momsparky
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Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Posts: 2734
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 Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:26 am Post subject: |
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| jtou wrote: | | It's like he puts a wall up in front of him- he invariably will say, "I know that already," when he clearly doesn't, and in fact has just asked you to show him. Then he will make fun of the way we're showing him, make fun of our voices, etc. |
We have this with my 10-year-old (and while I'm sure other 10 year olds are like this, I think his response has more to do with AS and less to do with maturity level.) I know DS is frustrated with being incredibly intelligent (he is) and simultaneously stymied by simple things, and he sometimes takes it out on us.
People on the spectrum tend to be visual learners. Perfectionists sometimes like to learn in private. Can you videotape something he doesn't know how to do, slowly so the steps are clear, and leave him to watch it on his own time? (maybe there already are a set of YouTube life skills videos somewhere...) Or, can you write down the steps (keep in mind you will need minute detail - you never know what starting assumptions you're working with.) in a bulleted list? |
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:40 am Post subject: |
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| jtou wrote: | When he first started complaining about migraines, we became scared he had a brain tumor or something. We had him checked out medically, but they found no problems, so we realized there was something psychological there. Our son had never really complained much before, and was kind of a "tough guy" kid and teen, although he never fought people or anything. Just never got hurt or let little things slow him down. When his personality changed, however, he became different, and sometimes now seems almost "wimpy."
wimpy eh? See if you have the attituede that its weak and whimpy to be troubled by emotions and such .....that probably is not helpful at all. If you aren't doing that then disregard that, but I just know how much it hurts to have people litterally look down on you because your depressed or are having psychological issues and are having a difficult time handling things. So I had to mention it.....but yeah if he's changed noticably it could certainly have to do with depression, anxiety or maybe another issue. Also maybe the whole 'tough' guy thing was a defense mechanism. I know when I was a kid I would bottle up my negative emotions and such because due to being picked on a lot I learned that is what I should do so people will leave me alone......turns out it's very unhealthy and will over-stress the mind and cause one to burn out more or less. I am 22 and have reached this sort of point myself.
I was in an autism parents support group for a while, but their situations all seemed vastly different from mine, so I stopped going. I've found more valuable advice on this thread than I've received anywhere else. It's been illuminating for me to hear from young people with aspies. It helps me to understand my son a lot better. Assuming my son does have aspergers, of course. To those of you who have read and/or responded; from what I've described, does it sound like my son is an aspie? If not, what could he possibly have?
One of the biggest issues we have is how to help my son, without offending him. For instance, the other day we had a big argument; he started complaining that we'd never shown him how to use the washing machine by himself. In fact, we have tried to show him things like that, but teaching him anything is very hard. It's like he puts a wall up in front of him- he invariably will say, "I know that already," when he clearly doesn't, and in fact has just asked you to show him. Then he will make fun of the way we're showing him, make fun of our voices, etc.
Again, the input here has been very valuable to me. Any other thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated and welcomed. |
hmm not sure about that one, I mean the only thing I can relate this to is if I ask for help and feel like the other person is being sarcastic with me or treating me like a child or mentally retarded person...then I respond likewise, but I don't know if he'd have any reason to get that impression.....the only other thing I can think is maybe he's self concious about it so he lashes out but is actually more frusterated with himself for having a hard time figuring out simple things like that. I personally am pretty good at figuring out washing machines and stuff like that so I can't really relate to that issue.
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hoegaandit
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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| My son does this too - says yeah I know how to do that dad in a sarcastic tone - but he really doesn't. I point this out to him and also tell him I hate sarcasm, and he is getting a little better. |
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hoegaandit
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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My son is not too dissimilar to your son, although he is 17 and still at school (and I would like to keep him an extra year at school).
I would be really concerned about the suicidal signs. I guess the issue there might be that he is having real problems underneath, and perhaps does not feel he can really communicate? Could be signs of attention seeking in the way he did it, but I believe any suicidal indications need to be taken very seriously.
Can you try and get into some real communication with your son? I have major difficulties communicating with my son. I did find going on walks with the dog and making my son stick by me and talk with me worked some. In your case, can you take the talk beyond sports and politics, to try and understand his real issue - with you making it clear you are being non-judgmental and just want to help. It is taking me a while but I think my son is getting the idea I want to help and am not just into criticising him.
I was interested to see the comments against joining a support group on this thread, because it seemed to me that being with others in a similar boat would be helpful to my son. There is an asperger support group about five minutes walk from our house and they meet Saturday afternoons, but my son couldn't wait to leave when we made him attend. Problem is - he has no friends otherwise.
I can see it is going to be a huge job getting my son to make the transition to the real working world. I really liked the idea of volunteer groups for your son, as a sort of practice for the real world. I have my own business so am intending to make my son work here doing some basic administration, which will pay him a little and get him used to a work environment.
Best of luck with your son. |
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OliveOilMom
Queen of cans and jars
Joined: Nov 12, 2011
Posts: 6783
Location: Living in Faulkner's nightmare
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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Why should he change and try to do things for himself if he doesn't have to? He's got it made, and there's no reason to go to work.
