PaintingDiva
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 28, 2011
Posts: 334
Location: Left coast aka Northern California
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 Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:15 pm Post subject: Tech firms hiring ASD people to test software |
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I read an article in the newspaper today about how tech companies are looking to hire people on the spectrum to be software testers, it is described as boring, repetitive, detailed work that ASD people would be well suited to do.
This one company is planning to do it in the USA and pay LESS than people in India are paid to do this kind of work. The rationale is something like, well I am doing a 'good deed' and it is costing to me....
I also recently went to an Open House for a program called CIP in Berkeley, it is for young people on the spectrum, a transition program to live independently, get a job or go to College. A gentleman from India was there, he was not there for his son or daughter, he was there because he is recruiting Aspies to do software testing.
I find something offensive about all of this.
Have any of these supposedly well intentioned people considered that just because you are GOOD at something does not mean you ENJOY it?
How does everyone else feel about this?
Would you be thrilled to be hired to be a software tester?
What do you think about getting paid less in the USA versus companies in India that pay $25.00 an hour. The company profiled in the article, and this is California mind you, one of the most expensive states to live in in the country, is planning to offer, $15.00 an hour.
Here is the article in full:
| Quote: | Companies hire autistics to test software
Drake Bennett
Sunday, April 1, 2012
Part of the reason autism has captivated Hollywood moviemakers more than other developmental disabilities is that, for all the difficulties it brings those who have it, it also gives some of them the ability to perform uncanny feats of brainpower: effortlessly memorizing train schedules or song lyrics, identifying the day of the week of any date in the past.
Even among those who aren't full-blown savants, many display an impressive ability, even a desire, to immerse themselves in what the rest of us would see as mind-numbingly boring, detail-oriented tasks.
What if we could turn that ability toward things besides memorizing train schedules? It's not simply an abstract question: The vast majority of those with Asperger's syndrome and high-functioning autism are unemployed. A few companies are trying to do just that, and all in the same sphere: software testing, the epitome of mind-numbing, detail-oriented work.
The pioneer was a company called Specialisterne, started in 2004 by a Danish software engineer with an autistic son - it has since created offshoots in Iceland and Scotland. In 2008 a small nonprofit called Aspiritech in Chicago was started to put people with high-functioning autism and Asperger's syndrome to work testing smart-phone apps.
The newest entrant into the space in the United States is a Los Angeles software and design firm called Square One. The company has a small pilot program working to design a software-testing training program for people on the autism spectrum. The project grew out of conversations between company co-founder Chad Hahn and his wife, Shannon, who works with the developmentally disabled.
Hahn, along with experts his wife led him to, has put together a software-testing curriculum that he's now in the process of teaching to an inaugural class of three. The course he's designed relies not on written instructions but on a software tool called iRise to create simulations of the sort of problems the trainees would confront in an actual work setting.
What's most original about Square One's approach is how resolutely bottom-line-oriented Hahn is. Specialisterne only worked because of generous Danish subsidies for employing the developmentally disabled, and Aspiritech is a nonprofit. But for the time being Hahn is committed to the for-profit route.
A lot of software testing is done overseas by workers in India. The case Hahn makes is that his software testers will work for $15 to $20 an hour - pay comparable to, or even lower than, that of software testers in India, but right here in the United States. After all, he points out, people with autism don't have a lot of alternatives - when they do find work, it's usually bagging groceries or sweeping hospital floors for minimum wage.
Hahn, in other words, is proposing outsourcing to the developmentally disabled rather than the developing world. Asked whether it might be exploitative to pay people with a disability less than those without one for doing the same work, he says he doesn't see it that way. For one thing, he says, Indian software testers aren't exactly sweatshop labor; they make about $25 an hour. And if paying less makes the company able to hire the developmentally disabled in the first place, he doesn't see a problem with it.
Drake Bennett is a Bloomberg Businessweek writer. dbennett35@bloomberg.net
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Alexender
Dodo bird
Joined: Jan 03, 2012
Age: 20
Posts: 1194
Location: wrongplanet
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diniesaur
Phoenix
Joined: Sep 03, 2011
Posts: 639
Location: in the Ministry of Silly Walks
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| So...give the Autistic people crappy pay because that's the only option they have. |
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PaintingDiva
Deinonychus
Joined: Jul 28, 2011
Posts: 334
Location: Left coast aka Northern California
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:26 pm Post subject: Would you enjoy this type of work? |
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I have issues with the pay scale and my biggest question is:
Would you ENJOY this type of work?
Thanks for the link to the other post though... |
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Alexender
Dodo bird
Joined: Jan 03, 2012
Age: 20
Posts: 1194
Location: wrongplanet
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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I think it sounds like a really good idea. Seeing as how lots of times people that are autistic are working minimum wage jobs this is a step up. I recently got a job at walmart which i was really glad I got
I don't think there is enough info to know if I would enjoy it or be fine with it
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noname_ever
Phoenix
Joined: Dec 26, 2011
Posts: 500
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Software testing is a major part of my job. It can be enjoyable. It can be highly structured with well defined rules when dealing with a regulated environment (FDA, military, etc...). Depending on the location and job market, I have heard non-aspies getting paid between $15-$35 per hour for software testing. It usually depends on the entire skill set though and the test environment (software verification that needs to pass the scrutiny of the FDA or military vs test out this porn web site). The higher your skill set and development skills, the closer to earning software developer pay (can you create a test plan and schedule, can you write defect reports, can you write automated tests, can you perform lower level unit testing, do you understand the underlying technology, can you characterize a defect, or are you simply someone who follows a written script and executes it 15 times against 15 different configurations). Depressed job markets also pay lower. $15/hr is a decent intern pay rate in my area. |
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AardvarkGoodSwimmer
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 27, 2009
Age: 50
Posts: 4902
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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The rationale and the putting us in a box, yes, I find that offensive, too.
