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Nekaru
Hummingbird
Joined: Aug 25, 2011
Posts: 18
Location: Phoenix Arizona
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 Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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But that's just it. She wants to renew the restraining order for 3 years. However as I said above he turns 18 April 11th next year. How can she do this if he could overturn it when he's 18. Does it mean she's already declared him as incompetent? Can they do it before the minor turns 18? At this point with her saying that in the renewal to make it for 3 years, I have the bad feeling that she already declared it or found some way to make him not remove it when he's 18.
Also @Dave110. Don't! Spam calling or spam mailing will make her put a restraining order on one of you. That's how it was put on me. I tried to call a few times to reason with her and the rest of his family at what they were doing and to tell them how Francis felt about it in attempt to help him. They instead took it as harassment and filed the Civil Harassment RO. Calling is not the best idea. Besides, she changed all her numbers, emails, etc. Snail Mail is the only way to reach her. |
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DW_a_mom
Ignoring the To-Do List
Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 9301
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:52 am Post subject: |
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Here's your homework. IMHO.
1) Write down what your know of your friend, the ways he has demonstrated independent life skills. List specific instances, if you know of them. Has he successfully managed money, negotiated major or minor purchases? Can he drive or find his way on public transportation? Does he cook, do laundry, or otherwise demonstrate self-care? Does he know mitigation techniques for preventing or managing his own meltdowns? Has he advocated for himself at school, or shown maturity in a difficult situation? Has he made and kept appointments of any sort? Has he worked in any paid or volunteer job that would have required him to meet a schedule and show responsibility?
2) Look up the timing requirements for competency filing in the applicable state. Go to a law library. See what your window is.
3) Look up the process, if the court will be appointing a social worker, lawyer, or other third party to represent the minor.
You will not, under any circumstances, contact anyone covered in the restraining order. But, perhaps, if you get your paperwork in order, you may be able to eventually either contact a court appointed advocate for your friend, or file some sort of statement with the court.
Sit down and go through the process first.
You will have to approach this smart, not emotionally.
_________________
Mom to an amazing AS boy (plus a non-AS daughter). Have at least a few AS genes myself, although probably more NT than AS.
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Think of the greening of my name as an emeritus thing; I used to be a moderator but am retired and have no authority to act |
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Nekaru
Hummingbird
Joined: Aug 25, 2011
Posts: 18
Location: Phoenix Arizona
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:56 am Post subject: |
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The hearing to fight the restraining order is this Friday. Which is why I'm asking. Is it possible she's already had his rights removed for when he turns 18 (as in declared him incompetent before he even turns 18 ) and that's why she's asking for a 3 year renewal on it. Or is she just asking 3 years in hope that the judge will overlook the fact he'll be 18 next year?
Is there anyway of knowing ahead of time? |
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-Skeksis-
Snowy Owl
Joined: Oct 09, 2011
Posts: 159
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 6:14 am Post subject: |
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OP, you need legal counsel. Nobody here is qualified to answer your questions or to advise you. This is a support forum, not a legal one.
If you feel your minor friend is being abused, report it to the police so a legal intervention can be undertaken. Coming here trying to rally support could unwittingly involve others who do not want to get or be involved.
I'm not comfortable with this topic. I've retracted my earlier statement and want no contact in any form from the parties involved in this dispute. That being said, I withdraw from this thread. |
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Nekaru
Hummingbird
Joined: Aug 25, 2011
Posts: 18
Location: Phoenix Arizona
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:54 am Post subject: |
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I'm ... sorry? >.<
I wasn't trying to rally support, just get advice on what I could do and information pertaining to autism. I wasn't asking legal, but whether or not one would assume she already has declared him incompetent or not... I don't care about the RO or legalities of this a all. I just came here to find out what could be done, where to turn, how to help him.. I only mentioned the RO to see if you think because of the 3 year thing that if she got him declared incompetent already or is bluffing. Because if she did, he's doomed.
It wasn't meant to drag anyone into any legal matters. The above poster that PMd is the uncle. He's stalking every support site I try to get help on and posting the police information. He tried it on the Facebook group too..
I'm sorry.. I did not intend for anyone to be dragged into legal matters...
....Sorry.
Last edited by Nekaru on Wed Oct 26, 2011 8:03 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Gedrene
Never give in. Always find a way.
Joined: Jul 10, 2011
Posts: 2725
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 8:02 am Post subject: |
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| Nekaru wrote: | I'm ... sorry? >.<
I wasn't trying to rally support, just get advice on what I could do and information pertaining to autism. I wasn't asking legal, but whether or not one would assume she already has declared him incompetent or nto...
....Sorry. |
Don't be sorry. Whatever anyone says asking for support against a wrongdoing isn't wrong. |
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jackbus01
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
Age: 40
Posts: 1197
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:31 am Post subject: |
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Have you posted this to any other forums. You really need legal advice here. I would find some legal forums on the internet, summarize your question and post there. You should care about the legalities of it, because the key question is whether this person was declared incompetent or not. I would assume the burden would be on the mother to prove competency. Do you think your friend would be able to defend themselves in a court hearing to determine competency?
