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ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 8:17 am

LKL wrote:
wrt the 'Amazing Atheist' referenced above (nsfw language):
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... immolates/


I know that the Amazing Atheist is crude and vulgar, but I occasionally enjoy his perspective on things.

He is a bit like Rush Limbaugh, but for people who aren't right wing nut jobs.

Having said that, I'm sure that I would not sit through a 3-hour radio show put on by the Amazing Atheist if he were to follow in Fatso's footsteps.



ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 8:25 am

TM wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
And how many women would beat the heck out of these other women if they so much as tried because they like a world with available pole? I'm thinking close to 100% minus 'them'.


Fairly close I'm sure. Net discussions have a tendency to bring out the extremist in people.


Did you guys think that was real, and not a joke?

We do castrate pets and farm animals, to make them more docile. A steer is a lot easier to manage than a bull.

Some rapists are sentenced to chemical castration.



TM
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01 May 2012, 8:35 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
And how many women would beat the heck out of these other women if they so much as tried because they like a world with available pole? I'm thinking close to 100% minus 'them'.


Fairly close I'm sure. Net discussions have a tendency to bring out the extremist in people.


Did you guys think that was real, and not a joke?

We do castrate pets and farm animals, to make them more docile. A steer is a lot easier to manage than a bull.

Some rapists are sentenced to chemical castration.


http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum ... 845837/pg1
http://thefemitheist.blogspot.com/2012/ ... yself.html

I see no indication of it being a joke, judging from the fact that I found similar "ideas" on multiple parts of the web. On the other hand, if I were to write a longish post on a blog advocating similar actions towards women, satire or not, I'd most likely be crucified. Especially, if I like her left no indication of it being satire.

Then again, it would hardly be the first time the followers of an ideology have their morals and values f****d up.



ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 9:37 am

TM wrote:
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message845837/pg1
http://thefemitheist.blogspot.com/2012/ ... yself.html

I see no indication of it being a joke, judging from the fact that I found similar "ideas" on multiple parts of the web. On the other hand, if I were to write a longish post on a blog advocating similar actions towards women, satire or not, I'd most likely be crucified. Especially, if I like her left no indication of it being satire.

Then again, it would hardly be the first time the followers of an ideology have their morals and values f**** up.


In that first one, they are just flaming each other.

In the second one: how can you see it as anything other than humour?



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01 May 2012, 9:40 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message845837/pg1
http://thefemitheist.blogspot.com/2012/ ... yself.html

I see no indication of it being a joke, judging from the fact that I found similar "ideas" on multiple parts of the web. On the other hand, if I were to write a longish post on a blog advocating similar actions towards women, satire or not, I'd most likely be crucified. Especially, if I like her left no indication of it being satire.

Then again, it would hardly be the first time the followers of an ideology have their morals and values f**** up.


In that first one, they are just flaming each other.

In the second one: how can you see it as anything other than humour?


How can you see it as humor when she has more posts advocating similar thinking all with no hint of it being humorous. I think the reason why I didn't find it humorous is that it was not funny. Would you see a similar post written about rape as funny?



ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 10:37 am

TM wrote:
How can you see it as humor when she has more posts advocating similar thinking all with no hint of it being humorous.


the article wrote:
Males of all ages will be brought to the public squares of their cities nude, to stand together in a circle, as they await castration by a woman known as "The Castrator", who will be a woman chosen from the public much like a juror. Girls of all ages will attend, lining the streets to cheer and applaud the males as they join the rest of civilized society.


How much of a hint do you need? She obviously isn't seriously advocating this, any more than Hyperlexian was serious about eliminating 99% of males. It is very exaggerated, and I find it hilarious.

TM wrote:
I think the reason why I didn't find it humorous is that it was not funny.

Well, we are each entitled to our own sense of humour. My own sense of humour is similar, and it has got me in trouble before.

TM wrote:
Would you see a similar post written about rape as funny?

I don't know. Possibly. I would have to see it before I decided. One would have to be careful when joking about rape, as being a sensitive topic, and rapes occur every day. Castrations don't.



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01 May 2012, 11:23 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
How can you see it as humor when she has more posts advocating similar thinking all with no hint of it being humorous.


the article wrote:
Males of all ages will be brought to the public squares of their cities nude, to stand together in a circle, as they await castration by a woman known as "The Castrator", who will be a woman chosen from the public much like a juror. Girls of all ages will attend, lining the streets to cheer and applaud the males as they join the rest of civilized society.