Thats what needs to change.
I wouldn't do it without any warning but I would tell him that it's time to start pulling his own weight around there. Tell him that he's 22, and he can start paying rent and buying anything he needs other than food and medical care. Telll him that he has a month to find a job, any job, and you will base the rent on his salary. Also give him chores to do and make sure he does them instead of rent until he gets a job. Tell him that if he doesn't get a job within a month or two that he's gotta go.
That way he knows whats coming and can prepare for it. Meanwhile, give him chores to do which contribute to the household. More than cutting the grass once a week or washing the dishes a few nights a week. He's got to learn that he's going to have to put forth an effort.
If he doesn't have a job at the end of maybe two or three months, you should kick him out. He will probably go to a friends house or something, but he will see that you are serious. Even if he is homeless for a day or two or even a week, he will see you mean business and you can let him come back with the condition that he does find a job.
That kind of behavior isn't just an aspie thing, it's a whole lot of kids his age thing. Lots of kids that my kids know, all NT's, are at home in their early to mid twenties with no jobs, etc. Parents of my generation just let them stay. I let my oldest stay until he decided to move in with his gf when he was 20. He didn't have a job at the time, but had worked before as a roofer and laying carpet and floors. But when he got tired of it he didn't work and he didn't pay us squat. We should have done like I'm advising you, and will with our other son when he gets older. For some reason, it's different to me with daughters. Although my 17yo son is seriously considering quitting school (he's still in 9th grade) and moving in with a friend of his who is also 17 and just quit school and got a job working at the mines (this friend was still in 8th grade - they are both NT's and of at least average intelligence, nothings wrong with them they are just lazy about school work). I'd like him to stay home until he's 18 but it's really up to him.
Good luck.
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Sweetleaf
Metalhead
Joined: Jan 07, 2011
Age: 23
Posts: 14828
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:51 am Post subject: |
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OP based on the fact homelessness really does not help the majority of mentally ill/disordered people change their lives around or better cope with their symptoms/ improve upon them and in fact can increase their stress leading to worse symptoms and problems. I'd certainly be very careful about the kicking him out thing...........and if your other son had similar issues and you tried it and it failed like you said that's even more of a reason not to try it again.
And as a 22 year old I have to say if my mom kicked me out because my symptoms are interfering with my ability to function and I can't 'get a job.' I don't know if i'd want anything to do with her anymore. So unless he really is able to function well and is just being lazy, I'd say sending him out on the streets is a very bad idea.........I mean if he has friends sure he could stay with them, but what if he doesn't?
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hanyo
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 11:36 am Post subject: |
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I'm lucky my mother would never kick me out. People have told her she should because of my age and because I'm not working. If she did I'd be screwed because I'd have no where to go except a homeless shelter if I could stand to be around the people there or even be able to ask to stay there. If having to agree to get a job got me back in the house I'd just say I would and then not do it until I was kicked out again.
Edit: When I was 20 I tried to move out on my own when I got some money but even then I couldn't bring myself to look for and get a job and got kicked out and went back home. Now I don't feel any desire to move out and plan to live with my mother the rest of her life. |
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OddFiction
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Joined: Aug 10, 2010
Posts: 944
Location: In my favourite chair, in front of my laptop, and watching a movie I've seen 1000 times, Canada.
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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could be his attitude change (you said it times up with a new environment?) is due to the fact that he has suddenly noticed - or likely had it pointed out by someone who he respects, who has no reason to belittle him - that he is different. That something he does is different.
For a VERY long time in my life, I was ignorant of the fact that I often come across as angry to people, even when I'm not. Not even a year ago a nurse asked me to describe why I had been fired from my last job... About halfway through the tale she stopped me and said "do you realize you are yelling at me?" ... I respected this person, and she had no reason to make it up; I had no reason nor feelings of anger towards her, if anything I admired her.
I began to reevaluate all the times in my life where someone has said this to me and I simply put it off as "they're just being an arse"... and it lead me to realize IM different, THEY saw what they said they saw, and thus weren't "just being arses". I've seriously changed since that / way more concerned about everything I do now, and how I come off to people:
Coming to the realization that you are THAT seriously different that people REALLY dont get you? Changes alot inside, and likely changes the outside too. Just my 2 cents. |
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momsparky
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Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Posts: 2734
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| OddFiction wrote: | could be his attitude change (you said it times up with a new environment?) is due to the fact that he has suddenly noticed - or likely had it pointed out by someone who he respects, who has no reason to belittle him - that he is different. That something he does is different.
For a VERY long time in my life, I was ignorant of the fact that I often come across as angry to people, even when I'm not. Not even a year ago a nurse asked me to describe why I had been fired from my last job... About halfway through the tale she stopped me and said "do you realize you are yelling at me?" ... I respected this person, and she had no reason to make it up; I had no reason nor feelings of anger towards her, if anything I admired her.
