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| Should we let him go to the Red Wings game? |
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| No |
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| Total Votes : 6 |
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Leesmom
Emu Egg
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Posts: 3
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 Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:45 am Post subject: 9 year old being violent |
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My son is 9 years old and has been diagnosed since he was about 5. He has been with the same special ed teacher since the beginning and she is really good at communicating with me and letting me know what is going on with him. When he was 7, he began acting out both in school and at home and saying stuff like "Why don't you just get rid of me?!" or "I wish I was never born!" It took us over a year to get into a psychiatrist and to get him the proper meds--and during that time he was severely depressed and acting out very badly--but he was rarely violent other than to hurt himself.
We found out during the whole ordeal that our neighbors 12 year old had coerced him into doing some sexual stuff when he was 7 and that was what had started off all the crazy stuff as he was before a very calm, well mannered Aspie.
Now he is having a rough time again, but is seems very situational. He generally acts normal when he's home (normal for his age group--lol) But at school he has been having rough days about every two weeks. In this day, he started swearing, throwing chairs and destroying the classroom. Punching, pinching, kicking, and biting to tear fleash off his teachers and para pros. And attacking the other students. Normally, a child in our classrooms who is acting that way is removed to a small room with a padded bench to chill out and calm down--but he is a large kid so they can't even get him to that room without it being a huge undertaking and a fiasco.
Today, he had a day like that and they suspended him from school for 3 days. No swearing this time since I made him rinse his mouth our with vinegar last time, but now He will be missing the field trip on Friday that he was supposed to take his dad on  and can't go back until after spring break. We are going to pick up his homework so that he can do it over spring break but other than grounding him from his electronics, I don't know what to do to prevent him from doing this again. His teacher and I generally discuss our best options, but both of us are at a loss at this point. He is already on medicine and imo it is the right dosage, I feel that this is entirely brought on by whatever is going on at school.
So I guess here are my questions:
1.) Any ideas on what I can do to get him to stop this raging behavior that only occurs at school?
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2.) My husband won tickets to a red wings game and had told my son he could go. My son loves the Red Wings and loves spending time with his dad. Last time he got into trouble, his Dad told him he didn't think he could take him if he got into trouble again. He got into trouble again. This may be a once in a lifetime thing as we're really poor. I'm all for sticking to my guns, but due to how big of an opportunity it is, I feel I should just let him go. On the other hand, then I'm not keeping to what I said. What should we do? |
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SanityTheorist
Wandering Artist
Joined: Feb 14, 2012
Posts: 2098
Location: The Akuma Afterglow
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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Well, with acting out, generally it means his needs are not being met, aspergian or not. How much attention does he get at home and how do you gnerally punish him for these outbursts? My thoughts are you might not be letting him get away from others to calm down...
_________________
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annotated_alice
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 26, 2008
Posts: 770
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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If this type of violent behavior is only happening at school, I would really want to get to the bottom of what's going wrong there. Why does he feel like he has to "fight for his life"? Is someone hurting him physically or emotionally? Is he being bullied? Humiliated? Pushed beyond his mental or physical capabilities? It sounds like something is going very wrong, and I would want to know what it is.
I wouldn't take away a once in a lifetime opportunity as a punishment. That just doesn't fit the "crime" in any way. |
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Leesmom
Emu Egg
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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I know he is always telling me about kids at school that say bad things--I always tell him to ignore them and they don't sound like very good friends. This behavior is happening directly after he is approached about doing some school work though. They try to work with him with breaks but sometimes he gets out of control so bad it isn't an option.
Today was about finding spelling definitions that he didn't want to do "because it takes him too long to find them" |
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momsparky
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Posts: 2737
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| SanityTheorist wrote: | | Well, with acting out, generally it means his needs are not being met, aspergian or not. How much attention does he get at home and how do you gnerally punish him for these outbursts? My thoughts are you might not be letting him get away from others to calm down... |
I agree with this assessment.
The question I would ask: would he be missing the game because he didn't do everything he was able to do, or is he missing the game because he wasn't able to do what he needed to do? Is he getting the tools he needs at school to manage his behavior? I can tell you from personal experience, sometimes our kids don't fit the "this is what works for autism" template they try to plug in: there could be any number of things going on at school even if they have the best of intentions.
In general, I am a stick-to-your-guns kind of parent, but I realize in hindsight that there are times when we have punished my son when WE (and his teachers) were the ones who let him down. It's a fine line, and a difficult decision to make, but I've found doing lots of detective work and figuring out what is causing the behavior is just as critical as managing it.
