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PenguinMom
Deinonychus
Joined: Oct 31, 2009
Posts: 322
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 Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 7:32 pm Post subject: Seeking advice - skip 1 st grade? |
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Hi,
My 6 year old is just finishing up kindergarten. She is very intelligent, but has some social quirks.
She her reading test scored her at the end of 5th grade, which I believe is as high as that test would go. She reads even better in her special interest areas, which include most of the natural sciences.
She loves math. She's been teaching her self, and her most recent standardized test scored her at about the middle of second grade.
My husband and I have been considering having her skip 1st grade and go straight to second.
Informally, her teachers have commented that she should not skip a grade because of social issues.
She picks her nose. She has pretty stereotypical asperger's type of interaction issues: eye contact, interrupting, laughing at innapropriate times or not laughing when her peers do. She has difficulty making friends, but there are several students in the class whom she considers friends. The teachers feel it would be better to giver her more time with these "friends" to develop lasting bonds and work on social issues.
She doesn't like school and doesn't want to go. She says school interferes with her schedule, and since she learns more from books school interrupts her reading time.
My husband and I feel that she will be more motivated to make friends if she is in an upper grade where she can talk to the student's about her books she's reading and things she is interested in. Outside of school she would much rather seek out play dates with older children than people her own age. We also want to work harder on teaching her social skills and social strategies. Other than attending a weekly luncheon with the social worker, there are no social skills programs available at the school for people her age.
We have a lot of respect for these teachers who know her well and have worked hard with her all year. Right now I'm looking to gather as many opinions as possible so that we can make the most informed decision.
Any ideas - advice - comments - etc. is welcome!
_________________
I am not an expert on anything. Any advice given is with the best of intentions; a small way for me to repay a community that helps me when I need it. |
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SC_2010
Deinonychus
Joined: Apr 18, 2010
Posts: 334
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| She is going to be bored out of her mind in first grade! If she hates it I highly doubt she is going to want to put the effort into making friends and such when she doesn't even want to be there. Is there any way she can split between 1st and 2nd? |
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ThinkTrees
Sea Gull
Joined: Apr 06, 2012
Posts: 218
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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You make a very good point about her being naturally more motivated to be social if her interest is on a par with those around her.
This is hugely important, far more so than age groups.
Many Aspies will be asocial in general, yet seem to be extroverts when their interest is engaged.
Information is a motivator, a carrot you can employ to help her in the right direction.
_________________
AS 169/200
NT 23/200
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CSBurks
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 30, 2012
Posts: 657
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Skip. |
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hoegaandit
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| I can see the arguments for skipping but on balance would side with the teachers. I know one highly intelligent girl (clearly ASD) who was kept back a year by her skilful parents, because of social development issues. Then, she left school a year early to go to university where she has had outstanding academic results. |
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Eureka-C
Velociraptor
Joined: Sep 12, 2011
Age: 40
Posts: 495
Location: DallasTexas, USA
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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she sounds like she is far enough above her peers to require a specialized education "highly gifted." It sounds like she is far above the 2nd grade students as well. So she has a double whammy for social awkwardness, with the AS and with the mind that is not thinking on the same level as her peers. She will likely best socialize with chosen groups of varied age people who can interact with her special interests and on her intellectual level. These "peers" will not likely be her age or even near her age.
Hoagies website has lots of information. Here is their page on accelerated learning
http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/acceleration.htm |
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luna12
Butterfly
Joined: Oct 16, 2009
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 12:57 am Post subject: |
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Having two grown children w/ ASD, I don't think she should skip a grade IMHO I understand your rationale and logically it makes sense; however you are overlooking critical obstacles. Socially she is at a huge disadvantage-were talking about 8 yr old girls who will not willingly hang out with a 6 yr old, these girls have already been with each other for almost 3 yrs. I would not assume that those children will have the same interest and ability as she does. It's a mistake to think her academic ability will give her social ability. All learning, including social skills, come from building on constant repetition in linked experiences. What that means is that she should stay with her same peer group, work on her skills with kids who already "know" how she is, attend the same after school programs that her peers do and hopefully attend get togethers and if she doesn't get invited then you be the hosting house for sleepovers and parties.