I began to reevaluate all the times in my life where someone has said this to me and I simply put it off as "they're just being an arse"... and it lead me to realize IM different, THEY saw what they said they saw, and thus weren't "just being arses". I've seriously changed since that / way more concerned about everything I do now, and how I come off to people:
Coming to the realization that you are THAT seriously different that people REALLY dont get you? Changes alot inside, and likely changes the outside too. Just my 2 cents. |
Thank you for this post, OddFiction. I have lots of discussions with my son about "making him be different." I want him to embrace who he is, every quirky little bit - but what I don't want is for him to be inadvertently coming across completely different way than he intends to, and then wind up blaming other people. My parents are forever stuck in this particular type of thinking, and they don't see at all how it is trapping them.
Kudos to you for coming to this realization on your own, and thanks again for sharing it. |
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hoegaandit
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes Oddfiction that was a helpful comment. My son frequently comes across as quite grumpy even when I am being completely reasonable. Once his NT sister had to point out to him that I was defending him when he thought I was attacking him. Once at a meeting with the dean examining whether he should enter a trades school he put his face down on the desk as if he were going to sleep. I wonder if he realises how he is presenting himself! |
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catbalou
Snowy Owl
Joined: Jul 12, 2010
Posts: 137
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| Posted: Sun May 20, 2012 4:47 am Post subject: |
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| Another one here who find that comment enlightening and helpful, Oddfiction. I have often said to my daughter 'why are you looking so grumpy/furious/ bad tempered and she she has said ' I'm not!', and been genuinely surprised. I so hope she can get a similar level of self awareness as you seem to developed in that area. (I hope that's not patronising cause I don't mean it to be) |
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jtou
Emu Egg
Joined: Apr 30, 2012
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:35 am Post subject: |
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Kicking my son out is really not an option I'd ever consider. As I noted, we tried that with my then over 50 year old brother several years ago. It did nothing but make me feel horribly guilty.
You are right- there are a lot of kids not on the spectrum who are my son's age that live at home and don't work or go to school. However, I know all too well just how bad the job market is. He does look for work, but he isn't exactly proficient at it, and resents people helping him too much. This past week, he had job interviews two days in a row. He went to the first one, but the next day he came back and gave us the same excuse he has before- he "couldn't find it." He doesn't go that many places, so if he isn't familiar with a place, he has difficulty finding it, even with detailed directions.
It is very hard dealing with the situation. He doesn't want to be told he has aspergers, or anything else, and resents us trying to help him too much. On the other hand, he has developed quite a dependent personality, which is largely our fault. So it's really a fine line to walk. He has a lot of good qualities, but the social awkwardness makes them hard to see.
I do appreciate all the comments and suggestions. Please keep them coming. It's great to have advice from people who have aspies or are dealing with it first hand. |
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ASDMommyASDKid
Hobbit
Joined: Oct 28, 2011
Posts: 1059
Location: "It was a hobbit-hole, and that means comfort."
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:25 am Post subject: |
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I have a young child, so keep that in mind.
.I don't know if your son is Aspie. I think he needs a real diagnosis. There is something, and I cannot for the life of me remember the name, but is is for a seemingly lack of emotions (It begins with an "A" I think.) I do not know much about that either, obviously. It may be a combination of things.
I do think he is depressed. I agree with the suggestion for giving him structure, even if it "fun" structure. That will help with the depression, if nothing else. He does need purpose.
As far as the girlfriend thing, I would not encourage that at all. I understand why he feels he needs one, but he has other things he needs to work on, first. His self esteem needs to come from inside, not from having a girlfriend. Also, he isn't going to even know how to handle a complex relationship in the state he is in now. He needs more self esteem first, I think.
Edited to edit incomplete sentence I thought I finished
Last edited by ASDMommyASDKid on Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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momsparky
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Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Posts: 2734
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:43 pm Post subject: |
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I love this new series on Autism Talk TV - if your son finds the video helpful, you may be able to talk him into social skills classes:
http://www.wrongplanet.net/article434.html |
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jtou
Emu Egg
Joined: Apr 30, 2012
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:37 am Post subject: |
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Update-
My son has now been working for almost two months. Five days a week, six hours a day. It is probably only going to be a temporary position, for 90 days. The pay is minimal, but I'm very proud of him for sticking to it. What's amazing is that so far he hasn't really tried to miss a day of work. With his last job, he frequently would not want to go, and make up really flimsy reasons. So, I'm taking this as a positive sign.
His birthday was yesterday, so now he's 23. It's still a struggle at times, because he can often be overbearing, gets very impatient if we don't answer him right away, and has started a new quirk, where he taps you with his hand an instant after he says something, to make sure we're paying attention. The relationship with his little sister has improved a little bit, I think.
He remains keenly interested in sports and politics. Still only the one long time friend, and no girl friends. He has expressed an interest, once he saves up the money from work, to pursuing a certificate program to become a fitness trainer. I will try to encourage him, and hope he follows through on that, as I think it would be perfect for him. |
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