androbot2084
Phoenix
Joined: Mar 24, 2011
Posts: 3075
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 Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Why don't you men give an example? Can a man come up with just one argument that supports feminism? |
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CrazyCatLord
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Joined: Oct 25, 2011
Posts: 2177
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| androbot2084 wrote: | | Why don't you men give an example? Can a man come up with just one argument that supports feminism? |
I'll give it a shot: Imagine you were born as a woman. Wouldn't you want to have the same legal rights and socio-economic opportunities that you currently enjoy? Or would you rather be a second class citizen?
The same argument can be made for different classes, "races", sexual orientations, neurodiverse states (such as autism), and any other trait imaginable. |
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androbot2084
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Joined: Mar 24, 2011
Posts: 3075
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| When I wrote my novel about a female Doctor transforming her male patient into a robotic cyborg I included dialogues between the male chauvinist patient and the feminist doctor. The result was an extremely insightful work that changed my life. |
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noname_ever
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Joined: Dec 26, 2011
Posts: 500
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| HisDivineMajesty wrote: | Although I agree with close to everything you said, there's something I'd like to make clear. It's not just a left-leaning thing. Many feminists I've met were actually quite authoritarian in non-gender fields and supported perverse amounts of deregulation. Personally, I'm a socialist (pragmatically a social democrat), but I've found that this is one of the very few things I can relate to American right-wing groups on. Modern-day feminism, really, consists of flawed argumentation and guilt trips in order to justify their reforms aimed at giving women even more rights at the cost of men who work in dangerous professions in order to provide for them.
There, I said it once more - all feminists I've ever met come from wealthy white families and have never actually had to work. |
The left has authoritarian members as well. Think Stalin. |
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CrazyCatLord
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Joined: Oct 25, 2011
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| Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| androbot2084 wrote: | | When I wrote my novel about a female Doctor transforming her male patient into a robotic cyborg I included dialogues between the male chauvinist patient and the feminist doctor. The result was an extremely insightful work that changed my life. |
If you say that your own novel is extremely insightful and life-changing, who am I to disagree? It's always nice to meet someone who doesn't suffer from a lack of self-worth  |
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AspieOtaku
Leader of the Otaku Legion
Joined: Feb 18, 2012
Age: 30
Posts: 5885
Location: Mountain View, California, United States
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:43 am Post subject: |
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I am thinking he is referring to the fanatics, like the ones who think men should not have power at all or believe that the perfect world is the round up 98% of all the men around the world put them in death camps and spare the remaining 2% confining them and only using them to harvest the semen for conception to save the human race from extinction. Once their usefulness is up execute them and also enforce a one child policy only difference it is the male child to be aborted or discarded to keep the famle population high and in power. Any male offspring spared shall be raised and taught to think as being subhuman and below that of women.
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Vexcalibur
Proud to be smug as heck
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Joined: Jan 18, 2008
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:46 am Post subject: |
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"Those retarded feminists think I am a misogynist".
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hyperlexian
loves the man who typed too much and ran outta spa
Joined: Jul 22, 2010
Age: 41
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Location: with bucephalus
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:48 am Post subject: |
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| Vexcalibur wrote: | | "Those retarded feminists think I am a misogynist". |
i always look forward to your summaries. they invariably make me laugh.
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AspieOtaku
Leader of the Otaku Legion
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Location: Mountain View, California, United States
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:57 am Post subject: |
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I have an argument that supports feminism. Without women men would cease to exist because of the other 23 chromosomes. True logic trumps all. I am a man saying this
_________________
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LKL
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Age: 37
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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'Women who don't agree with my untested hypothesis about hormonal effects are being unscientific and knee-jerk radicals, even if they happen to have more training in biology and physiology than I do.'
Last edited by LKL on Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ValentineWiggin
Yup.
Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 4879
Location: Beneath my cat's paw
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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I hardly think
"Catherine MacKinnon overstates her case in her book 'Harassment' and here's why..."
"Lack of abortion access is far from the biggest issue affecting South American women..."
"Marxist Feminism is incredibly-short sighted because of the effects of..."
"The groups working to bring about an end to honor killing ought to direct more of their efforts toward..."
would elicit hostility from anyone.
But then, those are genuine invitations for discussion, naming specific feminist goals and ideas, and making a case for opposing them.
I've yet to see such discussions take place in any thread with "feminism" or "feminist" in its title.
What does happen is indicting FEMINISM, period, unqualified, which, like it or not, IS misogyny by definition,
in the same way that attacking RACIAL EQUALITY ADVOCACY is prima facie a RACIST move.
The near-constant ducking into a thread to make one-line references to phantom "extremists" within the movement,
and subsequent refusal to elaborate on who, exactly, quite frankly strikes more as bored attempts at provocation as opposed to interest in discourse.
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"Such is the Frailty
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ValentineWiggin
Yup.
Joined: May 16, 2011
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Location: Beneath my cat's paw
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:04 pm Post subject: Re: Feminist preoccupation with power |
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| WilliamWDelaney wrote: |
Women, during ancient and medieval times, were perfectly capable of controlling their own destinies. They were not forced to be subservient to men. In a lot of ways, it was their idea. It was Woman's idea to present themselves as delicate and fragile. It was woman's idea to ask Man to play the "Knight in Shining Armor." All the men were ever interested in was figuring out the best way to convince their girlfriends to screw them. They never sought unchecked power and authority over the lives of half of the species. Men throughout history have been willing to kill themselves to convince their women that they care. Nothing is being imposed upon you, just because you have a vagina.
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I want to know if this post is serious.
I really, really do.
_________________
"Such is the Frailty
of the human Heart, that very few Men, who have no Property, have any Judgment of their own.
They talk and vote as they are directed by Some Man of Property, who has attached their Minds
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androbot2084
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Joined: Mar 24, 2011
Posts: 3075
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| I had a strange dream of being a warrior in shining armor and almost being knighted by a woman holding a sword . The entrancement was overwhelming but the Prince of Peace broke the spell and I woke up. |
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ValentineWiggin
Yup.
Joined: May 16, 2011
Posts: 4879
Location: Beneath my cat's paw
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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| androbot2084 wrote: | | I had a strange dream of being a warrior in shining armor and almost being knighted by a woman holding a sword . The entrancement was overwhelming but the Prince of Peace broke the spell and I woke up. |
Peyote does that to people.
_________________
"Such is the Frailty
of the human Heart, that very few Men, who have no Property, have any Judgment of their own.
They talk and vote as they are directed by Some Man of Property, who has attached their Minds
to his Interest." |
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Ancalagon
Computer Geek
Joined: Dec 26, 2007
Posts: 2388
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| ValentineWiggin wrote: | What does happen is indicting FEMINISM, period, unqualified, which, like it or not, IS misogyny by definition,
in the same way that attacking RACIAL EQUALITY ADVOCACY is prima facie a RACIST move. |
Attacking racial equality advocacy is not necessarily a racist thing. It might be, if done with racist motives, but it could also easily be an attack on actions taken by racial equality advocates which are counterproductive. Some of the things done and said by people who are racial equality advocates are quite stupid, and opposing them on it is a good thing, even though their goal is a noble one.
In the same way, attacks on feminism are not automatically misogyny. Some of them might be motivated by it, but certainly not all.
Certainly phrasing things as 'feminism' (when a more accurate specification of a subset of feminism might be made) is not likely to be the best way to say things, but saying things poorly is not the same as sexism or racism at all.
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