The ability to decode above and beyond the appropriate developmental age is called Hyperlexia, it's a parlor trick at best. My son has/had Hyperlexia-it doesn't mean anything long term. He taught himself to read at age 3, tested high and that's it. It has nothing to do with comprehension, especially in subject matter that is not about their chosen interest.
She can have her own adapted curriculum which will challenge her skills and be given 3rd science in 1st grade-if that's what she needs. Remember, up until 3rd grade it's all rote learning (btw I am not a teacher-not a fan of them either). After that she will need to demonstrate critical thinking, insight, infer meaning all the while being expected to execute executive functioning. None of those things have anything to do with being able to read better and include her chosen interests. If she needs more challenge in those nature activities then she should be taken to lectures and walking tours, even if you have to drive there. In those circles she can be a superstar with her knowledge and converse intelligently with adults or college groups. Giving her the opportunity to shine in these groups will boost her self esteem and confidence. When she is successful within science and nature circles then that gives her the "linked experiences" to school social circles.
The best advice I ever heard was "don't let ASD be the parent, don't cater to it and don't let it dictate your parenting".
The children we have and the life that we have been given doesn't do well by leaping ahead, this is a slow and steady thing. A great deal of children with Aspergers have higher academic abilities, so it's a natural thing to consider skipping a grade. I'm sure that the number you wind up with of kids who have successfully skipped will be very helpful. |
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DW_a_mom
Ignoring the To-Do List
Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 9298
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 1:02 am Post subject: |
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From what I've seen and been told, skipping grades brings on a whole new set of issues Curriculum is missed, certain building blocks never learned, and most advanced reading that exits in K evens out before middle school, leaving the developmental issues like organizational skills front and center, and most Aspie kids lag behind developmentally on organizational skills. My AS son nearly withered under the organizational demands of middle school even though he knew all the material ... you would be setting your daughter up for constant struggles in that area.
My very smart NT daughter suffered all through elementary school as the result of being one of the youngest in her class and never being able to meet the maturity required each fall in order to succeed under the increased organizational expectations. This year was the first time she started a school year with enough maturity to handle what was expected of her without breaking down.
Kids fail or excel in school more on maturity and organization than intelligence or reading ability. Kids can FAIL a class in which they get 100% on every test because of the organizational issues. You can't skip around her maturity.
All that said, there are kids who can move move faster, but they don't do it by skipping grades in a traditional school system. You need something more individualized if she really is off-the-scales bright. Not just smart, not just gifted, but off-the-scales, and it will take more than advanced reading to have that. I've got gifted kids, and I know a couple of highly gifted kids, but I don't personally know any of the off-the-scale, finish college by 15, ones, so I don't know what it takes to move those kids through the curriculum.
I do know two skip kids, but neither were Aspies. They both struggle socially. I know a child who was reading Harry Potter in K, but she never skipped, and has never wished she had. Instead, her teachers let her do independent study as appropriate, and found other creative ways to keep her engaged. That can work beautifully.
School is about so much more than the academics.
_________________
Mom to an amazing AS boy (plus a non-AS daughter). Have at least a few AS genes myself, although probably more NT than AS.
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Think of the greening of my name as an emeritus thing; I used to be a moderator but am retired and have no authority to act |
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Eureka-C
Velociraptor
Joined: Sep 12, 2011
Age: 40
Posts: 495
Location: DallasTexas, USA
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 1:50 am Post subject: |
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Thank you DW, you said it so much better than I did.
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MMJMOM
Phoenix
Joined: May 22, 2011
Posts: 616
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 5:28 am Post subject: |
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I chose to homeschool my son for some of these very reasons. My son is 6, he is a good 2 1/2 grade levels in math ahead of his peers, I dont know what his reading level is but he hasnt met a book he cant read, He is reading early chapter books, so Id guess at least 3rd grade level, his spelling is a grade ahead, pretty much every subject area is at least one full grade but most are more ahead of his peers. Yet, he is socially and emotionally behind his peers.
