Wolfheart
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 18, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 2971
Location: Kent, England
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 Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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| MXH wrote: | | again wolfheart, I like you are trying to help people here but this is just a bit too out there in optimism land. Ive been trying this out for many years to no avail. |
The intention of this thread isn't to give advice on how to attract a hundred women or how to be a player, it isn't going to be a miracle cure or make you an Adonis over night. It's simply describing what I have found works best when it comes to overcoming social anxiety and negative thought patterns so they can have a more positive outlook or attitude when it comes to approaching the dating scene.
I never stated that my advice was the only thing for everyone, that would be biased of me. I understand that altering negative core beliefs and thought patterns can be a very complex process, it's something that must be approached with sensitivity and on an individual basis.
| MXH wrote: |
Not that its impossible to do. II find theyre easy things to do in the heat of battle. Just not exactly as miraculous claims as theyre made out to be. Pretty much hes just saying to go after another girl, she says no then repeat. Thats not fixing the problem, thats called shotgun approach. |
In regards to the shotgun approach? I think it's a good approach because after all, it is direct and instant for people who create a good first impression and speeds up the process of finding a potential date or someone who will give you a chance. If someone can learn to create a good first impression and escalate quickly, the shotgun method is good.
As for the sniper rifle approach you have mentioned in the past, I have never discouraged against anyone using that method and I have actually recommended that method in many threads towards guys and girls that struggle to make a good first impression.
Last edited by Wolfheart on Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:01 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Wolfheart
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 18, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 2971
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, good to see you are making positive changes too.
| Zinnel wrote: | | Why should you be proud? Because not everyone experiences the same amount of failure in their life, nobody does. So if you have really had that much failure in your life, and you can still carry on. It means you have a strength that very few people have and while it may not be visiable its still there. |
Great response for anyone that feels they don't have anything to build their confidence on  I couldn't have said it any better.
| 1000knives wrote: | | One last point, regarding failure, I know now not to pass up opportunities put in front of you, and it's better to suffer a few minutes of awkwardness that'll work out and end one way or the other, than face your life in regret, which I now face everyday. Regret is probably the worst emotion around. |
Great advice also, it's better to roll the dice and see how it lands instead of giving up faith, trying your best with the cards you have is the best you can do.
Reminds me of this quote http://thinkexist.com/quotation/it_is_not_the_critic_who_counts-not_the_man_who/12121.html
| mds_02 wrote: | | It stings, but it's about reminding yourself that you've not actually lost anything by being rejected. Realizing that, after being rejected, you are no worse off than if you hadn't tried in the first place. And, once you have had some successes, you realize that the positive feelings more than outweigh the negatives that come with failure. |
The nothing to lose, something to gain approach is one of the best to take, great advice here also. |
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MXH
TomCat
Joined: Jul 29, 2010
Age: 22
Posts: 12469
Location: Here i stand and face the rain
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Wolfheart wrote: | | MXH wrote: | | again wolfheart, I like you are trying to help people here but this is just a bit too out there in optimism land. Ive been trying this out for many years to no avail. |
The intention of this thread isn't to give advice on how to attract a hundred women or how to be a player, it isn't going to be a miracle cure or make you an Adonis over night. It's simply describing what I have found works best when it comes to overcoming social anxiety and negative thought patterns so they can have a more positive outlook or attitude when it comes to approaching the dating scene.
I never stated that my advice was the only thing for everyone, that would be biased of me. I understand that altering negative core beliefs and thought patterns can be a very complex process, it's something that must be approached with sensitivity and on an individual basis.
| MXH wrote: |
Not that its impossible to do. II find theyre easy things to do in the heat of battle. Just not exactly as miraculous claims as theyre made out to be. Pretty much hes just saying to go after another girl, she says no then repeat. Thats not fixing the problem, thats called shotgun approach. |
In regards to the shotgun approach? I think it's a good approach because after all, it is direct and instant for people who create a good first impression and speeds up the process of finding a potential date or someone who will give you a chance. If someone can learn to create a good first impression and escalate quickly, the shotgun method is good.
