. I do as of a few weeks ago, now have a disability legal service assisting me to fight to get disability services, which due to the change of law 2 years ago, I am entiteld to, but they don't get it. They cannot see it, so it does not exist.

I do agree that I can manage many things, but the other reality is that even if I can't I do not need someone to take over, I need them to support me in doing it. The push in intellectual disabilities is on supported decision making. A bit like children, we help them to make decisions that are appropriate for them to make and do not simply make them all for them. We have at times a very paternalisitic attitude to the intellectually disabled and seem to make all decisions for them, when the vast majority are only mildly intellectually disabled and can function at the level of the average 14-15 year old. Sure they need more advice and support than the average person, but that does not mean they need to told what to eat, wear, etc, etc. And the decisions that they cannot make alone, should be made with them not for them. It is about doing things with people and not for them or too them. Even when I have staff cooking I just stand there and stir the pot or something, and while it is pathetic, and I know I am not doing anything I at least feel part of it, and to me that is important.

Autism is not considered a disability that requires much specialist assistance (other than aides in school classrooms) for people ages six to sixteen. My son gets bugger all based on "autism". That's why I home educate. That's why a lot of us home educate. They will happily "find a group home" for kids who turn sixteen and help them get on disability payments, but if you miss out on "early intervention" and get screwed during school age, that's the best you are looking at in Ozstraya. It's pathetic, really. I actually had an autism advisor come to my home and tell me there wasn't anything they could offer us but that they would help me "find a group home" when my son turns 16. Over my dead body really. I just casually shot back that we were going to be looking into entering university at that age and not so much interested in the group home idea.