How much of a hint do you need? She obviously isn't seriously advocating this, any more than Hyperlexian was serious about eliminating 99% of males. It is very exaggerated, and I find it hilarious.


I rarely find the forced removal of body parts humorous as a part of comedy. The SCUM manifesto was an example of this, and there are plenty more examples of this type of thinking.

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
I think the reason why I didn't find it humorous is that it was not funny.

Well, we are each entitled to our own sense of humour. My own sense of humour is similar, and it has got me in trouble before.

TM wrote:
Would you see a similar post written about rape as funny?

I don't know. Possibly. I would have to see it before I decided. One would have to be careful when joking about rape, as being a sensitive topic, and rapes occur every day. Castrations don't.


How about instead of rape, someone were to write in a similar tone about cutting off a females body parts, then again I'm fairly sure you have a reply ready about FGM and how that happens every day as well. Either some topics are too serious to joke about or they are all fair game, period.

If its wrong for men its wrong for women and vice versa, if a large majority of feminists adopted this position, the religion would be a lot more sensible overnight.



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01 May 2012, 12:30 pm

Terlingua wrote:
Does anyone have any examples as to how feminism helps men? I am not looking for speculative or hypothetical answers, but actual real world examples of feminism helping the other sex. Thanks.


feminism hasnt and never will help men. feminism is only about women and what women can get. even now when things are equal they continue to take take take.


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ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 1:44 pm

TM wrote:
I rarely find the forced removal of body parts humorous as a part of comedy. The SCUM manifesto was an example of this, and there are plenty more examples of this type of thinking.

I'm pretty sure that the Scum Manifesto wasn't intended as humour.

TM wrote:
How about instead of rape, someone were to write in a similar tone about cutting off a females body parts, then again I'm fairly sure you have a reply ready about FGM and how that happens every day as well. Either some topics are too serious to joke about or they are all fair game, period.


Given that a lot of heterosexual men really appreciate feminine body parts, I can't think of a good line of humour that would involve slicing them off.

However, quite a lot of chicks go in for cosmetic surgery: breast augmentation as a high school graduation present; eye-bag tightening at 30; cellulite removal; face lifts; lazer-hair removal, etc. etc. etc. This would be a ripe topic for humour.

Also, possibly jokes about spaying women at menopause--probably bad taste, but maybe it could be done.

TM wrote:
If its wrong for men its wrong for women and vice versa, if a large majority of feminists adopted this position, the religion would be a lot more sensible overnight.


I'm sure that no-one is serious about publicly castrating all men--although castration would have to rank as one of man's greatest fears.



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01 May 2012, 2:09 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
I rarely find the forced removal of body parts humorous as a part of comedy. The SCUM manifesto was an example of this, and there are plenty more examples of this type of thinking.

I'm pretty sure that the Scum Manifesto wasn't intended as humour.


Surprisingly I saw some feminists defend it as satire, even in the wikipedia article.

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
How about instead of rape, someone were to write in a similar tone about cutting off a females body parts, then again I'm fairly sure you have a reply ready about FGM and how that happens every day as well. Either some topics are too serious to joke about or they are all fair game, period.


Given that a lot of heterosexual men really appreciate feminine body parts, I can't think of a good line of humour that would involve slicing them off.

However, quite a lot of chicks go in for cosmetic surgery: breast augmentation as a high school graduation present; eye-bag tightening at 30; cellulite removal; face lifts; lazer-hair removal, etc. etc. etc. This would be a ripe topic for humour.

Also, possibly jokes about spaying women at menopause--probably bad taste, but maybe it could be done.


A: A lot of heterosexual women appreciate men that have testicles and thus are able to get erections.

B: Women voluntarily having surgical procedures is not the same as men forcefully having their testicles cut off.

C: Menopause, really? Yeah, that's the equivalent of cutting a guys balls off.

You are doing a great job showing how people defending your position are completely unable to be objective.

ArrantPariah wrote:
TM wrote:
If its wrong for men its wrong for women and vice versa, if a large majority of feminists adopted this position, the religion would be a lot more sensible overnight.


I'm sure that no-one is serious about publicly castrating all men--although castration would have to rank as one of man's greatest fears.


Oh, not all men, whew, what a relief. So I guess that means some are serious about castrating some men, in the same way that some men are serious about raping someone. Again, I find it hysterical that people that claim to be in favor of equality are the most anti-equality people I know.