Either way, he needs to understand exactly what the decision means: if you don't let him go, make sure he understands EXACTLY what he did to lose this privilege and EXACTLY what you expect in the future.
If you do let him go, explain that you're making an exception, detail the reason you are making an exception and what YOU will be changing from this point forward. Let him know that violence is serious, and you expect him to use the tools you're making available to him to change his behavior.
There's reading we generally suggest for new parents to this forum that I think may help you - the e-book at http://www.asdstuff.com/ and the stickies at the top of this forum - you may find some help in both. |
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questor
Hermit
Joined: Apr 24, 2011
Posts: 1983
Location: Twilight Zone
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:34 pm Post subject: Melt downs |
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1. You can't let a kid run amok. There have to be consequences for bad behavior. You and his dad had already told him this was bad behavior, and had warned him of the consequences. If you do that and then don't carry through he will learn that he can act up, and not have to suffer any consequences. DO NOT REWARD BAD BEHAVIOR! It is the wrong message to send.
2. As other posters have said, find out what is going on at school that is setting him off. You can't expect him to avoid future bouts of bad behavior if something is setting him off, possibly bullying. There is definitely something wrong that he is unable to fix on his own. He needs your help to fix it.
3. Does that neighbor kid still have access to your boy. Maybe there have been more incidents lately. I hope you went to the police when you first found out about this. The age of the abuser should never stop anyone from going to the authorities, because the abuser also needs to learn that there are consequences to bad behavior, and other kids need to be protected from them. It is also possible that young abusers are themselves victims of abuse by others, and are just acting out what has been done to them, so reporting on them to the authorities is also the way to get help for them, too.
I hope you find out what is setting off your boy, and soon! |
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Bombaloo
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 01, 2010
Posts: 1399
Location: Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree with alice. I think it is important to consider if the punishment you are planning to implement is likely to have the desired effect, i.e. will telling him he can't go to the game prevent him from having meltdowns at school? My inclination is, no, not letting him go to the game is just going to make him feel angry with you and/or bad about himself. |
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Kailuamom
Phoenix
Joined: Jul 14, 2010
Posts: 647
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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Before I understood what was happening with DS, he started having meltdowns (but I didn't know they were meltdowns). He would hit kids or me or the babysitter.
I told my son that if he could go two months without laying hands on someone I would take him to a concert he really wanted to attend. I spent $300 on the tickets.
Unfortunately, during a week of day camp (led by teenagers), a kid startled him and he tried to strangle them. I stuck with the agreement and sold the concert tickets.
It was crushing to all of us. However, it did tell me that he couldn't control the meltdowns, because if he could control them, he would have. He really wanted to go to the concert.
I learned a lot:
It was a MISTAKE to bet a high stakes event on something I didn't yet understand
He couldn't control the meltdown (I think without this example, it would have taken me longer to "get" this).
He still hasn't forgiven me for selling the tickets, it was 3 1/2 years ago.
If I had it to do all over again, I would tell him that this is evidence that his behaviors need bigger help than I can give by use of punishments/rewards. I would change my mind and take him to the concert. |
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Leesmom
Emu Egg
Joined: Mar 27, 2012
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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questor
We actually let that house go to foreclosure due to the neighbors. Better to give my son and our family peace of mind and live in debt than to let them continue to destroy everything we held dear. Thanks for all of the insights. |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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It seems to me kind of like you are punishing symptoms....punishing something for behavior they probably cannot necessarily control as its probably being triggered by symptoms of those psychological issues. Also medications don't just make all the issues go away, if he's on meds but the situation has not improved any his depression and other issues will NOT improve and if...its just reinforced that he's bad and that no one understands which is the impression I am getting these things will not improve either.
So first bit of advice, you have to separate between intentional mis-behavior where punishment is appropriate......and symptoms of the mental issues he has, punishing the latter is actually likely to be more detrimental than helpful...he needs help and understanding for this not constant punishment without attempts at trying to understand what he's going through and how it feels to him.
Also I think not letting him go to that due to behavior that from what you wrote really looks more like symptoms than intentional misbehavior...is probably the worst thing to do. That's like kicking someone when they are down kind of.....like 'oh you're having a difficult time, because I just wanted to tell you, you can't go to that game your really wanted to unless you somehow control yourself no matter how much pain your symptoms are causing.' I mean I just really have to push the don't punish symptoms which it seems like and I hate to say it is what might be going on
sorry if this offends, but this is the best advice I can give based on my own experiences, and what I have learned in psychology.