As for the sniper rifle approach you have mentioned in the past, I have never discouraged against anyone using that method and I have actually recommended that method in many threads towards guys and girls that struggle to make a good first impression. |
Umm, those two things contradict themselves. Shotgun approach is more for picking up women, if youre looking for someone worth a relationship you need something more personal/specific than just going for whoever says yes. Otherwise i dont see the relationship lasting more than a week. |
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hyperlexian
loves the man who typed too much and ran outta spa
Joined: Jul 22, 2010
Age: 41
Posts: 21969
Location: with bucephalus
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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| The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | | Quote: | I agree. relationships don't work for everyone, and even the people who end up involved with someone could end up split-up and therefore alone anyways.
i think it's most important to do what works for one's own self, and ignore what society is pushing on us to do. i would definitely never say that everyone should seek a relationship, or that everyone would be suited to dating, because is just isn't the case. |
Maybe.... but keep in mind that those people (those who are 'naturally' not suited for relationships) do also have sexual and intimacy needs like the others. |
nobody has needs when it comes to sex with other people. sex is a desire. and friends can offer intimacy.
i think that some people would be best off coming to terms with being alone. coming to terms with it and being happy with it would mean that they could lead a happy and fulfilling life alone. nothing has to be a final decision, but it could definitely help people cope with reality. fact is, a certain number of people will not ever date or marry. and some will date or marry but still end up alone. learning to live with that could allow a person to lead a good life.
| MXH wrote: | | Why do I post here? In the hopes that I can stop people preaching the same advice for everyone |
people have given all different kinds of advice on the forum. everything from asking out 100 people a day to doing CBT to reading books on the opposite sex to making friends to being a jerk in the bar to.... well, everything. you're not seeing it clearly.
| MXH wrote: | | Exactly, but when its just the same exact advice in every single thread |
it isn't the same advice. it is different in every thread. there are some common themes, but those themes don't come up in every thread.
_________________
on a break, so if you need assistance please contact another moderator from this list:
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp5043493.html#5043493 |
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ZX_SpectrumDisorder
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 25, 2012
Posts: 1608
Location: Ireland
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| I've spent my life in one relationship or another, this is the first time I've been single for longer than 12 months since I started being interested in girls and it's awesome. I have absolutely no responsibilities to anyone other than myself. I don't know if I'd even bother, again. If you think you're missing something, think again. |
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Thom_Fuleri
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 08, 2010
Posts: 801
Location: Leicestershire, UK
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| ToadOfSteel wrote: | | Wait, what happened? I thought Thom was one of the nice people on this forum... I'm not dissenting against wolfheart, like I said he always acts in good faith. So does Thom, which is why i'm fairly confused at this point as to why he's attacking me for disagreeing. |
I'm trying a different approach. I want to get you angry. It's a form of tough love.
If you're convinced you're an abject failure and nothing good will ever come of it, then the only thing to do is give up. To embrace your uselessness and turn it into an art form. And the point is - you won't do it. No matter how much you declare your life hopeless, some bloody minded part of you won't give up.
This is exactly how (some) drug addicts and alcoholics turn their lives around. You can be nice to them forever and nothing will ever change, because they have no reason to change. Their lives have to get worse. Much worse. I'm talking loss of family and friends, of job, of home, of everything. If they don't reach rock bottom, they won't change. It's not love and compassion that brings them back, though it'll be needed in spades when they start coming back. That first step is anger. Anger at themselves, their addictions and the mess that their lives are in. Not everyone makes it to that stage, and some unfortunates decide to go the other way and quit in a more permanent fashion.
You're not (as far as I know) an alcoholic or drug addict. But the mental patterns are very similar. You're dependent on failure. You expect it, to the point that you don't know how to cope with success. You're subconsciously sabotaging your own efforts because part of you wants to fail. That is not going to change until you change it - and that means getting angry.
You could be a great guy if you let yourself. So could MXH, I'm pretty sure, though I've less to go on there. But all the loving kindness in the world isn't going to change you.
| Quote: | | My issue is that my life has been nothing but failure. Bitter, abysmal failure at that. It's not the kind of thing you can learn to like. I want to be successful, but success eludes me at every turn. Most people have some measure of success. I don't. You can only endure that so long before your outlook changes. You can't breed confidence from nothing. |
No, you breed confidence from within. You are not nothing. You have skills and knowledge and personality and dreams and thoughts and a life. You can do pretty much anything - but you need to put the effort in. Perhaps you don't have many skills yet, but have confidence in the ones you do have. One of them is a skill at learning new skills and improving your existing ones. Do that, and you have more to be confident about.