I like the advice from DW_a_mom. |
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DW_a_mom
Ignoring the To-Do List
Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 9301
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| Nekaru wrote: | The hearing to fight the restraining order is this Friday. Which is why I'm asking. Is it possible she's already had his rights removed for when he turns 18 (as in declared him incompetent before he even turns 18 ) and that's why she's asking for a 3 year renewal on it. Or is she just asking 3 years in hope that the judge will overlook the fact he'll be 18 next year?
Is there anyway of knowing ahead of time? |
I think you need to remove your focus from the restraining order, and keep your mind on where and if you can help your friend regardless of a restraining order, within the legal parameters exisring for you with or without such an order. Your focus on that factor seems like a dead end to me. I'm pretty sure there are ways to remove restraining orders after they are in place, btw, so you can afford to let some time pass.
I am also pretty sure you would have a right to make an appearance in court when she tries to extend the order to plead your side by apologizing for what came across as rash or erratic behavior (she couldn't have gotten the order unless that was the case) and reiterate that the only reason you took any of those actions was because you were genuinely concerned for your friend. But you aren't going to be effective with that unless you start approaching all of this smarter.
What I'm suggesting is that you stop panicking and start doing. Don't ask us what the law is, do some research and find out what it is. Doing that will show to the court you are responsible and rational. Do I think the mom could have finalized a guardianship this far ahead of his 18th birthday? No, I do not, but she will certainly have been working on the related documents. Getting the result you want in court is never a matter of showing up in court and providing a spur of the moment emotional appeal. It always requires preparation and an understanding of the law. We aren't lawyers; we can't do that for you (and even if we were, we wouldn't for a variety of practical reasons).
If you want to get anything straightened out in this you need preparation and an understanding of the law. Which is why I suggested you do your homework.
Demonstrate through mature and carefully thought out actions that you are interested in your friend's welfare first and foremost, and demonstrate that you are no threat by acting like a responsible adult, doing your homework, and going through the proper channels with well prepared petitions.
Plus, the family cannot harass you if you are in a law library doing research, or quietly writing up everything you know that could prove competence. You'll remove some of the power they have over you. Right now they know every move you are going to make and every worry you have because you've published it, and that gives them power. If you genuinely believe they are not working in your friend's best interest, then you need to take some of your own power back by getting your own homework done.
To be honest, I have no idea at all if you have any chance at the "win" you want, but I still think the process I've suggested is worth it, because if nothing else it will help you get your head on straight about what has happened and what could happen.
IMHO.
Also ... If trying to dig into the legal research is too overwhelming, see if you can find a local legal aid organization. They might be able to help you with the basic process questions.
I know that nothing I'm suggesting is easy, but nothing about empowerment ever is.
_________________
Mom to an amazing AS boy (plus a non-AS daughter). Have at least a few AS genes myself, although probably more NT than AS.
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Think of the greening of my name as an emeritus thing; I used to be a moderator but am retired and have no authority to act |
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Nekaru
Hummingbird
Joined: Aug 25, 2011
Posts: 18
Location: Phoenix Arizona
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:03 am Post subject: |
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Lost the hearing, judge made the RO for 3 years. ( I think she was against me due to that appeal I started, since it made her look bad. Since she kinda went from nice and fair in the first hearing, to a grade a b**** within the 6 months of the RO.)
Sorry about not getting back to everyone sooner, was kinda depressed and torn up over that...
But I've been researching like DW_a_mom said, and I think I found some good news...
First of all, yes, the mother did mention she'd try to declare him unfit to take care of himself in the court hearing. That was her and her lawyers response to me saying it'd make no sense to make it for 3 years if in 6 months when he turns 18, he could simply take himself off it...
But through research I found, http://www.disabilityrightsca.org/pubs/500501.pdf
She CANNOT declare him incompetent before he is 18. She has to do it when he's 18 or it's a restraining of rights before the child reaches the age of majority (doesn't allow them to prove the parent wrong.)
So... if someone NOT ME, or affiliated with me in any way but is acting upon their own interest (he has other friends) was there the exact day he turns 18? (In Cali) and went to pick him up and take him away from her house and he WANTED to go. (Remember he wants to escape her... if she hasn't totally changed his thinking by then.) Would it be kidnapping? Or is there ANY charge she could press against the person picking him up? Since she won't have been able to declare him incompetent at that time.
I think if it happens like that it'd give him more of a chance to fight her when she petitions it, because he'll be 1. Away from the house and have access to legal information and help by that friend. And 2. Be able to get a lawyer and prove he's not incompetent. Also 3. Be able to choose his own psychiatrist to be evaluated by instead of that one that's under her pay.
Yay or nay plan? |
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number2
Toucan
Joined: Sep 10, 2011
Age: 22
Posts: 288
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| When I was 14 I was phyically abused by a family member, I was too afarid to tell anyone because I thought I was the cause of all the problems and I slowly became more angry inside. |
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Gedrene
Never give in. Always find a way.