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It's like alice in wonderland except, my names not alice and this is the real world not a dream. |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Leesmom wrote: | I know he is always telling me about kids at school that say bad things--I always tell him to ignore them and they don't sound like very good friends. This behavior is happening directly after he is approached about doing some school work though. They try to work with him with breaks but sometimes he gets out of control so bad it isn't an option.
Today was about finding spelling definitions that he didn't want to do "because it takes him too long to find them" |
Do you know how hard it is to ignore people when they constantly pick on you? especially for people with AS......its much, much easier said than done....because for one ignoring them does not stop them from continuing to bully. Also it really can get to the point where you cannot handle it and will have outburts, this is not really something one can just turn off. I personally think its sick that most schools just seem to allow bullying to go on and sometimes even teachers are even in on it. You should be contacting the school principle or teachers about the bullying issues, try and get a stop put to it. Or if worse comes to worse maybe look into other options besides traditional schooling.
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It's like alice in wonderland except, my names not alice and this is the real world not a dream. |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Kailuamom wrote: | Before I understood what was happening with DS, he started having meltdowns (but I didn't know they were meltdowns). He would hit kids or me or the babysitter.
I told my son that if he could go two months without laying hands on someone I would take him to a concert he really wanted to attend. I spent $300 on the tickets.
Unfortunately, during a week of day camp (led by teenagers), a kid startled him and he tried to strangle them. I stuck with the agreement and sold the concert tickets.
It was crushing to all of us. However, it did tell me that he couldn't control the meltdowns, because if he could control them, he would have. He really wanted to go to the concert.
I learned a lot:
It was a MISTAKE to bet a high stakes event on something I didn't yet understand
He couldn't control the meltdown (I think without this example, it would have taken me longer to "get" this).
He still hasn't forgiven me for selling the tickets, it was 3 1/2 years ago.
If I had it to do all over again, I would tell him that this is evidence that his behaviors need bigger help than I can give by use of punishments/rewards. I would change my mind and take him to the concert. |
This^ I would hate for the OP to have to learn something like that the hard way.
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It's like alice in wonderland except, my names not alice and this is the real world not a dream. |
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blondeambition
Phoenix
Joined: Oct 09, 2010
Posts: 718
Location: Austin, Texas
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| Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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I would do the following in your situation:
1) Call the child psychiatrist or pediatric neurologist and see if he/she thinks the meds need adjustment.
2) Call an IEP and try to arrange for more modifications--maybe your son needs to be taken for a break in the hall if he appears to be starting to get agitated, allowed to hold a sensory item, allowed to sit at a table by himself and work alone rather than forcing him to participate in group projects, change where he is sitting in the classroom, wear earplugs when it is noisy, modify work that is too difficult, provide him with a visual schedule and visual aids, simplify work assignments that may be too difficult, etc. Ask if he could get an aid, if he doesn't have one, or have floating special ed personnel come into the class to work with him at certain times during the day.
3) Consider private ABA therapy, social stories, and video modeling.
4) Arrange for a conference with the teacher (either in person or by phone) to try to figure out what is going on.
5) If you can, arrange to observe your son in class one day or agree to be a parent volunteer at the next field trip or class party. (I did this once when my older son was in kindergarten, and it was very enlightening. The kindergarten teacher thought that my son wasn't paying attention, but it was obvious to me that my son didn't know what was going on a lot of the time and was unable to keep up due to speech issues and lack of visual supports. The kindergarten team was also never very good at picking up on the first signs of anxiety and acting accordingly by giving my son a break, etc.)
http://www.freevideosforautistickids.com/Teaching_Techniques.html
Above are various teaching tips/therapy methods that you might want to discuss with the school.
http://www.freevideosforautistickids.com/social_skills.html
http://www.freevideosforautistickids.com/Autism_Links.html
http://www.freevideosforautistickids.com/Special_Needs_Catalogs.html
In addition to working with the school and various professionals, you might want to check out the above links from my free website to see if there is anything that you want to do at home--video modeling, behavior flashcards, social stories, books for you to read from one of the special needs catalogs, etc.
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www.freevideosforautistickids.com is my website with hundreds of links and thousands of educational videos for kids, parents and educators. Son with high-functioning classic autism, aged 7, and son with OCD/Aspergers, aged 4. I love my boys! |
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