Don't measure your success by other people. I learnt to tie my shoelaces at 16. I can bake some fantastic shortbread biscuits, and that's a success for me. I'm not declaring myself a failure because I'll never win Masterchef. |
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The_Face_of_Boo
A savage
Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Age: 31
Posts: 9281
Location: Beirut ,Lebanon
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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My I add Step 0?
For above 24 adults, this should be done before this Step 1.
Step 0: Getting the necessary equipment:
- Learn how to drive and get a car (if you live in a place with a poor public transportation)
-Get a job
-Get a place of your own, independently. (a must for those living in the west)
I am saying this because i'v noticed a lot of guys here wanting a gf before having any of those. Lacking those would reduce your chances by like 80% at least, then good luck in getting a single date |
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mds_02
Skank
Joined: Sep 10, 2011
Posts: 1943
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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| MXH wrote: | | Why do I post here? In the hopes that I can stop people preaching the same advice for everyone and we can get some actual help. The more ideas we have around the better it will be for all. Now there is no need to come out and be billy bad butt and put others down just cause you feel so without even bothering to read into their messages. Either that or youre not capable of reading into their messages which then i would recommend not talking. |
wasn't trying to be a dick when I asked that. sorry if that's how I came across. Was genuinely curious why someone who seems to believe he truly has no chance at all in the romance dept would torture himself by continuing to read these threads. if I was mistaken about your belief in your chances, then I apologize. but, in a lot of ways, you do come across as someone who's already given up.
| Quote: | | Exactly, but when its just the same exact advice in every single thread i dont think it will help people with issues outside of this area. With great advice like "get some confidence" as if its something you can buy in walmart. And then proceed to say that people will read through fake confidence. Ohh well f**k! So you mean the only way to obtain what i need is by having what i need? Thats not advice, thats a verbal headache. |
it is generally similar advice in most threads, I'll grant that. perhaps that is because that is what has worked for members here. no one expects you to just "get some confidence." learning to be more confident is very helpful, but also a very personal thing. sorry, but a bunch of internet people just aren't going to know you well enough to be able to give you personally tailored advice regarding this. there have been some suggestions though. some have advised starting a workout regimen to raise confidence, I could see that working well for a lot of guys. in the past, I've advised approaching people and attempting to start more conversations in day-to-day life, the idea being that you will slowly come to realize the insignificance of being rejected, and slowly get better and better at it, both of which should serve to raise confidence. if you don't think any of the advice given will help you, I won't argue with you about that. but it's all the advice anyone has.
| Quote: | | And making stupid comments to someone who is trying to bring new ideas into the table because youre too stubborn to do anything but repeat the same things that have failed makes you look like an insane person. No wait, that is the definition of insane. |
was I making stupid comments? wouldn't be surprised, I say stupid sh** all the time. seriously, if I did, please tell me exactly what I said. but I didn't perceive any part of this thread as being about bringing new ideas to the table. I saw Wolfheart try to refine some old ideas, give concrete advice on how to build confidence, and I saw people rejecting those ideas without offering any others. |
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mds_02
Skank
Joined: Sep 10, 2011
Posts: 1943
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| MXH wrote: | | Umm, those two things contradict themselves. Shotgun approach is more for picking up women, if youre looking for someone worth a relationship you need something more personal/specific than just going for whoever says yes. Otherwise i dont see the relationship lasting more than a week. |
The idea behind the "shotgun approach" is to get to know lots of women, that way you can make an informed decision about which ones you think you may be compatible with. It is not about hitting on a bunch of random women and settling for the first one that says "yes." It doesn't work unless you are willing to quickly cut loose the ones that don't seem like a good match. |
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Thom_Fuleri
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 08, 2010
Posts: 801
Location: Leicestershire, UK
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:11 pm Post subject: |
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| The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | May I add Step 0?
For above 24 adults, this should be done before this Step 1.
Step 0: Getting the necessary equipment:
- Learn how to drive and get a car (if you live in a place with a poor public transportation)
- Get a job
- Get a place of your own, independently. (a must for those living in the west)
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Personally, I got all those things AFTER getting a relationship (I would have struggled to get them before). But I was under 24 at the time, so I'm not sure what that actually proves... |
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The_Face_of_Boo
A savage
Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Age: 31
Posts: 9281
Location: Beirut ,Lebanon
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Thom_Fuleri wrote: | | The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | May I add Step 0?