Joined: Jul 10, 2011
Posts: 2725
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Nekaru wrote: | Lost the hearing, judge made the RO for 3 years. ( I think she was against me due to that appeal I started, since it made her look bad. Since she kinda went from nice and fair in the first hearing, to a grade a b**** within the 6 months of the RO.)
Sorry about not getting back to everyone sooner, was kinda depressed and torn up over that...
But I've been researching like DW_a_mom said, and I think I found some good news...
First of all, yes, the mother did mention she'd try to declare him unfit to take care of himself in the court hearing. That was her and her lawyers response to me saying it'd make no sense to make it for 3 years if in 6 months when he turns 18, he could simply take himself off it...
But through research I found, http://www.disabilityrightsca.org/pubs/500501.pdf
She CANNOT declare him incompetent before he is 18. She has to do it when he's 18 or it's a restraining of rights before the child reaches the age of majority (doesn't allow them to prove the parent wrong.)
So... if someone NOT ME, or affiliated with me in any way but is acting upon their own interest (he has other friends) was there the exact day he turns 18? (In Cali) and went to pick him up and take him away from her house and he WANTED to go. (Remember he wants to escape her... if she hasn't totally changed his thinking by then.) Would it be kidnapping? Or is there ANY charge she could press against the person picking him up? Since she won't have been able to declare him incompetent at that time.
I think if it happens like that it'd give him more of a chance to fight her when she petitions it, because he'll be 1. Away from the house and have access to legal information and help by that friend. And 2. Be able to get a lawyer and prove he's not incompetent. Also 3. Be able to choose his own psychiatrist to be evaluated by instead of that one that's under her pay.
Yay or nay plan? |
Yea. This is clearly unfair. |
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DW_a_mom
Ignoring the To-Do List
Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 9301
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Nekaru wrote: |
So... if someone NOT ME, or affiliated with me in any way but is acting upon their own interest (he has other friends) was there the exact day he turns 18? (In Cali) and went to pick him up and take him away from her house and he WANTED to go. (Remember he wants to escape her... if she hasn't totally changed his thinking by then.) Would it be kidnapping? Or is there ANY charge she could press against the person picking him up? Since she won't have been able to declare him incompetent at that time.
I think if it happens like that it'd give him more of a chance to fight her when she petitions it, because he'll be 1. Away from the house and have access to legal information and help by that friend. And 2. Be able to get a lawyer and prove he's not incompetent. Also 3. Be able to choose his own psychiatrist to be evaluated by instead of that one that's under her pay.
Yay or nay plan? |
Running away is never a good plan. He isn't going to win in court just by not physically being there; it would be taken as a huge strike against him, and probably all of you. What you have suggested isn't what responsible, mature people DO. Right now ALL of you need to act mature and responsible, and not as if you are living in some spy fantasy novel. His family are not his captors, even if looks that way from your descriptions. They are his family.
He has EVERY RIGHT to meet with a lawyer before his 18th birthday and be prepared for this hearing. If he hasn't had that ability, all he will have to do at the first hearing should be to SAY so, "I challenge this and have not been allowed access to my own representation."
If his friends want to arrange for an attorney to contact him on his birthday, in case he hasn't been able to meet with an attorney on his own, that can probably be done, and the lawyer will be able to insist on a PRIVATE meeting, assuming the friend agrees, and would be able to make the arguments in my last paragraph in court on his behalf.
Glad to hear you are doing research. Keep going, see if you can find what factors have weighed in whose favors in these types of hearings.
_________________
Mom to an amazing AS boy (plus a non-AS daughter). Have at least a few AS genes myself, although probably more NT than AS.
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Think of the greening of my name as an emeritus thing; I used to be a moderator but am retired and have no authority to act |
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TheygoMew
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 04, 2010
Posts: 1024
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| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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It doesn't sound like the mother is autistic. Possibly a personality disorder.
She didn't wear sunglasses in the court over sensory issues, she wore them out of being paranoid. She's very manipulative and controlling. She's stunting him and not caring if she hurts him.
I have no good advice except hopefully he can defend himself somehow. Does he have family elsewhere that he can go to? I've had to leave my own family who were abusive. |
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AspieRoss
Tufted Titmouse
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Joined: Nov 23, 2011
Posts: 48
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:19 pm Post subject: He can sue her for Emancipation! |
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EMANCIPATION - The legal term used to describe the point at which parents are no longer responsible for their children and children are no longer answerable to their parents. This usually occurs at the age of 18. However, emancipation may sometimes occur earlier if and when the parent and child have agreed to live independently, the child has joined the military, the child has married, or a court has granted an appropriate petition to declare a child emancipated. Emancipation also affects a child's legal rights and responsibilities.
The child must sue the parent to terminate parental rights and gain emancipation, essentially they are declared an adult. |
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_Book_Worm_
Emu Egg
Joined: Sep 03, 2011
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| It sounds like she has munchausen by proxy syndrome. |
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