I do thank noname_ever for sharing some of the upside.
I studied C++ programming from 1998-2000, got pretty good at it, took university classes, had a portfolio of work. But, when looked for a job in 2000, the only thing human resource people looked at was years of corporate experience. |
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cyberscan
Naughty Autie
Joined: Apr 17, 2008
Posts: 1357
Location: Near Panama, City Florida
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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I would take this job (in California) if it were available to me so that I can learn the ins and outs of the business, and if the pay didn't increase, I would branch out on my own and become a competitor. In the Banana Republic of Florida, $25 per hour sounds like great pay, and I would probably stay with the company.
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I am AUTISTIC - Always Unique, Totally Interesting, Straight Talking, Intelligently Conversational.
I am also the author of "Tech Tactics Money Saving Secrets" and "Tech Tactics Publishing and Production Secrets." |
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AardvarkGoodSwimmer
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 27, 2009
Age: 50
Posts: 4902
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | " . . . Hollywood moviemakers . . . it also gives some of them the ability to perform uncanny feats of brainpower: effortlessly memorizing train schedules or song lyrics, identifying the day of the week of any date in the past.
Even among those who aren't full-blown savants, many display an impressive ability, even a desire, to immerse themselves in what the rest of us would see as mind-numbingly boring, detail-oriented tasks. . . "
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/03/31/BUB71NR6AV.DTL#ixzz1qqHtduwp
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This is a stereotype. This is true for some people on the spectrum.
For other people, our special interests might change over time. Or, might change and also circle back to some of the previous interests.
And some of us like social interaction just fine, maybe just in more controlled circumstances, and maybe with sufficient downtime to process (which for me is often as much emotional as intellectual).
===============
And in the best tradition of free speech, the best remedy for crappy speech is more speech! We need more Hollywood movies. Then people can see for themselves, Wow, people on the spectrum can really be quite different from each other. You've met one person on the spectrum, you've met one person on the spectrum. |
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AardvarkGoodSwimmer
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 27, 2009
Age: 50
Posts: 4902
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Somehow, I feel this might be more promising. |
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kirayng
Phoenix
Joined: Nov 13, 2011
Age: 36
Posts: 745
Location: Maine, USA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:40 am Post subject: |
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I would love this job. $15 an hour is more than I make as a line cook and I've got about $40k in student loan debt. *(yes I bought into that if I have a culinary degree I'll have a better job, but I have the same job but now at a nice resort instead of a greasy spoon)
Anyway, tell me how to apply.  |
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cberg
Blue Jay
Joined: Jan 01, 2012
Posts: 91
Location: Earth or something
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| Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:48 pm Post subject: RUN AWAY |
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I risked a truancy conviction in high school paying attention to releases, development cycles, command lines, scripting languages and what have you, computer science sure isn't taken very seriously in U.S. public education. I've been a voluntary open source tester for 7+ years, had months of internship work and still no luck in finding full time jobs. In my case it seems to be a waiting game as I'm 19 and my appearance makes interviews difficult. There's nothing monotonous or repetitive about involved, automated test engineering or development. That is a fault of the aforementioned firm's cubicle farm mentality. Bugs are almost never the same because software is never the same. I had a few months in a telecommuting internship in mobile app development, but despite the obvious allure of working from home or the first grey walled quasi-office that presents itself, I would steer aspies away from picking the low hanging fruit here. I set up thousands of dollars of Linux workstations for my school in exchange for 3 signatures to clear a traffic ticket. My last company endeavored to pay me $1600 for an application worth upwards of $12,000 to their client, and all I wound up with was the development hardware. It's not that I didn't learn anything from that contract job, far from it, but I certainly learned more about people than testing and dev work. I'm still pursuing startup jobs, but giving it a year and considering another year or two of school, because this is a country that scoffs at a quarter of any given person's lifespan spent on their passion.
BE CAREFUL - This must be the only planet in the universe where one can get punished for thoroughly learning something.
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civrev
Blue Jay
Joined: Jul 15, 2012
Age: 26
Posts: 89
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 1:40 am Post subject: |
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Not sure why a 6 month old thread was resurrected, but there it is lol.
Anyways, I'd look at this as an opportunity. After all, if you work there for a while and are successful with it, it'll allow you to get a higher paying job. I can't imagine a company like this could keep it's best workers around for very long when other jobs will pay them more to jump ship. So it's a potential foot in the door to a higher paying job in the field. |
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Robdemanc
Phoenix
Joined: May 31, 2010
Posts: 2291
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| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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I know a lot about software testing and I dare say aspies and others on the spectrum would be very good at it. However, that should necessitate higher pay not lower.
Software testing requires a very good eye for detail and a very good memory. So yes it is insulting they think they can offer less than the typical rate. It is also breaking equality laws I think. |
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noobler
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Joined: Oct 18, 2012
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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it doesn't look like they're breaking equality laws
it looks like they're paying anyone that wants to work there the same lower than india wage and offering a special training program for people on the autistic spectrum, facilitating entry for autistics and publicizing along those lines
as opposed to paying a high price and so on and leaving it at that
and the reason they are doing this is because they see opportunity in the fact that many people on the autistic spectrum have difficulty elsewhere, it is *possible* however that they are dealing with the environment of the place in a way that makes it more friendly to people with autism in general, and this in itself definitely counts as a "perk" - if they're doing that
1: find job
2: find job you like
3: find high paying job you like
if you go from 1->2 this counts as an upgrade, because this is targeted, if it's done properly, it will result in an increase of living condition quality for some people on the autistic spectrum which is important |
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