If rape is a woman's biggest fear and castration is a man's biggest fear, then its only fair that both should be off limits for jokes/satire/humor regardless of the frequency of occurance for the acts in society at large. Furthermore, if we buy the 60 pages of arguments from the feminist anti-porn lobby, perhaps humor around men being castrated or having their penises cut off leads to that happening.



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01 May 2012, 2:16 pm

Quote:
If rape is a woman's biggest fear and castration is a man's biggest fear, then its only fair that both should be off limits for jokes/satire/humor regardless of the frequency of occurance for the acts in society at large.


i'd say that i am probably more wary of violence than rape, as i have experienced both ("fearful" isn't really a word that applies to me).

regardless, i completely agree that the castration joke went too far, hence why it was removed.


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ArrantPariah
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01 May 2012, 4:06 pm

TM wrote:
Surprisingly I saw some feminists defend it as satire, even in the wikipedia article.

The Scum Manifesto seems to have some serious points. The castration joke didn't.

TM wrote:
A: A lot of heterosexual women appreciate men that have testicles and thus are able to get erections.

One would hope at least.

TM wrote:
B: Women voluntarily having surgical procedures is not the same as men forcefully having their testicles cut off.

One could conceivably produce a joke about girls being forced to have breast augmentation surgery as a requirement for entering high school (along with the usual vaccinations).

TM wrote:
C: Menopause, really? Yeah, that's the equivalent of cutting a guys balls off.

Spaying a woman was the closest equivalent that I could think of. On the other hand, female genital mutilation does happen. Maybe someone made a joke about it, I don't know, but I'm sure that Hyperlexian would spank me if I repeated it here.

TM wrote:
You are doing a great job showing how people defending your position are completely unable to be objective.

Thank you for the great compliment.

TM wrote:
Oh, not all men, whew, what a relief. So I guess that means some are serious about castrating some men, in the same way that some men are serious about raping someone. Again, I find it hysterical that people that claim to be in favor of equality are the most anti-equality people I know.

I could be wrong, but I don't think that anyone is seriously in favour of castrating anyone other than pets, farm animals, and possibly rapists.

TM wrote:
If rape is a woman's biggest fear and castration is a man's biggest fear, then its only fair that both should be off limits for jokes/satire/humor regardless of the frequency of occurance for the acts in society at large.

Well, I know that some people can be sensitive and offended by jokes that others find humourous.

TM wrote:
Furthermore, if we buy the 60 pages of arguments from the feminist anti-porn lobby, perhaps humor around men being castrated or having their penises cut off leads to that happening.

I certainly don't buy the feminist anti-porn arguments.



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01 May 2012, 4:07 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
regardless, i completely agree that the castration joke went too far, hence why it was removed.


Thank you, Mother WP.

:hail:



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01 May 2012, 4:14 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
regardless, i completely agree that the castration joke went too far, hence why it was removed.


Thank you, Mother WP.

:hail:

:P


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03 May 2012, 12:00 am

Another reason that this sort of joke doesn't bite both ways is that Western women (this is a very general statement) are not as attached to their genitals as Western men are. For example, I wouldn't have much of a problem with being spayed if it could be done without increasing my risk for breast cancer or osteoporosis later in life, or changing my libido. A lot of women feel ambivalent even about their breasts because of the unwanted attention they attract (breast reduction surgery isn't unheard of even in women where the size of the girls isn't causing physical problems).



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03 May 2012, 1:23 am

I think the gender roles are pretty arbitrary and childish, nothing against people for whom they fit like a glove but there's no logical reason to be trying to make all these square pegs go into round holes and vice-versa. Who decided that everyone has to be a certain way? The roles are not difficult just for women or homosexuals, being a straight guy isn't all lollipops and rainbows either, there are many demands, many limitations on what you can do and particularly what you're allowed to talk about. Frankly, on the latter point, it can be a little like living in Iran sometimes.

I don't think it's decided much by biology, since it's changed so much over time. In the Classical era, you were a manly man if you wore a skirt, read lots of poetry, and put floral designs on your armour. That was more or less the Rambo of the age. That's Caesar and Alexander the Great and all the rest of them.

So, that part is a big benefit. Less constraint and more freedom for people to be who they are is never a bad thing. But I can't help but feel like the way things are panning out, men will continue to be mostly trapped in their role while women break out from theirs. I think this is the source of alot of resentment towards feminism, even though it's misdirected.