For above 24 adults, this should be done before this Step 1.
Step 0: Getting the necessary equipment:
- Learn how to drive and get a car (if you live in a place with a poor public transportation)
- Get a job
- Get a place of your own, independently. (a must for those living in the west)
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Personally, I got all those things AFTER getting a relationship (I would have struggled to get them before). But I was under 24 at the time, so I'm not sure what that actually proves... |
YOU ARE HOMOSEXUAL anyways !
Sorry, i had to say it!!
You can't compare oranges to apples.
Please, don't mislead the heterosexual guys here by talking about your experiences without mentioning your sexuality! You date guys, they date girls, guys and girls are kinda two worlds somehow in the dating realm. |
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mds_02
Skank
Joined: Sep 10, 2011
Posts: 1943
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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| The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | | Thom_Fuleri wrote: | | The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | May I add Step 0?
For above 24 adults, this should be done before this Step 1.
Step 0: Getting the necessary equipment:
- Learn how to drive and get a car (if you live in a place with a poor public transportation)
- Get a job
- Get a place of your own, independently. (a must for those living in the west)
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Personally, I got all those things AFTER getting a relationship (I would have struggled to get them before). But I was under 24 at the time, so I'm not sure what that actually proves... |
YOU ARE HOMOSEXUAL anyways !
Sorry, i had to say it!!
You can't compare oranges to apples.
Please, don't mislead the heterosexual guys here by talking about your experiences without mentioning your sexuality! You date guys, they date girls, guys and girls are kinda two worlds somehow in the dating realm. |
I've found his advice to be very sound, and I'm hetero. Ultimately, the qualities that most women and men, gay or straight, value are remarkably similar. If we were just talking about how to get casual sex, then yeah a gay guy's experiences and advice might not be applicable to straight men. But since we are, presumably, talking about finding LTRs, I see no problem with the advice he is giving. |
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mglosenger
Velociraptor
Joined: Aug 20, 2011
Age: 140
Posts: 445
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| Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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I do concur that being positive has a much higher likelihood of success than being negative.
Unfortunately, even when I am as positive as can be things don't always go the way I want, and I become easily frustrated, and overall, life (society) seems like too much work to be worth it.
I am however good at computer games, and so I play those instead. If society wanted me to play their little games, they should have made them more fun for me. -This goes for every woman I've ever met, every person really. |
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Wolfheart
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 18, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 2971
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:57 am Post subject: |
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| mglosenger wrote: | I do concur that being positive has a much higher likelihood of success than being negative.
Unfortunately, even when I am as positive as can be things don't always go the way I want, and I become easily frustrated, and overall, life (society) seems like too much work to be worth it.
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Life is unfair and it's going to throw blows and disappointment at you, no matter what. Being able to discern that negativity is going to help you to recover faster and move on. If you get rejected, what good can come from it by over analysing and letting it define you as a failure? Having the ability to pick yourself up and carry on under fire will help you. |
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Wolfheart
Phoenix
Joined: Feb 18, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 2971
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:18 am Post subject: |
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| The_Face_of_Boo wrote: | My I add Step 0?
For above 24 adults, this should be done before this Step 1.
Step 0: Getting the necessary equipment:
- Learn how to drive and get a car (if you live in a place with a poor public transportation)
-Get a job
-Get a place of your own, independently. (a must for those living in the west)
I am saying this because i'v noticed a lot of guys here wanting a gf before having any of those. Lacking those would reduce your chances by like 80% at least, then good luck in getting a single date |
I agree, the employment part and finding a girlfriend run synonymously together because they both require displaying desirable traits and creating a good first impression. Having your own place is a sign of independence which is definitely an attractive quality and can help create a good first impression when it comes to dating.
| Quote: | Based on a survey of 1,000 single people, above a third of women and 18% of men said they prefer to date someone who has his/her own house. Not to be mean but being practical isn’t a bad thing.
Only 2% of ladies said they preferred to date a guy who rents, while only 3% of men said they would go with a woman who rents over one that owns her home.
62% of 1,000 survey respondents prefer single people living on their own. Clearly, both sexes would not like a roommate in the picture!
Even so, there are a lot more adult kids whom after college, would go back to their old homes. Well, nothing is wrong with that except if you’re trying to find love. Only 50 out 1000 single people interviewed said they may date someone living in their old homes. |
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