Thru homeschooling, I can teach him at his pace (which is fast), and to his interests. We belong to many local homeschool groups, and he has a nice amount of friends and TONS of activities that keep him socially engaged.
I am not sure if skipping is really going to help her if she is even ahead of the grade she would enter, and those kids willl be even more socially advanced....tough situation, good luck!
_________________
Dara, mom to my beautiful kids:
Jayden 7, diagnosed Aspergers and ADHD possible learning disability due to porcessing speed, born with a cleft lip and palate.
Miranda 4
Maya, who would be 5, my forever angel baby
Ethan, new to the world! |
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hoegaandit
Pileated woodpecker
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:12 am Post subject: |
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| I'm not sure how our school system does it exactly, but in the early years they effectively streamed my NT daughter up a year (not my request) because she was both intellectually and socially able, and she was mostly ok with that, topping her class academically on occasion but I think she might have been happier in high school if she had been kept with her normal age group. There were some bitchy girls in her girls only high school and her grades slipped some when she was not so happy. She has since blossomed at University. School can be the best of places or one of the worst of places if there are social difficulties. As others have posted there are other ways to keep up stimulation for intellectually able kids without necessarily moving them up a grade. |
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PenguinMom
Deinonychus
Joined: Oct 31, 2009
Posts: 322
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks everyone for your replies.
We are taking all of the pros and cons under considering.
Currently, we are thinking that, at the younger grades, much of school centers around organization and socialization, which are her week points. Thus, it would be better to keep her with her age group until she can catch up in those areas. We can always supplement her academics at home.
I am especially grateful to the person who linked to the Hoagies site. It looks like I'll be spending the better part of my summer with some of the resources they provide.
Keep any questions, comments, suggestions coming. I'd be very interested to hear the perspective of people whose parents made the choice to skip a grade. How did it affect you?
_________________
I am not an expert on anything. Any advice given is with the best of intentions; a small way for me to repay a community that helps me when I need it. |
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ConfusedNewb
Deinonychus
Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 340
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - skip 1 st grade? |
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| PenguinMom wrote: | | She says school interferes with her schedule |
I love it! Sorry I cant be of much help but that bit just made me smile!
I have a 4yo daughter, no diagnosis but Im checking out this forum as she is being seen by the child development centre and I strongly suspect and ASD of some sort. Regardless of any diagnosis we are sending her to a private school as we believe this will greatly benefit her. They have no formal curriculum and have a lot more freedom, time and resources. They also have pupils there with ASDs and they have gifted children so she wont be the odd one out. We are fortunate enough to be able to do this, although it might mean no luxuries for some years!
Sounds like a tough decision, pros and cons for both options. Maybe a trial run where she could try moving for a term but has the option to move back? Depends how she deals with changes I suppose! Good luck, hope you sort something out for her that you are all happy with. |
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Tollorin
Lazy Cat
Joined: Jun 15, 2009
Age: 31
Posts: 1634
Location: Sherbrooke,Québec, Canada
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Bombaloo
Phoenix
Joined: Apr 01, 2010
Posts: 1396
Location: Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 6:28 pm Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - skip 1 st grade? |
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| ConfusedNewb wrote: | | I have a 4yo daughter, no diagnosis but Im checking out this forum as she is being seen by the child development centre and I strongly suspect and ASD of some sort. Regardless of any diagnosis we are sending her to a private school as we believe this will greatly benefit her. They have no formal curriculum and have a lot more freedom, time and resources. They also have pupils there with ASDs and they have gifted children so she wont be the odd one out. We are fortunate enough to be able to do this, although it might mean no luxuries for some years! |
The one thing that many private schools lack are staff members who are specialists in special ed including occupational and speech therapists. We currently have an application in for a private school somewhat like you described but even if we do get offered a space, I am still on the fence because at least at public school my DS (6 yo BTW) is getting services from the special ed teacher, the OT, the school counselor and the ST. I only bring this up because it was something I hadn't thought too much about until someone pointed it out to me and I think it is something to consider. Sooooo many tough decisions we have to make  Wish I hadn't lost my Mom manual... |
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